Nov 20, 2017, 2:16 pm
Last edit by: Argonaut1000
Click here to go to a picture of the White Compensation Form and its stub
View Deflated Seat History Here (Database for submitted occurrences)
Enter New Deflated Seat Occurrence Here (Submit one if you have experienced deflated seat and it will show up in the database above)
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From post #49 in this thread, here's one potential way to (re)inflate an AC seat:
A better method is for a crew member to use the reset switch under the seat, on the aisle side.
Compensation offers (green/white sheet completed)
40K AE- Apr 18 (50% back of the J class one way redemption)
2018 Jun - $500 coupon
2018 Sep $1,000 eCoupon or 40K AP (P fare TPAC)
2018 Sep $500 eCoupon (P fare TPAC) (no change on protest- update - 6 months later the $150 was increased to $500 - admitted they had made an error)
Compensation offers (no green/white sheet completed)
100K - May 5 (C$150 eCoupon; was moved to a functioning seat after meal service)
2017 Sept - 8,000 AE miles - reported via complaint web page after realizing it was a faulty seat, not standard discomfort; Asked for return of eUps but they declined.
2017 Nov & 2018 Feb - $500 coupons both times (second time on protest that $500 had been offered the previous time)
2018 Sep. $250 coupon (on a paid J TATL).
2018 Nov - $500 eCoupon (J TATL)
Standard eCoupon compensation offers (no haggling; following a recurring pattern)
~10+ hours: $1000
Long TPAC (TPE-YVR)
~6 to ~10 hours: $500
Short TPAC (NRT-YVR)
TATL
South America: YYZ-GRU
less than ~6 hours: 300
TCON
Have a Service Director (SD) That Is Giving You the Case of the Shrugs? Like the real life version of this ASCII emoji -> ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ ?
No success with the SD and/or crew rectifying your deflated seat and you can't be/aren't accommodated to another J seat? If you asked for a compensation form and the SD says they have no idea what you are talking about, you can use the below picture of the stub portion to help freshen their memory (better than nothing)...
Please note that for the longest time, the "Green Compensation Form" version was used, and there have been recent reports of the "White Compensation Form" replacing the Green version. Reports here have indicated that the two forms are virtually identical except for the colour.
There is now an even newer White Form which explicitly lists "deflated seat" and "deflated seat and fixed", among many other items.
Here is a snapshot of the NEWEST full form (as of August 2019), courtesy of lallied
https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/31421855-post2093.html
This is only the stub portion, courtesy of lallied
Mattress pads purchased and listed in this thread
View Deflated Seat History Here (Database for submitted occurrences)
Enter New Deflated Seat Occurrence Here (Submit one if you have experienced deflated seat and it will show up in the database above)
----
From post #49 in this thread, here's one potential way to (re)inflate an AC seat:
- Go the home screen "Your Seat". (find this on the seat side panel; not the main video screen)
- Hold the top left hand corner "Air Canada" (with AC logo) for 3 seconds. Updated (Apr 9 18): may need to hold for as long as 45 seconds for key pad to appear
- Dial pad shows up - hit 3-2-1.
- Press "Reset Lumbar Support"
A better method is for a crew member to use the reset switch under the seat, on the aisle side.
Compensation offers (green/white sheet completed)
40K AE- Apr 18 (50% back of the J class one way redemption)
2018 Jun - $500 coupon
2018 Sep $1,000 eCoupon or 40K AP (P fare TPAC)
2018 Sep $500 eCoupon (P fare TPAC) (no change on protest- update - 6 months later the $150 was increased to $500 - admitted they had made an error)
Compensation offers (no green/white sheet completed)
100K - May 5 (C$150 eCoupon; was moved to a functioning seat after meal service)
2017 Sept - 8,000 AE miles - reported via complaint web page after realizing it was a faulty seat, not standard discomfort; Asked for return of eUps but they declined.
2017 Nov & 2018 Feb - $500 coupons both times (second time on protest that $500 had been offered the previous time)
2018 Sep. $250 coupon (on a paid J TATL).
2018 Nov - $500 eCoupon (J TATL)
Standard eCoupon compensation offers (no haggling; following a recurring pattern)
~10+ hours: $1000
Long TPAC (TPE-YVR)
~6 to ~10 hours: $500
Short TPAC (NRT-YVR)
TATL
South America: YYZ-GRU
less than ~6 hours: 300
TCON
Have a Service Director (SD) That Is Giving You the Case of the Shrugs? Like the real life version of this ASCII emoji -> ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ ?
