ARCHIVE: Airbus A321 Transcon / A321T / "32B" 3 class (consolidated 2012-2014)
Jul 24, 2012, 4:25 pm
#226
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: England
Programs: Executive Club Silver
Posts: 711
I sincerely apologise if this has been asked but if this becomes successful then could these special A321's be used on other possible premiums markets like LAX-DCA or LAX-MIA or even LAX-BOS?
Jul 24, 2012, 4:32 pm
#227
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Join Date: May 2001
Location: LAX; AA EXP, MM; HH Gold
Posts: 31,789
That's certainly possible, although there's a low probability (IMO) of that happening. AA's experiment with three class transcons between BOS-LAX/SFO and IAD-LAX and JFK-SAN (and perhaps others) did not last long, effectively killed by September 11 and the growth of B6. Much more likely between Miami and LA, IMO, as that market currently has two daily 777s this summer.
Jul 24, 2012, 4:51 pm
#228
Suspended
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: London
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That's certainly possible, although there's a low probability (IMO) of that happening. AA's experiment with three class transcons between BOS-LAX/SFO and IAD-LAX and JFK-SAN (and perhaps others) did not last long, effectively killed by September 11 and the growth of B6. Much more likely between Miami and LA, IMO, as that market currently has two daily 777s this summer.
My guess is DCA-LAX will command a high Y fare and its not like AA can just get a new slot and run more A321s to add the seats.
Jul 24, 2012, 4:53 pm
#229
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: RBKC
Programs: AA EXP and Eurostar Carte Blanche
Posts: 3,851
My favorite aircraft in the AA fleet is the 75L (traveling in J), so I don't have anything against narrowbodies. That said, widebodies usually have a smoother ride and give a greater sense of space inside. For that reason, my favorite aircraft overall is the 747, and I imagine that will be replaced by the A380 after my first ride
http://twitter.com/StealthMountain
Jul 24, 2012, 5:24 pm
#230
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Join Date: Oct 2011
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No one has mentioned the gridlock in the skies over NYC, and AA's plan to add smaller planes will serve to increase that gridlock as each AA transcon airbus will have 37% fewer seats that the 767-223s. Those SFO flights when compared to the 767-323s will have even higher percentage of lost seats. All those passengers displaced from the full AA transcons will need to go elsewhere at JFK.
Flights at peak hours are capped at LGA @ 71 flights per hour, and 81 per hour at JFK and EWR so it will be difficult to increase the flights out of JFK because of gridlock on the ground as well as in the air. One solution to reduce the gridlock is to add larger, not smaller planes to the mix with less frequent schedules. Many of us have been delayed flyling throughout the U.S. because of delays at NYC airports, and AA's plan to add smaller planes should increase this gridlock at the same time that predictions are that additional passengers will need to be flying.
Below is a article describing the gridlock at NYC airports.
http://travel.usatoday.com/flights/s...ked/52893264/1
Flights at peak hours are capped at LGA @ 71 flights per hour, and 81 per hour at JFK and EWR so it will be difficult to increase the flights out of JFK because of gridlock on the ground as well as in the air. One solution to reduce the gridlock is to add larger, not smaller planes to the mix with less frequent schedules. Many of us have been delayed flyling throughout the U.S. because of delays at NYC airports, and AA's plan to add smaller planes should increase this gridlock at the same time that predictions are that additional passengers will need to be flying.
Below is a article describing the gridlock at NYC airports.
http://travel.usatoday.com/flights/s...ked/52893264/1
Jul 24, 2012, 5:38 pm
#231
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: SoCal, Southeastern CT
Programs: AAdvantage PLT (trying to find away to EXP, SPG Gold
Posts: 59
Like what I see but I noticed that they are also saying that 777 International service is going to on board WiFi. WiFi on TransPac/Atlantic flights? HMMMMM
Jul 24, 2012, 6:07 pm
#232
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Southern California/Los Angeles
Programs: Various
Posts: 2,778
The math may actually be a lot simpler, just using a back-of-envelope approach.
Scenario 1: All AFS transcons go to A321Neo. No additional flights.
Expecting J/F paid revenue to drop proportionally is unrealistic - in fact, IMO it will likely increase (relative to the number of seats offered) due to the improved hard product. So - far fewer upgrades for elites buying Y
Scenario 2: All AFS transcons go to A321Neo. Frequencies increased somehow (!) to provide the approximately same number of total seats
This should (assuming that the new frequencies are all A321Neo) increase the J/Y ratio. So perhaps more upgrade opportunities; even if the number of paid F/J increases somewhat due to the better hard product.
Or somewhere in between - possibly with 77W repositioning, or some middle point in the number of seats offered. In which case the outcome will be somewhere in between.
But I would submit that until AA publishes a schedule so that the number and ratio of seats are known, predicting the likelihood of elite Y-J upgrades is at best a WAG.
My $0.02.
Scenario 1: All AFS transcons go to A321Neo. No additional flights.
Expecting J/F paid revenue to drop proportionally is unrealistic - in fact, IMO it will likely increase (relative to the number of seats offered) due to the improved hard product. So - far fewer upgrades for elites buying Y
Scenario 2: All AFS transcons go to A321Neo. Frequencies increased somehow (!) to provide the approximately same number of total seats
This should (assuming that the new frequencies are all A321Neo) increase the J/Y ratio. So perhaps more upgrade opportunities; even if the number of paid F/J increases somewhat due to the better hard product.
