Tracking you through the airport
Jan 20, 2015, 10:48 pm
#31
Suspended
Join Date: Sep 2014
Programs: AC SE100K-1MM, NH, DL, AA, BA, Global Entry/Nexus, APEC..
Posts: 18,877
At the rate AC updates its Android app I wouldn't be so sure that this feature will ever make it over 
I found an article which suggests Apple is purposefully making the spec difficult to be mirrored for use on Android devices anyway. I don't know enough about technology to know if this problem would require near-duplicate hardware throughout the airport.
I searched for info on how iBeacons work since none of the news articles I read in 2013 (when they were new) mentioned first downloading an app before walking around the Apple store. But it does seem like you need the app installed before messages can be received.
I therefore change my opinion to tentatively optimistic!
I found an article which suggests Apple is purposefully making the spec difficult to be mirrored for use on Android devices anyway. I don't know enough about technology to know if this problem would require near-duplicate hardware throughout the airport.I searched for info on how iBeacons work since none of the news articles I read in 2013 (when they were new) mentioned first downloading an app before walking around the Apple store. But it does seem like you need the app installed before messages can be received.
I therefore change my opinion to tentatively optimistic!
I read a lot about it last year on Mashable and similar sites
Given this quote, i can see how this might be helpful/useful to AC and pax - IF deployed properly.
"Apple's iBeacon relies on that communication technology to help enabled iOS apps communicate with strategically placed beacons so they can alert you to things like "your package is ready for pickup," "that painting you're looking at is by Da Vinci" and "you can buy that Apple TV" right here. Apps are a key component here, since, the beacons will not simply communicate with an iPhone and start delivering unwanted messages."
"Rob Garf, VP of Industry Strategy & Insight for Demandware, a digital commerce company said it depends on what's in it for them. "Consumers will embrace technology if there is material value such as greater convenience, service and personalization," he said. Garf added that though adoption can vary by segment and geographic location, digitization of the sales experience may be inevitable"
http://mashable.com/2014/02/05/apple-ibeacon-shop/
Jan 20, 2015, 11:06 pm
#32
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: YVR
Programs: AC:50K
Posts: 708
As long as this is optional, I'm going with awesome on this one. That said, given the general quality of AC IT, I expect I'll end up getting messages on my phone saying "your flight is now boarding, you need to leave the MLL and get down to gate 53" at the same time as I'm looking at flightaware and saying "hmm, the incoming flight is still half an hour away from landing, I guess we're going to be late leaving".
Jan 21, 2015, 5:45 am
#33
Join Date: Sep 2013
Programs: AC SE100K, AA EXP, SPG Plt, HH Dmnd
Posts: 1,507
I will be fine with this so long as they really integrate their software with data from BP (notable boarding zones) by flashing this during Zone 1 Boarding to everyone else.
Jan 21, 2015, 6:58 am
#34
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: YVR
Programs: OZ Diamond, Jiffypark Manhattan Gold
Posts: 4,485
Agreed, both awesome and terrifying. I'd love to get a legitimate alert for boarding.
My mobile BP always says :35 minutes for boarding but we all know that they're likely to not even start at T-30. A quick app message if they could send out a blast to anyone not scanned in past the gate agent somehow would be cool.
As a sidebar I love that some lounges (AV and I'm sure others) will announce "if you're on flight xxxx it's time to go" but AC (and I'm sure others, I know UA for sure) specifically say "WE DON'T MAKE ANNOUNCEMENTS". I'm still waiting for the day where they deny me entry to the lounge because it's time to board. I'll often show up at the lounge T-45 to dep to have a drink or cookie then basically leave at T-30 usually arriving before boarding has even started.
My mobile BP always says :35 minutes for boarding but we all know that they're likely to not even start at T-30. A quick app message if they could send out a blast to anyone not scanned in past the gate agent somehow would be cool.
As a sidebar I love that some lounges (AV and I'm sure others) will announce "if you're on flight xxxx it's time to go" but AC (and I'm sure others, I know UA for sure) specifically say "WE DON'T MAKE ANNOUNCEMENTS". I'm still waiting for the day where they deny me entry to the lounge because it's time to board. I'll often show up at the lounge T-45 to dep to have a drink or cookie then basically leave at T-30 usually arriving before boarding has even started.
Jan 21, 2015, 7:49 am
#35
Formerly known as tireman77
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 5,521
A real time alert for boarding would be great. Sitting in the lounge and getting a buzz when boarding is actually beginning.
Should the information be reliable, It would mean no waiting around the gate, getting up from the lounge, walking to the gate and boarding immediately. Very old school "Jet Set".
Should the information be reliable, It would mean no waiting around the gate, getting up from the lounge, walking to the gate and boarding immediately. Very old school "Jet Set".
