Jan 25, 2017, 11:54 am
Last edit by: JDiver
AA IFE Free WiFi Streaming to App on Personal Devices
AA announced on 24 Jan 2017 that, as 90% of passengers are flying with personal devices with screens capable of WiFi use, free WiFi streaming of music and movies in some domestic / narrowbody aircraft mid-2016. This streaming is currently available on a subset of AA aircraft, and is being expanded.
As of the new Boeing 737 MAX aircraft due to arrive in 2017, seatback IFE will be substituted by free, streaming high-quality movies and music from an on board server.
As well, much of AA current GoGo based WiFi internet (using cellular telephony technology) will change to (paid) ViaSat satellite Ku band WiFi internet providing access speedy enough it will allow video streaming. This transition will be finished in 2019.
Both will be available from gate to gate.
Seatback IFE monitors will be retained on
- Airbus A321T three Class aircraft
- Airbus A330
- Airbus A350
- Boeing 777
- Boeing 787
"Other key things to remember:
- This year we take delivery of 40 current-generation Boeing 737 and Airbus A321 aircraft. They will arrive with seatback monitors and power at every seat
- By the summer of 2018 we will have completed installation of the faster satellite-based Wi-Fi on half of our narrowbodies, with all of them done by the end of 2019
- We expect 50 percent of our domestic narrowbody aircraft to be equipped with power at every seat by the end of 2018, and over 85 percent equipped by the end of 2020"
Free WiFi Streaming IFE on Personal Devices (with App) 08/2016, expansion
Jan 25, 2017, 6:18 am
#76
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: NYC, SLC, LAX
Programs: AA EXP, UA Plat
Posts: 3,951
I don't know why you need to point out "lose". If you love AA offering less, you can stick with AA.
There is a physical limit to bandwidth that an aircraft can supply via satellite link. If 150 passengers are trying to watch movies on their phone at the same time, whether or not the aircraft can physically supply that is hard to say. I've been on been enough flights where wifi is just not working for some reason or the signal is weak.
Think about it this way, if everyone is watching the same TV channels, the aircraft can simply broadcast the signals out to every receiving device. But since delivery over on board wifi is via unicast. Each additional receiver requires a tcp or unicast udp connection to the single transmitting source and then transmitting different packets for different channels. There is a physical limit to what that transmitting source can send out. That limit is decreased when the weather condition is really bad outside. When everyone is trying to watch movie at the same time, does that hit the limit of what the transmitter can supply at that time? What if the transmitter is having problems?
And all of this assumes that I trust the security of connecting my phone to aircraft wifi network.
There is a physical limit to bandwidth that an aircraft can supply via satellite link. If 150 passengers are trying to watch movies on their phone at the same time, whether or not the aircraft can physically supply that is hard to say. I've been on been enough flights where wifi is just not working for some reason or the signal is weak.
Think about it this way, if everyone is watching the same TV channels, the aircraft can simply broadcast the signals out to every receiving device. But since delivery over on board wifi is via unicast. Each additional receiver requires a tcp or unicast udp connection to the single transmitting source and then transmitting different packets for different channels. There is a physical limit to what that transmitting source can send out. That limit is decreased when the weather condition is really bad outside. When everyone is trying to watch movie at the same time, does that hit the limit of what the transmitter can supply at that time? What if the transmitter is having problems?
And all of this assumes that I trust the security of connecting my phone to aircraft wifi network.
Jan 25, 2017, 7:09 am
#77
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: QDF
Programs: AA EXP (2MM), Marriott Tit
Posts: 1,038
I think you might be getting slightly confused. Yes the Wifi sucks and you aren't able to stream things like Netflix. but they do have an in-flight system that is streaming from the airplane but doesn't have bandwidth issues I think because the data/movies are actually stored on the plane.
W00t!?
Jan 25, 2017, 8:09 am
#78
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Maryland
Programs: DL-Diamond, Marriott Titanium
Posts: 459
Getting rid of Seatback and only offering streaming when a competitor consistently offers both for free
This and the fact AA basically matched UAs "Basic Economy" plan make me wonder, Are they resigned to competing primarily with UA?
Will DL continue to eek out incremental amenity advantages to the point they get better yields?
DL currently has the following things AA and UA don't, or soon will not
1. Free seat back IFE AND Streaming to personal device
2. Free Liquor in long haul Economy
3. Basic economy still includes FREE carry on in Overhead
4. All Aisle access in J on all Wide body long haul (for now)
If DL added free Wi-Fi to this, even just for premium cabins they would run away with it
This and the fact AA basically matched UAs "Basic Economy" plan make me wonder, Are they resigned to competing primarily with UA?
Will DL continue to eek out incremental amenity advantages to the point they get better yields?