No success with the SD and/or crew rectifying your deflated seat and you can't be/aren't accommodated to another J seat? If you asked for a compensation form and the SD says they have no idea what you are talking about, you can use the below picture of the stub portion to help freshen their memory (better than nothing)...
Please note that for the longest time, the "Green Compensation Form" version was used, and there have been recent reports of the "White Compensation Form" replacing the Green version. Reports here have indicated that the two forms are virtually identical except for the colour.
There is now an even newer White Form which explicitly lists "deflated seat" and "deflated seat and fixed", among many other items.
Here is a snapshot of the NEWEST full form (as of August 2019), courtesy of lallied
https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/31421855-post2093.html
This is only the stub portion, courtesy of lallied
Mattress pads purchased and listed in this thread
Deflategate; new executive pods deflating in-flight
Sep 13, 2018, 9:15 am
#421
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: YQB
Programs: AC SE100K-1MM, Bonvoy Gold, HHonors Diamond, VIA Premier, NEXUS/GE
Posts: 816
Agreed. I'm also going to bet that people who fly in these very infrequently might not notice that they've deflated. Sure it's less comfortable, but if you've not had a good one it might be hard to know a bad one especially if it's only a partial deflate (as mine was). It really disincentives fixing them.
Sep 13, 2018, 4:41 pm
#422
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: London
Programs: AC E35K
Posts: 48
The worst part (IMO obvs) about the lower back only deflate is that it makes it feel like you're on a significant incline which is unsettling when trying to sleep.
Sep 13, 2018, 7:08 pm
#423
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Original Poster
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: SFO
Programs: AC SE MM, BA Gold, SQ Silver, Bonvoy Tit LTG, Hyatt Glob, HH Diamond
Posts: 44,347
I can remember quite a while ago trying to convince a SD that my seat had an issue because it "felt weird". She tried 1K and 2K and said they felt the same. I knew there was a difference.
But that was having flown them enough to realize it shouldn't feel like that. And even then I didn't realize the specific issue.
If you've never flown AC, and you sit on a deflated seat, you might just think "AC seats are uncomfortable", not "this seat has a problem".
Sep 13, 2018, 8:37 pm
#424
Join Date: Aug 2012
Programs: AC E35K, NEXUS
Posts: 4,368
Agreeing with cow. As I posted upthread, I was delighted to get my upgrade on the red eye TCON and Mr. FQ in the seat in front of me for a very rare taste of J on the Dreamliner. I was definitely unimpressed with the comfort, but just assumed AC intended it to be that uncomfortable. (In my defence, it's the same people that chose the banana bread. Not such a crazy assumption.)
It was long after the flight that I learned of Pancake Syndrome and when I did complain, I got a fraction of the "going rate" of AE miles. (The number of miles would have been satisfactory if AQM, but unimpressive as it was.)
It was long after the flight that I learned of Pancake Syndrome and when I did complain, I got a fraction of the "going rate" of AE miles. (The number of miles would have been satisfactory if AQM, but unimpressive as it was.)
Sep 13, 2018, 8:45 pm
#425
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: YVR, HNL
Programs: AS 75k, UA peon, BA Bronze, AC E50k, Marriott Plat, HH Diamond, Fairmont Plat (RIP)
Posts: 7,833
Agree with cow and fq above as well. Mr. Fink just flew an AC TATL this week. I asked him how AC compared with our usual choices and he said not bad but the seat was really hard and uncomfortable. I mentioned the deflating issue but he didn’t twig at the time that it was deflated - he just thought it was just a really hard seat. We have written in FWIW but he would much rather have had a good sleep than any measly discount code they may throw his way.
Sep 15, 2018, 8:54 pm
#427
Suspended
Join Date: Sep 2014
Programs: AC SE100K-1MM, NH, DL, AA, BA, Global Entry/Nexus, APEC..
Posts: 18,877
AHA! Same Fin, same seat and even the same flight #
So, do you think AC fixed this seat between this May pancake and the July one??????
Posted May 28, 2018 (post 321) - bolding mine
Posted Sept 11, 2018
NOTE: This AC 15 was flown on July 16
.
