ARCHIVE: oneworld / Explorer Awards Using AA Miles info
Jan 17, 2010, 1:09 pm
#1711
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Redwood City, CA (i.e. SFO/SJC/OAK)
Programs: AAdvantage 1MM+ GOLD, SkyMiles
Posts: 143
Viewing Cathay's legs of an OW award online?
How can I go about viewing online details of a segment operated by CX? I got Cathay Pacific's 5-character Booking Reference Number from the AA agent but, had no luck using it here:
http://www.cathaypacific.com/cpa/en_...anagemybooking
Some posts over on the Asia Miles thread suggested entering "<first name> <middle name if any> MR" and other such permutations in the "Given Name" field but, that didn't work either.
Any suggestions or experience with this? Thanks in advance!
http://www.cathaypacific.com/cpa/en_...anagemybooking
Some posts over on the Asia Miles thread suggested entering "<first name> <middle name if any> MR" and other such permutations in the "Given Name" field but, that didn't work either.
Any suggestions or experience with this? Thanks in advance!
Jan 17, 2010, 7:13 pm
#1712
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Florida
Posts: 29,767
How can I go about viewing online details of a segment operated by CX? I got Cathay Pacific's 5-character Booking Reference Number from the AA agent but, had no luck using it here:
http://www.cathaypacific.com/cpa/en_...anagemybooking
Some posts over on the Asia Miles thread suggested entering "<first name> <middle name if any> MR" and other such permutations in the "Given Name" field but, that didn't work either.
Any suggestions or experience with this? Thanks in advance!
http://www.cathaypacific.com/cpa/en_...anagemybooking
Some posts over on the Asia Miles thread suggested entering "<first name> <middle name if any> MR" and other such permutations in the "Given Name" field but, that didn't work either.
Any suggestions or experience with this? Thanks in advance!
In fact any partner flight changes, even just for a 5 minutes schedule change, would make your award reservation disappear, because a new e-ticket must be re-issued.
Our last OneWorld award had over 14 or 15 involuntary changes that I was almost afraid to check my reservation for fear of that RED message! I learned to bundle several schedule changes together before calling AA to take care of the re-issuance - because both JL & QF let you monitor your reservations so I could check from theirs.
Jan 19, 2010, 7:57 pm
#1713
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Pittsburgh
Programs: Whoever Has the Best Bonus
Posts: 5,183
So, AA screwed me. I booked two biz class reservations OW130C, the agent said they were fine and ticketed. I booked the later LHR-JFK-PIT flights -- and PIT-JFK was the next day since the LHR-JFK flight arrived after the last PIT-JFK flight. No problem right, next available flight. AA.com prices this as a regular one-way award.
Turns out the first AAgent (and the second) had this wrong, and if you don't take the two flights closest to each other (ie in my case, the LAST flight of the day LHR-JFK and then the first flight the next day) it counts as a stop over. Since the LAST flight of the day was not available in business, and the flight early on enough to make the same-day connection was not available, there was simply NO flights available at all.
Of course, what ticks me off is two agents told me it was fine, said they ticketed it, and it showed as ticketed online. Only after I got concerned I only was charged for one ticket (miles and fees) and I called did an agent look up the rules. Then they wanted to charge me a REDEPOSIT FEE for the first ticket (that went through). Ridiculous. The only credit I can give AA is that they supposedly tried (on hold for 30 minutes) to get award availability on the flights, but I'm sure revenue management said 'screw you', and then they authorized the full refund/redeposit for no fee.
I had spent a whole day looking for flights, and found something on everyone except AA transatlantic (for two biz). My lesson learned -- find the BA flight to YYZ on qantas.com for two (limited availability, but usually at least once a week) and then build the rest of the schedule around that.
To clarify, this was my second stopover in JFK (I had to stop on the way out, same thing, poorly timed AA flights) and oneworld doesn't allow two stopovers in same city in US
Turns out the first AAgent (and the second) had this wrong, and if you don't take the two flights closest to each other (ie in my case, the LAST flight of the day LHR-JFK and then the first flight the next day) it counts as a stop over. Since the LAST flight of the day was not available in business, and the flight early on enough to make the same-day connection was not available, there was simply NO flights available at all.