DL currently has the following things AA and UA don't, or soon will not
1. Free seat back IFE AND Streaming to personal device
2. Free Liquor in long haul Economy
3. Basic economy still includes FREE carry on in Overhead
4. All Aisle access in J on all Wide body long haul (for now)
If DL added free Wi-Fi to this, even just for premium cabins they would run away with it
Jan 25, 2017, 8:11 am
#79
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Maryland
Programs: DL-Diamond, Marriott Titanium
Posts: 459
Another issue with streaming,
If an Airline APP is needed to stream IFE, and announcements are not made or heard to download or update b4 boarding, or passengers device is not compatible with app...Streaming becomes useless
If an Airline APP is needed to stream IFE, and announcements are not made or heard to download or update b4 boarding, or passengers device is not compatible with app...Streaming becomes useless
Jan 25, 2017, 8:14 am
#80
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: DCA
Programs: AS MVP Gold 75K
Posts: 947
Once last year, I dragged my otherwise unused Android-based tablet on a transcontinental, tried to use the wifi-based IFE, and couldn't connect.
Which is one of the reasons why I'm not liking the announcement that seatback AVOD Ice is going the way of the 727.
Jan 25, 2017, 8:56 am
#81
Suspended
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: FIND ME ON TWITTER FOR THE LATEST
Posts: 27,730
Getting rid of Seatback and only offering streaming when a competitor consistently offers both for free
This and the fact AA basically matched UAs "Basic Economy" plan make me wonder, Are they resigned to competing primarily with UA?
Will DL continue to eek out incremental amenity advantages to the point they get better yields?
DL currently has the following things AA and UA don't, or soon will not
1. Free seat back IFE AND Streaming to personal device
2. Free Liquor in long haul Economy
3. Basic economy still includes FREE carry on in Overhead
4. All Aisle access in J on all Wide body long haul (for now)
If DL added free Wi-Fi to this, even just for premium cabins they would run away with it
This and the fact AA basically matched UAs "Basic Economy" plan make me wonder, Are they resigned to competing primarily with UA?
Will DL continue to eek out incremental amenity advantages to the point they get better yields?
DL currently has the following things AA and UA don't, or soon will not
1. Free seat back IFE AND Streaming to personal device
2. Free Liquor in long haul Economy
3. Basic economy still includes FREE carry on in Overhead
4. All Aisle access in J on all Wide body long haul (for now)
If DL added free Wi-Fi to this, even just for premium cabins they would run away with it
Ha! Yeah, not a bad point!
Jan 25, 2017, 9:03 am
#82
Moderator: American AAdvantage
Join Date: May 2000
Location: NorCal - SMF area
Programs: AA LT Plat; HH LT Diamond, Maître-plongeur des Muccis
Posts: 62,948
There seems to be some confusion in this thread about onboard movie and music streaming.
Onboard movie and music streaming is from an on board server.
Internet access will be from the ViaSat Ka band WiFi system.
These operate independently of each other.
Onboard movie and music streaming is from an on board server.
Internet access will be from the ViaSat Ka band WiFi system.
These operate independently of each other.
Jan 25, 2017, 9:09 am
#83
Join Date: Dec 2016
Posts: 1,485
If 150 people are watching videos relying on 3 mbps for good quality video, then the aircraft better be able to reliably transmit at least 450 mbps.
Jan 25, 2017, 9:35 am
#84
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: BOS/DEN/BUR
Programs: DL Gold, UA Gold, B6 Mosaic, Marriott Gold
Posts: 744
Thats a shame, Delta is the only one adding screens anymore, I hope that AA will at least how power. Although I do have a device to stream, I would rather use screens, just for easy access. I made a list of the US 3 and the PTV fleet.
Delta Aircrafts with Personal TV's
- A319 (46/57)
- A320 (First aircraft to go into mods Q1 17) some are being retired w/o IFE but WITH ISP.
- A321 (Being delivered with AVOD)
- A330 (AVOD)
- B737-700 (AVOD)
- B737-800 (SAT TV + AVOD) 1 left w/o
- B737-900 (SAT TV + AVOD)
- B757-200 (SAT-TV + AVOD) 13 left w/o
- B757-300 (SAT-TV + AVOD)
- B767-300 (SAT-TV + AVOD)
- B767-300ER + B767-400ER (AVOD)
- B747-400 (AVOD)
- B777 (AVOD)
word has it the the MD90s are being considered for AVOD again. They use IAE V2500 engines (A320 family, still produced) and are used for some 3+ hour flights + some of the youngest birds are only 16-17 years old.