So, do you think AC fixed this seat between this May pancake and the July one??????
Posted May 28, 2018 (post 321) - bolding mine
May 27 AC15 FIN 702 Seat 11G
Deflated 4 times in-flight:
Take-off + 1hr
Take-off + 7hrs
Take-off + 10hrs
Take-off + 13hrs
After the initial deflation, asked the FA if I could re-inflate it. FA stated she hadn't seen it done so wanted me to show her. After deflate #4 , SD came asking for the code since he wasn't using the correct one.
And yes....comp form was asked for - and given - after the second deflate.
Deflated 4 times in-flight:
Take-off + 1hr
Take-off + 7hrs
Take-off + 10hrs
Take-off + 13hrs
After the initial deflation, asked the FA if I could re-inflate it. FA stated she hadn't seen it done so wanted me to show her. After deflate #4 , SD came asking for the code since he wasn't using the correct one.
And yes....comp form was asked for - and given - after the second deflate.
Posted Sept 11, 2018
NOTE: This AC 15 was flown on July 16
Data points, since I somehow thought we were keeping track of fins and pancake seats......
AC 15* Fin 702 Seat 11G. Flat as a pancake. No amount of button pressing or inflating mattered.
*We moved to 5D/G and neither IFE was functional. The people who had those seats had moved elsewhere.
AC 18 Fin 846 Seat 6A. Pancaked just after departure. Nowhere to go. Not amused.
Sure, cash back is a carrot but it's not fixing the seats.
Imagine if there was a Viagra option for AC's seats. lol
AC 15* Fin 702 Seat 11G. Flat as a pancake. No amount of button pressing or inflating mattered.
*We moved to 5D/G and neither IFE was functional. The people who had those seats had moved elsewhere.
AC 18 Fin 846 Seat 6A. Pancaked just after departure. Nowhere to go. Not amused.
Sure, cash back is a carrot but it's not fixing the seats.
Imagine if there was a Viagra option for AC's seats. lol
Last edited by 24left; Sep 15, 2018 at 9:12 pm Reason: correct dates of pancake
Sep 16, 2018, 1:38 pm
#428
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: YVR - MILLS Waypoint (It's the third house on the left)
Programs: AC*SE100K, wood level status in various other programs
Posts: 6,232
RE: FIN 702 Seat 11G
I guess there's only two possible explanations:
1) They fixed the seat but it went inoperable at least once since the fix
2) They didn't fix it due to either maintenance scheduling or it's totally foobar and can't be fixed
What shocks me the most is the elapsed time if it was Case #2 above. That's a lot of pax who may or may not have reported the issue but whom had less than the advertised quality of service for some/all of the flight. That's a lot of time spent by the Cabin Crew trying to fix seats instead of focusing on safety.
I haven't been privy to some of the 'insider' conversations some of you have been having with AC, but I'm beginning to think that the only fix is to get rid of these seats entirely. But, given how expensive an exercise that would be, I doubt very much that will happen.
In the meantime, AC will continue to piss off customers, waste the cabin crews time, and pay out small amounts of comp to those who complain loudly enough. I also suspect that AC is probably spending more time chasing the supplier of these pieces of excrement (to extract some form of compensation) than working on a real long term plan. But since they don't deem their best spenders important enough to inform them of either their awareness of the problem and what the solution will be, we are left in the dark.
For me, a functioning seat on long haul flights is far more important than KitKats, desserts, cocktails or any aspect of the meal service. I actually get stressed now when I get on on AC's 777 and 787 products. I now have to add an additional step to my pre-flight checklist and gird myself for a possible extended reboot cycle or the disruption of re-seating. I have the flexibility to choose, and this issue has caused me to rethink my flights between now and the end of the year, most of which I am now planning to take on other *A partners instead, starting with NH in a couple of weeks.
While some of us joke about cheapening the J cabin, AC is cheapening their much promoted Signature Class on these aircraft by over selling and under delivering. And as several FTers have noted, the only way to send AC management a message appears to be to vote with our feet. Or in this case, our butts.
1) They fixed the seat but it went inoperable at least once since the fix
2) They didn't fix it due to either maintenance scheduling or it's totally foobar and can't be fixed
What shocks me the most is the elapsed time if it was Case #2 above. That's a lot of pax who may or may not have reported the issue but whom had less than the advertised quality of service for some/all of the flight. That's a lot of time spent by the Cabin Crew trying to fix seats instead of focusing on safety.
