Stranger

I would not be so sure.

Also it's not clear why there should be such a clause *with AE.* Since they would own it anyway. Perhaps this referred to obligations with Aimia after transfer of AE?

jc94

Yeah I don't see devaluations. I do see there being a move to push only AC (and maybe LH) flights through the system so that they can keep getting their scam charges in there.
However the question is... is that a move? Or just continuation.

I'm pretty sure that even when AC can't blame everything on Aeroplan they'll instead blame it on APs IT and it all being very difficult to integrate. I can see that continuing until 2025.

Stranger

I would think/hope they won't even try integrating AE IT.

Mind you, not so clear that theirs is better. Perhaps the switch to amadeus, *if it goes through* might imporve things. But then. last attempts at moving to a state of the art reservation system ended up getting cancelled...

ChrisA330

Rumours already coming out. This one is that AC's new program won't have fuel surcharges.

https://travelupdate.boardingarea.co...yalty-program/

canadiancow

It's certainly possible, since AC will now receive a much larger chunk of cash per redemption.

But this is one of the most optimistic outcomes I could possibly imagine, and I would not bet money on it.

Stranger

Most likely status-dependent, just like now...

canadiancow

I can confidently say that it will be no harder for AC to waive AC YQ than it is now. Therefore, I would not expect a change on this front for SEs.

I can confidently say that it will be easier for AC to waive LH YQ than it is now. But I have no idea whether this would change.

Just look at UA. "Book UA, pay X miles. Book other airlines, pay X+Y miles." There are different ways of collecting "money" from people. AC could easily eliminate YQ by charging more miles, and then they'd be exactly like UA, but it wouldn't actually make things "better".

yscleo

The article said " the new loyalty program will get rid of the pesky fuel surcharges that Aeroplan has been notorious for" But ae is only passing the scam charges to the ticketing carrier, AC. It is AC who forced the scam charges.

ChrisA330

It could be by design of the agreement between AC/AE...no matter what we read in this forum, no one really know exactly what happens unless they know the agreement front to back.

Transpacificflyer

You make alot of assumptions. My understanding is that the AMEX demographics are different from those of Visa and Mastercard. AMEX card holders tend to be employed professionals, entrepreneurs, and business owners. They typically have more wealth than other card holders, so I don't think AMEX is going to worry about people who have low spend values. As a former CIBC and then TD card holder of Aeroplan affiliated gold cards, I was pleased to be rid of them when I went back to AMEX. My experience was;
- Superior interface and documentation with Amex. This included a better website experience.
- Overall superior support when it has come to transaction concerns.
- Not one instance of fraud or hacking or security breach in the many years I have been with AMEX, including when I had corporate, Aeroplan and regular AMEX cards. Quite a contrast with 2 fraud issues with CIBC including security breach and CIBC's failure to advise of that breach, and one fraud while at TD. In comparison, my corporate and personal BMO Mastercards have had only 1 fraud in 10+ years. In respect to responding and resolving, AMEX and BMO Mastercard were pro-active and helpful. CIBC was rude and belligerent and TD was useless. The only reason I still have an affinity card with Aeroplan is because of AMEX. I recall when I was with TD the first year, they credited my Aeroplan miles to another account and the months dragged on before Aeroplan and TD fixed it. When I cancelled the TD card, I had to argue with an obnoxious rude CSR. TD would not accept a written request. I also resented the forced sales and obliging me to come to a branch to get my card when it was issued. Never, ever have I had to do that with another card provider. IMO, Aeroplan acted like a pimp, selling my data. It was disgusting to be bombarded by telephone reps at dinnertime trying to sell me mortgage insurance or disability insurance.They couldn't even do a proper credit check.

I am not alone and there are many, many unhappy people who won't go back. Yes, I know some people on this forum love TD and CIBC, however, they do not speak for the thousands of card holders who have not enjoyed dealing with CIBC or TD. There is a reason why AMEX gets top marks as a CC provider and why BMO and RBC are consistently rated above CIBC & TD. Aeroplan made its CC deal to benefit itself, not to benefit its customers. Air Canada had best exercise some common sense when selecting its CC partner as it has no good will to draw down upon. Aeroplan had nothing to lose when it selected low end CC service providers, since Aeroplan was well on its pay to Hades. Air Canada can't afford to bungle this going forward.

Stranger

Granted, I use my amex more than my TD card. But I have had a few instances of fraud on it, and never on my TD.

Likewise, although it is known that Aeroplan by contract was getting details of your visa spending, I never had pesky phone calls associated with it.

To me the main advantage of my amex was that I was getting more miles. Inconvenient: less places taking it.

skybluesea

Agree fully, experience with CIBC that i used as back-up CC really bad so closed account, then TD re-opened my closed CIBC CC account when they did the AP splitting of accounts - long story where this ended up and unpleasant to boot.

BMO primary card, and could NOT be happier, as was previously long time RBC customer, but then service really fell off - although that was about 10 years ago when we switched to BMO.

AMEX is my back-up card now...

Air Canada, if your paying attention, CC service reflects on the merchant that supports them - do what @Transpacificflyer says please

Shareholder

What's to integrate? The systems are already integrated internally. It's the public interface that would be integrated so we would have just one app for AC and the award program as does every other FF program. There'll be some upgrading and redesign but it won't be major behind the screen. The booking engine is part of AC's system and call centres were AC/CP award program call centres before "moving" to Aeroplan. They use the same work station systems as AC res agents do. The only elements Aeroplan added was scrubbing software to pull customer usage data for partner reports. Once the company lost its grocery and gas partners, not much usage pattern data of use to its partners. That's also why there's no future for AIMIA once this division is back in AC's hands.

Shareholder

Remember, AMEX is a Charge Card that requires full repayment each month. TD and CIBC Visas are Credit Cards, so balances can be carried (though not sure how many premium cardholders don't pay off their balance each month). AC/Aeroplan originally had AMEX as its Charge Card partner, and CIBC Visa as its Credit Card partner. When CIBC renewed its partnership first time around, it insisted that AMEX no longer allow Membership Rewards earned with its Platinum Credit Card (Optima) to be transferrable for Aeroplan miles. When the Credit Card partnership came up for renewal, Aeroplan opened it up and TD made a better offer than CIBC. Ultimately, TD agreed that rather than a sole Credit Card partner, Aeroplan could keep CIBC but only for those Visa cardholders who had other accounts with the bank. AMEX has had a long relationship with AC, so managed to get Aeroplan to agree to having a Charge Card partner in addition to a Credit Card partner. I don't see this changing ever with the more direct VISA involvement.

What isn't clear to me is just how the TD/CIBC/VISA involvement in the purchase will work if Aeroplan returns to being an AC division? If these three are putting up dollars towards the buy-back then they'd have some form of equity in the unit, which would be through AC. Unless their involvement is only to backstop the unredeemed mileage liability, and AC's putting up the actual cash. Or they're lending AC much of the money to do the buy-back.

RangerNS

Few random vomits into the void.

Amex has pure credit card options, including an Aeroplan branded one.

Why are we all assuming AE will be absorbed back into AC? We know a consortium bought them. Not that a consortium paid AC to buy them. Why won't they be run as a separate entity?

I expect the integration tighter (less horrible), but AC has to deal now with multiple banks and credit cards for substantial change. Even if (as I theroize here, if not promote as a theory) AE' runs at cost-recovery with no direct cash benefits, the operation manager of AE' needs to handle the demands of 4+ owners.