Or somewhere in between - possibly with 77W repositioning, or some middle point in the number of seats offered. In which case the outcome will be somewhere in between.
But I would submit that until AA publishes a schedule so that the number and ratio of seats are known, predicting the likelihood of elite Y-J upgrades is at best a WAG.
My $0.02.
Jul 24, 2012, 6:10 pm
#233
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: SLC/HEL/Anywhere with a Beach
Programs: Marriott Ambassador; AA EXP 3MM; AS MVP, Hilton Gold, CH-47/UH-60/C-23/C-130 VET
Posts: 5,234
The math may actually be a lot simpler, just using a back-of-envelope approach.
Scenario 1: All AFS transcons go to A321Neo. No additional flights.
Expecting J/F paid revenue to drop proportionally is unrealistic - in fact, IMO it will likely increase (relative to the number of seats offered) due to the improved hard product. So - far fewer upgrades for elites buying Y
Scenario 2: All AFS transcons go to A321Neo. Frequencies increased somehow (!) to provide the approximately same number of total seats
This should (assuming that the new frequencies are all A321Neo) increase the J/Y ratio. So perhaps more upgrade opportunities; even if the number of paid F/J increases somewhat due to the better hard product.
Or somewhere in between - possibly with 77W repositioning, or some middle point in the number of seats offered. In which case the outcome will be somewhere in between.
But I would submit that until AA publishes a schedule so that the number and ratio of seats are known, predicting the likelihood of elite Y-J upgrades is at best a WAG.
My $0.02.
Scenario 1: All AFS transcons go to A321Neo. No additional flights.
Expecting J/F paid revenue to drop proportionally is unrealistic - in fact, IMO it will likely increase (relative to the number of seats offered) due to the improved hard product. So - far fewer upgrades for elites buying Y
Scenario 2: All AFS transcons go to A321Neo. Frequencies increased somehow (!) to provide the approximately same number of total seats
This should (assuming that the new frequencies are all A321Neo) increase the J/Y ratio. So perhaps more upgrade opportunities; even if the number of paid F/J increases somewhat due to the better hard product.
Or somewhere in between - possibly with 77W repositioning, or some middle point in the number of seats offered. In which case the outcome will be somewhere in between.
But I would submit that until AA publishes a schedule so that the number and ratio of seats are known, predicting the likelihood of elite Y-J upgrades is at best a WAG.
My $0.02.
Perhaps a WAG, but realistically AA must be planning to add more flights.
I have flown this route as an EXP 30 times or so the past couple of years.
The load in F fluctuates wildly. Sometimes 1 FA, sometimes full.
The load in J is always full. I realize we don't know how much of that is paid vs upgrade but it seems like it must be close to 30 based on the upgrade success. There are a lot of people who are coming in from Europe onward to LAX or leaving LAX onward to Asia, with paid J. This is the only route where I regularly (30 percent) fail to get upgraded.
So if AA keeps the same 9 flights and I'm right about the 30 paid seats, AA can only sell 180 J seats rather than 270. It becomes even more of a revenue loss because a pax might be unable to buy a J seat to Asia through LAX because of the J seats being sold out.
Then again, maybe I'm just the last EXP on the list!!!
Jul 24, 2012, 6:24 pm
#234
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Los Angeles
Programs: AA LT Gold
Posts: 3,646
Jul 24, 2012, 6:29 pm
#235
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Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Austin, Texas
Programs: Airline nobody. Sad!
Posts: 26,062
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Jul 24, 2012, 7:46 pm
#236
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Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: NYC
Posts: 27,239
they appear to be the same b/e aerospace diamond seats that UA uses on its sCO BF seats.
http://www.beaerospace.com/products/...ness_class.htm
http://www.flickr.com/photos/crankyflier/2713215300/
http://chrisjur.wordpress.com/2009/1...nitial-review/
in all honesty i find them to be pretty comfortable, however you're right they are not angled and you either have to climb over/get climbed over to go to the bathroom.
http://www.beaerospace.com/products/...ness_class.htm
http://www.flickr.com/photos/crankyflier/2713215300/
http://chrisjur.wordpress.com/2009/1...nitial-review/
in all honesty i find them to be pretty comfortable, however you're right they are not angled and you either have to climb over/get climbed over to go to the bathroom.
Here's a photo of the seat on a UA 757. You can see how the seats are slightly angled, and note specifically how the front of each seat cushion is offset from the other.
http://www.airliners.net/photo/Unite...57-224/1991474
Here's another view, but on the 777.
http://www.airliners.net/photo/Star-...24-ER/1789303/
Jul 24, 2012, 7:54 pm
#237
Join Date: Jul 2011
Programs: AA & DL / SPG & HGP
Posts: 1,723
You mean the two seats are "offset" (one sits some small distance ahead/behind the other, but they are still parallel to each other), as opposed to angled (meaning the line made by the seat center is not parallel to the center line of the fuselage, or the two seats are not exactly parallel to each other)?
Jul 24, 2012, 8:29 pm
#238
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Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: NYC
Posts: 27,239
You mean the two seats are "offset" (one sits some small distance ahead/behind the other, but they are still parallel to each other), as opposed to angled (meaning the line made by the seat center is not parallel to the center line of the fuselage, or the two seats are not exactly parallel to each other)?
Jul 24, 2012, 9:14 pm
#239
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Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 9,916
Will the 3-class 321s have the range to do JFK/BOS-LHR/CDG?
Jul 24, 2012, 9:20 pm
#240
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Location: LAX; AA EXP, MM; HH Gold
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