Account Suspensions/Closures on Accusations of Fraud/Brokering
May 7, 2015, 9:15 pm
#91
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 567
May 7, 2015, 9:36 pm
#92
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Seattle, WA
Programs: Hilton Gold, AS Lifetime Gold (75K for this year), Marriott Lifetime Titanium Elite, OW Emerald
Posts: 176
The lack of any comment from Alaska is disappointing at best. I fly quite a bit on Alaska, use a B of A Card to accumulate a lot of miles and also book award tickets to book for my employees and family (who do not share the same name).
Basically, AS is a CC loyalty company that happens to have an airline that they operate. The peddle the CC, and the program every single chance they get. Now they have people who are recognizing the flexibility, even if they don't fly much, if at all on the airlines and use it with SPG (which I also have a ton of points on).
I am concerned that they can arbitrarily just accuse someone of fraud and shut the account down. They need to be absolutely transparent with their members about what the expectations are and if they accuse someone of "fraud" they should be very specific and direct.
Shame on AS for not being direct with anyone they are accusing of fraud.
Basically, AS is a CC loyalty company that happens to have an airline that they operate. The peddle the CC, and the program every single chance they get. Now they have people who are recognizing the flexibility, even if they don't fly much, if at all on the airlines and use it with SPG (which I also have a ton of points on).
I am concerned that they can arbitrarily just accuse someone of fraud and shut the account down. They need to be absolutely transparent with their members about what the expectations are and if they accuse someone of "fraud" they should be very specific and direct.
Shame on AS for not being direct with anyone they are accusing of fraud.
May 7, 2015, 10:38 pm
#93
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: QLA
Programs: SBUX Gold
Posts: 14,507
*UPDATE #2* I sent in a signed copy that I had read the T&C and they've reinstated the account. It sucks, I was going to consider booking some flights for my honeymoon but now I'm going to have to jump through hoops to transfer miles from my SPG to my Fiancee's SPG account (we share the same address so it's allowed by SPG) and then to her Alaska account.
May 8, 2015, 7:46 am
#94
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Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: BOS/ORH
Programs: AS 75K
Posts: 18,323
I'm not involved but when I questioned AS about the ability to use miles for others (I usually just go myself) but now worried I could get shut down and this is the response:
Originally Posted by AS social media team
You can still use miles to book tickets for other people like friends and family. You cannot sell them which is against our mileage plan terms and conditions.
May 8, 2015, 8:10 am
#95
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: NYC
Programs: Delta Gold, SPG Gold, HHonors Gold, UA Gold (status match)
Posts: 777
This thread is really concerning for those of us who can't access Alaska's regular routes for paid tickets (for example, east coast travel only and no AS presence at local airports) but still hold an AS credit card, have SPG accounts and utilize transfers (or transfers from a spouse), purchase miles directly from the airline, or credit non-AS flights to AS.
Alaska is one of a few airlines that doesn't even have a purchase limit on paid miles per year (I think). This is a huge value in securing premium award tickets especially if you pick up the miles 'on sale.'
I would like an answer from AS as to whether people currently holding award tickets procured through a combination of the above should be concerned about accounts and tickets being cancelled.
Alaska is one of a few airlines that doesn't even have a purchase limit on paid miles per year (I think). This is a huge value in securing premium award tickets especially if you pick up the miles 'on sale.'
I would like an answer from AS as to whether people currently holding award tickets procured through a combination of the above should be concerned about accounts and tickets being cancelled.
May 8, 2015, 8:58 am
#96
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Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Pacific Northwest
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My interpretation of this thread is that no rules in the official T&C were actually broken, but that AS doesn't like people to use the program (within those rules), but perhaps not as profitably for AS as expected) in a certain way and then as a result forces special rules on them, with the dubious accusation of T&C violations and the threat of account closures.
May 8, 2015, 12:03 pm
#97
Moderator Communications Coordinator, Signatures
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: deep within the Eskimo lair
Programs: TubWorld, Bar Alliance, Borratxo Legendarium
Posts: 16,968
AS is never going to reveal the algorithm they use for fraud detection, because that would result in helping fraudsters get smarter.
But it does seem from the OP that at least some of timtetra's issue came from being unable to verify ID information afterwards.
Reading this thread made me check my own AS account ... which still shows an old address ... so it does match my ID, but isn't the same address where my AS credit card is billed, nor would it match any utility bills in my name.
One of my hotel accounts has my current address, but still my old name, because I haven't bothered to send them a marriage certificate.
When I worked in the call center, there were plenty of members who struggled to verify their account information, because they had either "made up" a date of birth when signing up for My Account, or had an old work/home address attached to their profile, or changed their name, but hadn't bothered to update.