Of course, what ticks me off is two agents told me it was fine, said they ticketed it, and it showed as ticketed online. Only after I got concerned I only was charged for one ticket (miles and fees) and I called did an agent look up the rules. Then they wanted to charge me a REDEPOSIT FEE for the first ticket (that went through). Ridiculous. The only credit I can give AA is that they supposedly tried (on hold for 30 minutes) to get award availability on the flights, but I'm sure revenue management said 'screw you', and then they authorized the full refund/redeposit for no fee.
I had spent a whole day looking for flights, and found something on everyone except AA transatlantic (for two biz). My lesson learned -- find the BA flight to YYZ on qantas.com for two (limited availability, but usually at least once a week) and then build the rest of the schedule around that.
To clarify, this was my second stopover in JFK (I had to stop on the way out, same thing, poorly timed AA flights) and oneworld doesn't allow two stopovers in same city in US
Jan 20, 2010, 12:01 am
#1714
Suspended
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 4,861
I booked the later LHR-JFK-PIT flights -- and PIT-JFK was the next day since the LHR-JFK flight arrived after the last PIT-JFK flight. No problem right, next available flight. AA.com prices this as a regular one-way award.
Turns out the first AAgent (and the second) had this wrong, and if you don't take the two flights closest to each other (ie in my case, the LAST flight of the day LHR-JFK and then the first flight the next day) it counts as a stop over. Since the LAST flight of the day was not available in business, and the flight early on enough to make the same-day connection was not available, there was simply NO flights available at all.
To clarify, this was my second stopover in JFK (I had to stop on the way out, same thing, poorly timed AA flights) and oneworld doesn't allow two stopovers in same city in US
Turns out the first AAgent (and the second) had this wrong, and if you don't take the two flights closest to each other (ie in my case, the LAST flight of the day LHR-JFK and then the first flight the next day) it counts as a stop over. Since the LAST flight of the day was not available in business, and the flight early on enough to make the same-day connection was not available, there was simply NO flights available at all.
To clarify, this was my second stopover in JFK (I had to stop on the way out, same thing, poorly timed AA flights) and oneworld doesn't allow two stopovers in same city in US
Jan 20, 2010, 1:42 am
#1715
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: PIT/DFW/MEL; AA Exec. Platinum & 4MM, QF WP
Posts: 7,689
So, AA screwed me. I booked two biz class reservations OW130C, the agent said they were fine and ticketed. I booked the later LHR-JFK-PIT flights -- and PIT-JFK was the next day since the LHR-JFK flight arrived after the last PIT-JFK flight. No problem right, next available flight. AA.com prices this as a regular one-way award
For oneworld awards, the 6-hour rule applies if there exists any legal same-day connection, whether or not award seats are availble. LIFO is the only way around that. Sorry it didn't work out for you!
Jan 20, 2010, 4:10 am
#1716
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: SFO/OAK/SJC
Programs: AA LT PLT, 2.15 million miles; Priority Club PLT
Posts: 987
First Middle Last
Jan 20, 2010, 7:57 am
#1718
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Hopefully on a plane...
Posts: 6,580
So, AA screwed me. I booked two biz class reservations OW130C, the agent said they were fine and ticketed. I booked the later LHR-JFK-PIT flights -- and PIT-JFK was the next day since the LHR-JFK flight arrived after the last PIT-JFK flight. No problem right, next available flight. AA.com prices this as a regular one-way award.
Turns out the first AAgent (and the second) had this wrong, and if you don't take the two flights closest to each other (ie in my case, the LAST flight of the day LHR-JFK and then the first flight the next day) it counts as a stop over. Since the LAST flight of the day was not available in business, and the flight early on enough to make the same-day connection was not available, there was simply NO flights available at all.