United Aircrafts with Personal TV's
- B737-700 (Almost all with SAT-TV)
- B737-800 (some with SAT-TV)
- B737-900/ER (Some with SAT-TV)
- B757-200 (AVOD)
- B757-300 (1/2 with SAT-TV)
- B767-300ER/400ER (AVOD)
- B777-200ER (AVOD)
- B787-8/9 (AVOD)
- B747-400 (AVOD F/J)
American Aircrafts with Personal TV's
- PMAA A319 (AVOD)
- PMAA A321 (T/H/S) (AVOD)
- PMAA INTL B757 (AVOD J ONLY)
- PMAA B737-800 (N939NN and above)
- PMAA B777/787 (AVOD and some SAT-TV)
- PMUS A330 (AVOD)
Delta Aircrafts with Personal TV's
- A319 (46/57)
- A320 (First aircraft to go into mods Q1 17) some are being retired w/o IFE but WITH ISP.
- A321 (Being delivered with AVOD)
- A330 (AVOD)
- B737-700 (AVOD)
- B737-800 (SAT TV + AVOD) 1 left w/o
- B737-900 (SAT TV + AVOD)
- B757-200 (SAT-TV + AVOD) 13 left w/o
- B757-300 (SAT-TV + AVOD)
- B767-300 (SAT-TV + AVOD)
- B767-300ER + B767-400ER (AVOD)
- B747-400 (AVOD)
- B777 (AVOD)
word has it the the MD90s are being considered for AVOD again. They use IAE V2500 engines (A320 family, still produced) and are used for some 3+ hour flights + some of the youngest birds are only 16-17 years old.
United Aircrafts with Personal TV's
- B737-700 (Almost all with SAT-TV)
- B737-800 (some with SAT-TV)
- B737-900/ER (Some with SAT-TV)
- B757-200 (AVOD)
- B757-300 (1/2 with SAT-TV)
- B767-300ER/400ER (AVOD)
- B777-200ER (AVOD)
- B787-8/9 (AVOD)
- B747-400 (AVOD F/J)
American Aircrafts with Personal TV's
- PMAA A319 (AVOD)
- PMAA A321 (T/H/S) (AVOD)
- PMAA INTL B757 (AVOD J ONLY)
- PMAA B737-800 (N939NN and above)
- PMAA B777/787 (AVOD and some SAT-TV)
- PMUS A330 (AVOD)
Jan 25, 2017, 11:28 am
#86
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Philadephia, PA
Programs: AA Platinum, Marriott Titanium/Lifetime Titanium, Hyatt Globalist, UA Silver, Hilton Gold, Hertz 5*
Posts: 477
The transmitter or router on the aircraft itself has a bandwidth capacity to what it could transmit since it's not broadcasting, which would be far more subject to bad weather conditions than wired connections.
If 150 people are watching videos relying on 3 mbps for good quality video, then the aircraft better be able to reliably transmit at least 450 mbps.
If 150 people are watching videos relying on 3 mbps for good quality video, then the aircraft better be able to reliably transmit at least 450 mbps.
Jan 25, 2017, 11:32 am
#87
Moderator: American AAdvantage
Join Date: May 2000
Location: NorCal - SMF area
Programs: AA LT Plat; HH LT Diamond, Maître-plongeur des Muccis
Posts: 62,948
A reminder, as this broader discussion has been moved from the 737 MAX thread to this thread:
AA press release, as quoted by Runway Girl Network (link) 24 Jan 2017:
"We know in-flight entertainment is important to our customers, which is why we’ve committed to offering free, streaming high-quality movies and music, and to investing in fast satellite-based Internet access and power at every seat across our domestic fleet.
Entertainment and connection options like these are the future of in-flight entertainment, which is why we’ve decided that our new Boeing 737 MAX will arrive later this year without seatback video screens.
More than 90 percent of our passengers already bring a device or screen with them when they fly. Those phones and tablets are continually upgraded, they’re easy to use, and most importantly they are the technology that our customers have chosen. So it makes sense for American to focus on giving customers the best entertainment and fast connection options rather than installing seatback monitors that will be obsolete within a few years.
Every customer with a phone, tablet or laptop will be able to watch free movies and TV shows from our extensive on-board library, as well as free live television channels, all without purchasing an in-flight Internet connection.
For those who want to pay to get online, the high-speed, satellite-based Internet access* we are installing on the MAX and other aircraft is so fast that everyone on the plane can stream Netflix, Amazon, and other video-on-demand, as well as text and surf the web over a connection that’s just as fast as what they have in their homes.
Both our free streaming library as well as satellite Internet connections will work from gate-to-gate.
While streaming entertainment is an increasingly good option for domestic flights, seat-back screens will continue to be important to customers flying internationally. Our widebodies will continue to have seatback screens, and some of our narrowbodies used for specific flights will also keep their seatback screens. We’ll keep seatback monitors on Boeing 777s, 787s, Airbus A330s, and our A350s, which begin arriving next year. We’re also committed to seat-back screens on our three-class A321s.