All of these things would make it harder for me, if asked, to prove my identity. So, while I can't guarantee that none of you will ever get erroneously tagged by a fraud alert, I can say that taking a few minutes periodically to make sure your account info is up to date will help the agent who is tasked with verifying your identity get you back on track faster.
But it does seem from the OP that at least some of timtetra's issue came from being unable to verify ID information afterwards.
Reading this thread made me check my own AS account ... which still shows an old address ... so it does match my ID, but isn't the same address where my AS credit card is billed, nor would it match any utility bills in my name.
One of my hotel accounts has my current address, but still my old name, because I haven't bothered to send them a marriage certificate.
When I worked in the call center, there were plenty of members who struggled to verify their account information, because they had either "made up" a date of birth when signing up for My Account, or had an old work/home address attached to their profile, or changed their name, but hadn't bothered to update.
All of these things would make it harder for me, if asked, to prove my identity. So, while I can't guarantee that none of you will ever get erroneously tagged by a fraud alert, I can say that taking a few minutes periodically to make sure your account info is up to date will help the agent who is tasked with verifying your identity get you back on track faster.
May 8, 2015, 6:01 pm
#98
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Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Minneapolis: DL DM charter 2.3MM
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Posts: 100,417
AS is never going to reveal the algorithm they use for fraud detection, because that would result in helping fraudsters get smarter.
But it does seem from the OP that at least some of timtetra's issue came from being unable to verify ID information afterwards.
Reading this thread made me check my own AS account ... which still shows an old address ... so it does match my ID, but isn't the same address where my AS credit card is billed, nor would it match any utility bills in my name.
One of my hotel accounts has my current address, but still my old name, because I haven't bothered to send them a marriage certificate.
When I worked in the call center, there were plenty of members who struggled to verify their account information, because they had either "made up" a date of birth when signing up for My Account, or had an old work/home address attached to their profile, or changed their name, but hadn't bothered to update.
All of these things would make it harder for me, if asked, to prove my identity. So, while I can't guarantee that none of you will ever get erroneously tagged by a fraud alert, I can say that taking a few minutes periodically to make sure your account info is up to date will help the agent who is tasked with verifying your identity get you back on track faster.
But it does seem from the OP that at least some of timtetra's issue came from being unable to verify ID information afterwards.
Reading this thread made me check my own AS account ... which still shows an old address ... so it does match my ID, but isn't the same address where my AS credit card is billed, nor would it match any utility bills in my name.
One of my hotel accounts has my current address, but still my old name, because I haven't bothered to send them a marriage certificate.
When I worked in the call center, there were plenty of members who struggled to verify their account information, because they had either "made up" a date of birth when signing up for My Account, or had an old work/home address attached to their profile, or changed their name, but hadn't bothered to update.
All of these things would make it harder for me, if asked, to prove my identity. So, while I can't guarantee that none of you will ever get erroneously tagged by a fraud alert, I can say that taking a few minutes periodically to make sure your account info is up to date will help the agent who is tasked with verifying your identity get you back on track faster.
It's also hard for me to understand why the fraud department isn't more explicit in explaining why the attempts to prove identity were not accepted. IMO they should give the person the opportunity to explain (college address versus parents' home address, for example) or provide additional documents.
For award tickets for others, why not ask about the relationship instead of assuming that the tickets or miles have been sold? Either living together or traveling together should constitute adequate proof of a relationship, as well as being able to immediately send copies of the other person's ID card, although failure to do so isn't proof of fraud, as the spouse could well be traveling at the time with their passport, driver's license, etc.
May 8, 2015, 6:34 pm
#99
Moderator Communications Coordinator, Signatures
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: deep within the Eskimo lair
Programs: TubWorld, Bar Alliance, Borratxo Legendarium
Posts: 16,968
I imagine If the things the fraud department did to combat fraud were easy to understand, then it would be easy to circumvent them.
To be sure, its annoying when you haven't done anything wrong.
I ran into a similar experience with T-mobile. I went into one of their stores to buy a phone and they wouldn't let me because my account was still in my old name. They have no problem letting me autopay my bill every month with a credit card in my new name, billed to my new address, but apparently taking my $600 for a new phone was out of the question until I provided a marriage certificate. So I used the $600 on a mistake fare to Ireland instead
To be sure, its annoying when you haven't done anything wrong.