Of course, what ticks me off is two agents told me it was fine, said they ticketed it, and it showed as ticketed online. Only after I got concerned I only was charged for one ticket (miles and fees) and I called did an agent look up the rules. Then they wanted to charge me a REDEPOSIT FEE for the first ticket (that went through). Ridiculous. The only credit I can give AA is that they supposedly tried (on hold for 30 minutes) to get award availability on the flights, but I'm sure revenue management said 'screw you', and then they authorized the full refund/redeposit for no fee.
I had spent a whole day looking for flights, and found something on everyone except AA transatlantic (for two biz). My lesson learned -- find the BA flight to YYZ on qantas.com for two (limited availability, but usually at least once a week) and then build the rest of the schedule around that.
To clarify, this was my second stopover in JFK (I had to stop on the way out, same thing, poorly timed AA flights) and oneworld doesn't allow two stopovers in same city in US
Turns out the first AAgent (and the second) had this wrong, and if you don't take the two flights closest to each other (ie in my case, the LAST flight of the day LHR-JFK and then the first flight the next day) it counts as a stop over. Since the LAST flight of the day was not available in business, and the flight early on enough to make the same-day connection was not available, there was simply NO flights available at all.
Of course, what ticks me off is two agents told me it was fine, said they ticketed it, and it showed as ticketed online. Only after I got concerned I only was charged for one ticket (miles and fees) and I called did an agent look up the rules. Then they wanted to charge me a REDEPOSIT FEE for the first ticket (that went through). Ridiculous. The only credit I can give AA is that they supposedly tried (on hold for 30 minutes) to get award availability on the flights, but I'm sure revenue management said 'screw you', and then they authorized the full refund/redeposit for no fee.
I had spent a whole day looking for flights, and found something on everyone except AA transatlantic (for two biz). My lesson learned -- find the BA flight to YYZ on qantas.com for two (limited availability, but usually at least once a week) and then build the rest of the schedule around that.
To clarify, this was my second stopover in JFK (I had to stop on the way out, same thing, poorly timed AA flights) and oneworld doesn't allow two stopovers in same city in US
Disappointing work on the part of your AAgent. I will say that d a similar situation (first segment would have had 2 stopovers at JFK) the agent that called ME back was able to open F award space (after I said I would take Y) on JFK-MIA for 2 pax. The mantra of "whoops I got disconnected, my cell phone lost service, and call back" would have been your better option....
ESPECIALLY since it was AA metal.
Jan 20, 2010, 10:02 am
#1719
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Florida
Posts: 29,767
Not very many AAgents know the complex rules of OneWorld award.
It is much better for the traveler himself / herself to become well-versed on the rules because even if the initial booking going thru, chances are some where down the line, the initial error would come back to haunt you.
It is very important to study the first post in all aspects, especially the stopover / connection rules, as well as the MUST TAKE FIRST AVAILABLE FLIGHT REGARDLESS OF AWARD AVAILABILITY. Also the LAST flight in FIRST flight out regardless of award availability is essentially the same version.
The connection time remains a mean 6 hours international.
Bear in mind the All Partners and AA awards DONT have the above limitation.
Sorry to hear your trouble but at least AA waived the redeposit fee and that is what they normally do when such snafu happened.
If you are EXP, yield management may be more willing to open up seats on AA flights. If partner flights are involved, they cannot force partner to release award seats.
It is much better for the traveler himself / herself to become well-versed on the rules because even if the initial booking going thru, chances are some where down the line, the initial error would come back to haunt you.
It is very important to study the first post in all aspects, especially the stopover / connection rules, as well as the MUST TAKE FIRST AVAILABLE FLIGHT REGARDLESS OF AWARD AVAILABILITY. Also the LAST flight in FIRST flight out regardless of award availability is essentially the same version.
The connection time remains a mean 6 hours international.
Bear in mind the All Partners and AA awards DONT have the above limitation.
Sorry to hear your trouble but at least AA waived the redeposit fee and that is what they normally do when such snafu happened.