I haven't been privy to some of the 'insider' conversations some of you have been having with AC, but I'm beginning to think that the only fix is to get rid of these seats entirely. But, given how expensive an exercise that would be, I doubt very much that will happen.
In the meantime, AC will continue to piss off customers, waste the cabin crews time, and pay out small amounts of comp to those who complain loudly enough. I also suspect that AC is probably spending more time chasing the supplier of these pieces of excrement (to extract some form of compensation) than working on a real long term plan. But since they don't deem their best spenders important enough to inform them of either their awareness of the problem and what the solution will be, we are left in the dark.
For me, a functioning seat on long haul flights is far more important than KitKats, desserts, cocktails or any aspect of the meal service. I actually get stressed now when I get on on AC's 777 and 787 products. I now have to add an additional step to my pre-flight checklist and gird myself for a possible extended reboot cycle or the disruption of re-seating. I have the flexibility to choose, and this issue has caused me to rethink my flights between now and the end of the year, most of which I am now planning to take on other *A partners instead, starting with NH in a couple of weeks.
While some of us joke about cheapening the J cabin, AC is cheapening their much promoted Signature Class on these aircraft by over selling and under delivering. And as several FTers have noted, the only way to send AC management a message appears to be to vote with our feet. Or in this case, our butts.
Sep 16, 2018, 1:46 pm
#429
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: MEX
Programs: AC E75K
Posts: 4,171
Just boarded AC57 and settled into 3K. For the past few days, was positively nervous that I’d end up with a deflated seat. So far so good, but who knows how long this holds. It’s rather unfortunate we now have to accept this as a realistic concern for every flight.
Sep 16, 2018, 2:45 pm
#430
Join Date: May 2013
Location: YYT/YYC/TPE
Programs: AC SE, UA, National Exec Elite, Nexus, GE
Posts: 1,810
+1
Just boarded AC57 and settled into 3K. For the past few days, was positively nervous that I’d end up with a deflated seat. So far so good, but who knows how long this holds. It’s rather unfortunate we now have to accept this as a realistic concern for every flight.
Sep 17, 2018, 4:25 am
#431
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: MEX
Programs: AC E75K
Posts: 4,171
+1
Just boarded AC57 and settled into 3K. For the past few days, was positively nervous that I’d end up with a deflated seat. So far so good, but who knows how long this holds. It’s rather unfortunate we now have to accept this as a realistic concern for every flight.
Next test: 2K on AC737 to SFO in an hour.
Sigh...
Sep 17, 2018, 9:26 am
#432
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: YVR
Programs: Bottom feeder Star Gold
Posts: 2,652
What are the advantages to playing AC's Lumbar Lottery when nonstop and other Star one-stop options exist on the SFO-DXB route? Is it that large a difference in availability, price or timing?
Sep 17, 2018, 9:31 am
#433
Suspended
Join Date: Sep 2014
Programs: AC SE100K-1MM, NH, DL, AA, BA, Global Entry/Nexus, APEC..
Posts: 18,877
Not sure I'd call them advantages. Let's call them "other reasons"
- corporate contract with AC
- earning AQM/AQD
- earning towards MM
- not all partners earn the same on Altitude or Aeroplan
- redemption tickets with Aeroplan (or other *A)
- non-stops flights on desired route
and so on
Those who can make choices to fly other *A or non-*A airlines do so, at least based on some posts on this forum.
.
Last edited by 24left; Sep 17, 2018 at 10:12 am Reason: grammar
Sep 17, 2018, 10:20 am
#434
Join Date: May 2018
Programs: AeroPlan
Posts: 23
I was sitting on AC119 on Thursday, september 13, YYZ to YVR - 2K. Sorry, don't have a FIN #
It deflated constantly. Gentleman in 1K taught the FA what to do and reset it for me and then I just did it myself throughout the whole flight. If that guy is on FT, thank you very much!
It deflated constantly. Gentleman in 1K taught the FA what to do and reset it for me and then I just did it myself throughout the whole flight. If that guy is on FT, thank you very much!
Sep 17, 2018, 11:51 am
#435
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: YVR - MILLS Waypoint (It's the third house on the left)
Programs: AC*SE100K, wood level status in various other programs
Posts: 6,232