I ran into a similar experience with T-mobile. I went into one of their stores to buy a phone and they wouldn't let me because my account was still in my old name. They have no problem letting me autopay my bill every month with a credit card in my new name, billed to my new address, but apparently taking my $600 for a new phone was out of the question until I provided a marriage certificate. So I used the $600 on a mistake fare to Ireland instead
May 8, 2015, 7:39 pm
#100
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: YVR, KUL
Programs: AC, MH, BA, AF-KL
Posts: 2,904
My brother accumulated all his miles by flying and credit card, and never bought a single mile. He lives in the U.S. and his account is tied to his address there.
He redeemed his miles for me to visit him with an EK award. That's the only time he's ever redeemed a ticket that's not under his name. To his surprise his account was locked later on ("this mileage plan account has some discrepancies") and couldn't log-in.
The award was redeemed a month before he discovered it being locked. He didn't call customer care as the message informed him to, nor did he receive any emails or calls to verify his identity, so we agreed to not pick up the phone and rock the boat until after I've flown which is in less than 2 weeks.
You guys think there'll be any surprises waiting for me at the EK check-in desk? The ticket seems intact, and I've called EK several times to confirm. The agents also couldn't see any remarks that AS might have entered. It's been 2 months of eerie silence from AS.
Should we just pretend as though nothing happened?
He redeemed his miles for me to visit him with an EK award. That's the only time he's ever redeemed a ticket that's not under his name. To his surprise his account was locked later on ("this mileage plan account has some discrepancies") and couldn't log-in.
The award was redeemed a month before he discovered it being locked. He didn't call customer care as the message informed him to, nor did he receive any emails or calls to verify his identity, so we agreed to not pick up the phone and rock the boat until after I've flown which is in less than 2 weeks.
You guys think there'll be any surprises waiting for me at the EK check-in desk? The ticket seems intact, and I've called EK several times to confirm. The agents also couldn't see any remarks that AS might have entered. It's been 2 months of eerie silence from AS.
Should we just pretend as though nothing happened?
May 8, 2015, 9:15 pm
#101
Join Date: May 2009
Location: SEA
Programs: AA EXP (2.5MM), Hilton Gold, Marriott Titanium
Posts: 4,859
My brother accumulated all his miles by flying and credit card, and never bought a single mile. He lives in the U.S. and his account is tied to his address there.
He redeemed his miles for me to visit him with an EK award. That's the only time he's ever redeemed a ticket that's not under his name. To his surprise his account was locked later on ("this mileage plan account has some discrepancies") and couldn't log-in.
The award was redeemed a month before he discovered it being locked. He didn't call customer care as the message informed him to, nor did he receive any emails or calls to verify his identity, so we agreed to not pick up the phone and rock the boat until after I've flown which is in less than 2 weeks.
You guys think there'll be any surprises waiting for me at the EK check-in desk? The ticket seems intact, and I've called EK several times to confirm. The agents also couldn't see any remarks that AS might have entered. It's been 2 months of eerie silence from AS.
Should we just pretend as though nothing happened?
He redeemed his miles for me to visit him with an EK award. That's the only time he's ever redeemed a ticket that's not under his name. To his surprise his account was locked later on ("this mileage plan account has some discrepancies") and couldn't log-in.
The award was redeemed a month before he discovered it being locked. He didn't call customer care as the message informed him to, nor did he receive any emails or calls to verify his identity, so we agreed to not pick up the phone and rock the boat until after I've flown which is in less than 2 weeks.
You guys think there'll be any surprises waiting for me at the EK check-in desk? The ticket seems intact, and I've called EK several times to confirm. The agents also couldn't see any remarks that AS might have entered. It's been 2 months of eerie silence from AS.
Should we just pretend as though nothing happened?
May 8, 2015, 10:07 pm
#102
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: HH Diamond, Marriott Gold, IHG Gold, Hyatt something
Posts: 33,544
I'd certainly call weeks before your trip. Way too likely you'll have problems, especially if you're originating in KUL.
It seems that AS is targeting people who buy premium tickets, especially EK ones.
It seems that AS is targeting people who buy premium tickets, especially EK ones.
May 8, 2015, 10:34 pm
#103
Moderator: Alaska Mileage Plan
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 12,320
May 9, 2015, 10:53 pm
#104
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend, Moderator, Information Desk, Ambassador, Alaska Airlines
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: FAI
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Wirelessly posted (beckoa's BB: Mozilla/5.0 (BlackBerry; U; BlackBerry 9810; en-US) AppleWebKit/534.11+ (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/7.1.0.694 Mobile Safari/534.11+)
Agree call now.
Agree call now.
May 10, 2015, 12:00 am
#105
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 49
Whose credit card was used to pay the taxes in the above situations? Was it the Mileage Plan holder's credit card or the ticketed passenger's credit card? Not that it should really matter but I wonder if AS fraud detection takes this into account. Anyways, this was just a thought as to something that could potentially contribute to this.