If you are EXP, yield management may be more willing to open up seats on AA flights. If partner flights are involved, they cannot force partner to release award seats.
So, AA screwed me. I booked two biz class reservations OW130C, the agent said they were fine and ticketed. I booked the later LHR-JFK-PIT flights -- and PIT-JFK was the next day since the LHR-JFK flight arrived after the last PIT-JFK flight. No problem right, next available flight. AA.com prices this as a regular one-way award.
Turns out the first AAgent (and the second) had this wrong, and if you don't take the two flights closest to each other (ie in my case, the LAST flight of the day LHR-JFK and then the first flight the next day) it counts as a stop over. Since the LAST flight of the day was not available in business, and the flight early on enough to make the same-day connection was not available, there was simply NO flights available at all.
Of course, what ticks me off is two agents told me it was fine, said they ticketed it, and it showed as ticketed online. Only after I got concerned I only was charged for one ticket (miles and fees) and I called did an agent look up the rules. Then they wanted to charge me a REDEPOSIT FEE for the first ticket (that went through). Ridiculous. The only credit I can give AA is that they supposedly tried (on hold for 30 minutes) to get award availability on the flights, but I'm sure revenue management said 'screw you', and then they authorized the full refund/redeposit for no fee.
I had spent a whole day looking for flights, and found something on everyone except AA transatlantic (for two biz). My lesson learned -- find the BA flight to YYZ on qantas.com for two (limited availability, but usually at least once a week) and then build the rest of the schedule around that.
To clarify, this was my second stopover in JFK (I had to stop on the way out, same thing, poorly timed AA flights) and oneworld doesn't allow two stopovers in same city in US
Turns out the first AAgent (and the second) had this wrong, and if you don't take the two flights closest to each other (ie in my case, the LAST flight of the day LHR-JFK and then the first flight the next day) it counts as a stop over. Since the LAST flight of the day was not available in business, and the flight early on enough to make the same-day connection was not available, there was simply NO flights available at all.
Of course, what ticks me off is two agents told me it was fine, said they ticketed it, and it showed as ticketed online. Only after I got concerned I only was charged for one ticket (miles and fees) and I called did an agent look up the rules. Then they wanted to charge me a REDEPOSIT FEE for the first ticket (that went through). Ridiculous. The only credit I can give AA is that they supposedly tried (on hold for 30 minutes) to get award availability on the flights, but I'm sure revenue management said 'screw you', and then they authorized the full refund/redeposit for no fee.
I had spent a whole day looking for flights, and found something on everyone except AA transatlantic (for two biz). My lesson learned -- find the BA flight to YYZ on qantas.com for two (limited availability, but usually at least once a week) and then build the rest of the schedule around that.
To clarify, this was my second stopover in JFK (I had to stop on the way out, same thing, poorly timed AA flights) and oneworld doesn't allow two stopovers in same city in US
Jan 20, 2010, 10:04 am
#1720
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Florida
Posts: 29,767
Sept 2008.
OTOH, to be fair the previous redemption rate was exceedingly generous in that it calculated miles flown based on beeline regardless of how many connections involved.
There were some blatant abuses bragged about on FT that people booked trips in F to travel well over 45K miles so they could enjoy as many longhaul F as possible yet only paid for 20K level. Needless to say the loophole was finally closed.
OTOH, to be fair the previous redemption rate was exceedingly generous in that it calculated miles flown based on beeline regardless of how many connections involved.
There were some blatant abuses bragged about on FT that people booked trips in F to travel well over 45K miles so they could enjoy as many longhaul F as possible yet only paid for 20K level. Needless to say the loophole was finally closed.