Other key things to remember:
"We know in-flight entertainment is important to our customers, which is why we’ve committed to offering free, streaming high-quality movies and music, and to investing in fast satellite-based Internet access and power at every seat across our domestic fleet.
Entertainment and connection options like these are the future of in-flight entertainment, which is why we’ve decided that our new Boeing 737 MAX will arrive later this year without seatback video screens.
More than 90 percent of our passengers already bring a device or screen with them when they fly. Those phones and tablets are continually upgraded, they’re easy to use, and most importantly they are the technology that our customers have chosen. So it makes sense for American to focus on giving customers the best entertainment and fast connection options rather than installing seatback monitors that will be obsolete within a few years.
Every customer with a phone, tablet or laptop will be able to watch free movies and TV shows from our extensive on-board library, as well as free live television channels, all without purchasing an in-flight Internet connection.
For those who want to pay to get online, the high-speed, satellite-based Internet access* we are installing on the MAX and other aircraft is so fast that everyone on the plane can stream Netflix, Amazon, and other video-on-demand, as well as text and surf the web over a connection that’s just as fast as what they have in their homes.
Both our free streaming library as well as satellite Internet connections will work from gate-to-gate.
While streaming entertainment is an increasingly good option for domestic flights, seat-back screens will continue to be important to customers flying internationally. Our widebodies will continue to have seatback screens, and some of our narrowbodies used for specific flights will also keep their seatback screens. We’ll keep seatback monitors on Boeing 777s, 787s, Airbus A330s, and our A350s, which begin arriving next year. We’re also committed to seat-back screens on our three-class A321s.
Other key things to remember:
This year we take delivery of 40 current-generation Boeing 737 and Airbus A321 aircraft. They will arrive with seatback monitors and power at every seat
By the summer of 2018 we will have completed installation of the faster satellite-based Wi-Fi on half of our narrowbodies, with all of them done by the end of 2019
We expect 50 percent of our domestic narrowbody aircraft to be equipped with power at every seat by the end of 2018, and over 85 percent equipped by the end of 2020
*ViaSat Ka band internet (streaming music and movies via onboard server, independently from ViaSat internet)By the summer of 2018 we will have completed installation of the faster satellite-based Wi-Fi on half of our narrowbodies, with all of them done by the end of 2019
We expect 50 percent of our domestic narrowbody aircraft to be equipped with power at every seat by the end of 2018, and over 85 percent equipped by the end of 2020
Jan 25, 2017, 11:48 am
#88
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 23,057
Pretty sure all the DL refurbed aircraft do not have separate boxes for IFE (electronics are integrated in the screen back). I think the only ones left with the boxes are the 763's.
Jan 25, 2017, 12:10 pm
#89
Join Date: May 2014
Location: DMV
Posts: 2,092
I always thought that a good IFE is a really genius and not that expensive way of giving pax a 'wow' feeling when they get on a plane even if the seat pitch is crap, the slimline seats hard and narrow and everything costs extra. Now it looks like AA doesn't even want to give pax that reason to be joyful.
I mean, yes, it saves AA money and yes a lot of people like to bring their own devices and stream stuff on it. But I dare to say that's not a majority. 90% of people may have some sort of device on them but they probably don't want to hold their phone for 2 hours to watch a movie on a pretty small screen.
It sometimes feels like AA is trying hard for the prize of being the blandest, most mediocre airline in the world. I don't think it's terrible but they just don't seem to really have any eagerness to impress customers. Do they think this allows them to shave off an extra 20$ of the ticket price to get up there near Spirit for the super price conscious traveler?
I mean, yes, it saves AA money and yes a lot of people like to bring their own devices and stream stuff on it. But I dare to say that's not a majority. 90% of people may have some sort of device on them but they probably don't want to hold their phone for 2 hours to watch a movie on a pretty small screen.
It sometimes feels like AA is trying hard for the prize of being the blandest, most mediocre airline in the world. I don't think it's terrible but they just don't seem to really have any eagerness to impress customers. Do they think this allows them to shave off an extra 20$ of the ticket price to get up there near Spirit for the super price conscious traveler?
Jan 25, 2017, 2:08 pm
#90
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 44,600
The screen size on my laptop is far larger than anything I have seen in economy class. There are some decent IFE systems ( such as EK in 1st class and even business class ) but in general, my laptop wins every time
no one is going to be "wowed" by a small seat back video these days - I would suspect that having a streamed system is more likely to be of an unexpected "wow" thing
no one is going to be "wowed" by a small seat back video these days - I would suspect that having a streamed system is more likely to be of an unexpected "wow" thing