Jan 20, 2010, 1:50 pm
#1721
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Redwood City, CA (i.e. SFO/SJC/OAK)
Programs: AAdvantage 1MM+ GOLD, SkyMiles
Posts: 143
Seems like I have a problem not too dissimilar to malcolmkettering's. In my upcoming
SJC-ORD-LAX-MRY-LAX-YYZ-LHR-MAN-LHR-EDI-LHR-DXB-BOM,DEL-ORD-SJC
Cathay Pacific has apparently canceled their DXB-BOM flight for good! There's no other OW direct flight for this leg; the only reasonable OW option would be DXB-AMM-BOM: this would put me at exactly 16 segments but, will go over the 25K mile limit for my OW150C award. Since the change's involuntary, I'm guessing I should be fine without having to cough up additional miles?!
According to AA agents, Cathay's still working on sorting this out. I'm hoping that they put me on either Emirates or Jet Airways (an AA, non-OW partner!) both of which fly DXB-BOM direct and have scheduled flights at around the same time as the now-axed CX flight...
SJC-ORD-LAX-MRY-LAX-YYZ-LHR-MAN-LHR-EDI-LHR-DXB-BOM,DEL-ORD-SJC
Cathay Pacific has apparently canceled their DXB-BOM flight for good! There's no other OW direct flight for this leg; the only reasonable OW option would be DXB-AMM-BOM: this would put me at exactly 16 segments but, will go over the 25K mile limit for my OW150C award. Since the change's involuntary, I'm guessing I should be fine without having to cough up additional miles?!
According to AA agents, Cathay's still working on sorting this out. I'm hoping that they put me on either Emirates or Jet Airways (an AA, non-OW partner!) both of which fly DXB-BOM direct and have scheduled flights at around the same time as the now-axed CX flight...
Btw, flew the first three legs of this trip (viz. SJC-ORD-LAX-MRY) over the long weekend here in the US. AA had to cancel the original ORD-LAX flight that I was on but, generously put me on an earlier flight out of ORD yesterday and an even better connection to MRY - they got 3 seats for us despite those seats being available in the AAnytime inventory alone! Kudos, AA! ^
Jan 25, 2010, 4:01 pm
#1722
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Pittsburgh
Programs: Whoever Has the Best Bonus
Posts: 5,183
Thanks for the info guys. I imagine if I wasn't a paper Gold (my flying dAAys are mostly behind me, and Gold due to 1MM miles) maybe revenue management or the supervisor would try harder to get on the AA flight. Or maybe if I whined enough. I'm only ticked that multiple AAgents didn't bring it up as a problem. Either way, the part on the website that applied to my 'bad' itin was:
So the way I read this was that I took the next scheduled flight from JFK-PIT after my flight arrived LHR-JFK (and way before the 24 hour cut). It doesn't say 'last flight in, first flight out for overnight to not be a stopover' which is the net/net of my story. But I learned my lesson and only hope that I'll save someone else some frustration when they get their perfect itin dismantled 
While I'm a little disAApointed (mAAybe I'll eventually get tired of that, but not yet LOL) it's still a lot better than Delta where I can't ever redeem my miles for anything, or USAirways, where due to THEIR screwup I had a whole vacation XLed on the spot and then I had to argue for months to not pay the redeposit fee.
PS To add insult to injury, I found that AA didn't refund the ticketing fee for a ticket I could not even take. Will contact AA customer service, and then just dispute the charge if they don't take it off.
If there are no scheduled flights within this timeframe, regardless of availability, you must take the next scheduled flight but may not exceed 24 hours. If the connection exceeds 24 hours, it will be considered a stopover.
While I'm a little disAApointed (mAAybe I'll eventually get tired of that, but not yet LOL) it's still a lot better than Delta where I can't ever redeem my miles for anything, or USAirways, where due to THEIR screwup I had a whole vacation XLed on the spot and then I had to argue for months to not pay the redeposit fee.
PS To add insult to injury, I found that AA didn't refund the ticketing fee for a ticket I could not even take. Will contact AA customer service, and then just dispute the charge if they don't take it off.
Last edited by pitflyer; Jan 26, 2010 at 10:37 pm
Jan 28, 2010, 7:49 am
#1723
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: South Florida
Programs: Delta Skymiles
Posts: 192
Finding partner award availability
I apologize if this is answered already, I read the first 10 and last 10 pages of th thread without success. Assuming when you call AA to book one of these awards, you want to have a pretty good handle on availability, how are people determining award availability on partners? Do you use the partner's website and look for award availability in their FF program? Do the partner airlines have multiple tiers and if so do you have to look for a tier analogous to "MileSaaver?" Or do you have to use a more sophisticated tool?
Thanks,Bob
Thanks,Bob
Jan 28, 2010, 8:43 am
#1724
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: SJU
Programs: AA PLT; Marriott Silver
Posts: 84
From my own experience in booking a OW J award to Australia a few months ago, I can tell you that I checked availability by signing up for the QF, BA, JL and CX frequent-flyer programs. Once you are a member of those programs, you can check availability with those programs directly on their respective websites, and the availability shown by those sites, in my experience, matched the availability that the AAgent booking the trip could see. Keep in mind that some programs, such as QF, allow booking farther in advance than AA does, and that award seats may be snapped up by those with earlier access. However, generally, if you see award availability on the OW partner sites, the AAgent should be able to see it as well. Don't hesitate to tell the AAgent exactly what flight you want and that you have seen award availability on the flight. That being said, it certainly has happened that an AAgent cannot see availability that you can see on a partner's website; as always, flexibility is key. In any event, your premise of being aware of potential availability before you call AA is a sound one.
As for more sophisticated services, Expert Flyer provides award availability for AA and QF (now including premium classes on QF - before last September, only coach QF awards could be seen); whether this paid service is worthwhile for this particular reason, given the ability to get this information from the OW partner sites for free, is a call you'll have to make for yourself.
As for more sophisticated services, Expert Flyer provides award availability for AA and QF (now including premium classes on QF - before last September, only coach QF awards could be seen); whether this paid service is worthwhile for this particular reason, given the ability to get this information from the OW partner sites for free, is a call you'll have to make for yourself.
Jan 29, 2010, 2:56 am
#1725
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: PIT/DFW/MEL; AA Exec. Platinum & 4MM, QF WP
Posts: 7,689
From my own experience in booking a OW J award to Australia a few months ago, I can tell you that I checked availability by signing up for the QF, BA, JL and CX frequent-flyer programs. Once you are a member of those programs, you can check availability with those programs directly on their respective websites, and the availability shown by those sites, in my experience, matched the availability that the AAgent booking the trip could see. Keep in mind that some programs, such as QF, allow booking farther in advance than AA does, and that award seats may be snapped up by those with earlier access. However, generally, if you see award availability on the OW partner sites, the AAgent should be able to see it as well. Don't hesitate to tell the AAgent exactly what flight you want and that you have seen award availability on the flight. That being said, it certainly has happened that an AAgent cannot see availability that you can see on a partner's website; as always, flexibility is key. In any event, your premise of being aware of potential availability before you call AA is a sound one.
As for more sophisticated services, Expert Flyer provides award availability for AA and QF (now including premium classes on QF - before last September, only coach QF awards could be seen); whether this paid service is worthwhile for this particular reason, given the ability to get this information from the OW partner sites for free, is a call you'll have to make for yourself.
As for more sophisticated services, Expert Flyer provides award availability for AA and QF (now including premium classes on QF - before last September, only coach QF awards could be seen); whether this paid service is worthwhile for this particular reason, given the ability to get this information from the OW partner sites for free, is a call you'll have to make for yourself.
ExpertFlyer is great. In addition to Qantas it covers Alaska (AS), El Al (LY), Air Tahiti (TN), and also Finnair (AY) albeit only in Coach. The valuable part of ExpertFlyer is the ability to set a search-and-remind for the flight and class you need.
In addition to the planning horizon (some partners go a year out, but AA's current system can only book 331 days out), there can be time zone issues. If you see a seat on the QF or CX site, for instance, it might not be visible to AAdvantage until AA's system does its next overnight update around 1am Central Time.