Jan 21, 2015, 8:01 am
#36
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: MLL / AC Cafe
Programs: It's hard to get status when the website won't let me book flights.
Posts: 5,706
I actually know a company who could have done this for AC for about 12% of what IBM charges. - and it would actually work, which I am skeptical to see about the upcoming one.
Jan 21, 2015, 8:38 am
#37
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Canada
Programs: AC*SE
Posts: 1,924
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (BB10; Kbd) AppleWebKit/537.35+ (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/10.2.1.3442 Mobile Safari/537.35+)
Certain lounges seem to announce too much - YYC, etc. Hate hearing the loud overhead speaker.
That said, it would be great if the AC App or the boards in the airport showed Boarding status (even just yes/no if it has started boarding yet).
Originally Posted by drvannostren
Agreed, both awesome and terrifying. I'd love to get a legitimate alert for boarding.
My mobile BP always says :35 minutes for boarding but we all know that they're likely to not even start at T-30. A quick app message if they could send out a blast to anyone not scanned in past the gate agent somehow would be cool.
As a sidebar I love that some lounges (AV and I'm sure others) will announce "if you're on flight xxxx it's time to go" but AC (and I'm sure others, I know UA for sure) specifically say "WE DON'T MAKE ANNOUNCEMENTS". I'm still waiting for the day where they deny me entry to the lounge because it's time to board. I'll often show up at the lounge T-45 to dep to have a drink or cookie then basically leave at T-30 usually arriving before boarding has even started.
My mobile BP always says :35 minutes for boarding but we all know that they're likely to not even start at T-30. A quick app message if they could send out a blast to anyone not scanned in past the gate agent somehow would be cool.
As a sidebar I love that some lounges (AV and I'm sure others) will announce "if you're on flight xxxx it's time to go" but AC (and I'm sure others, I know UA for sure) specifically say "WE DON'T MAKE ANNOUNCEMENTS". I'm still waiting for the day where they deny me entry to the lounge because it's time to board. I'll often show up at the lounge T-45 to dep to have a drink or cookie then basically leave at T-30 usually arriving before boarding has even started.
That said, it would be great if the AC App or the boards in the airport showed Boarding status (even just yes/no if it has started boarding yet).
Jan 21, 2015, 8:43 am
#38
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: YYZ
Posts: 6,138
I'll go with terrifying.
Once you pair your phone with these things, I don't think there is really any such thing as "optional". There may be some nominal benefit in terms of flight updates (if they work), but the potential for misuse of data dwarfs any upside IMO. I've used the AA, AS and DL apps in the past month alone and they don't seem to need to know where I am to send me gate changes and delay info. They work just fine.
There is already abundant evidence that airports / telecoms surreptitiously provide tracking data to CSEC via "complimentary" wi-fi services as reported by the CBC last year. I don't see why BT identification data wouldn't be commandeered... if anything it's more data-rich than wi-fi detection.
Airports and airlines in Canada already know - generally speaking - where you are when in terminals or on planes. They know if you have checked in remotely or at a kiosk or with an agent. Your BP is scanned when checking a bag, going through security, and boarding the plane. Your passport or NEXUS card is scanned when needed. That's plenty enough data to both verify your identity, ascertain your general location and facilitate their operations.
This iBeacon stuff is way over the top, way too intrusive and quite frankly, sounds really annoying.
Once you pair your phone with these things, I don't think there is really any such thing as "optional". There may be some nominal benefit in terms of flight updates (if they work), but the potential for misuse of data dwarfs any upside IMO. I've used the AA, AS and DL apps in the past month alone and they don't seem to need to know where I am to send me gate changes and delay info. They work just fine.
There is already abundant evidence that airports / telecoms surreptitiously provide tracking data to CSEC via "complimentary" wi-fi services as reported by the CBC last year. I don't see why BT identification data wouldn't be commandeered... if anything it's more data-rich than wi-fi detection.
Airports and airlines in Canada already know - generally speaking - where you are when in terminals or on planes. They know if you have checked in remotely or at a kiosk or with an agent. Your BP is scanned when checking a bag, going through security, and boarding the plane. Your passport or NEXUS card is scanned when needed. That's plenty enough data to both verify your identity, ascertain your general location and facilitate their operations.
This iBeacon stuff is way over the top, way too intrusive and quite frankly, sounds really annoying.
Jan 21, 2015, 8:55 am
#39
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Why? Why? Zed! / Why? You? Elle! / Gee! Are You!
Programs: Irrelevant
Posts: 3,543
Not a bad idea - Isuppose
So it seems IBM has completed a project for AC, whereby they install iBeacons throughout the airport, and then anyone with the AC app is tracked as they roam around.
The GA gets a list of where everyone is, and can tell if you're at the gate, or in the lounge, or at check-in, or wherever.
It would also let them push more personalized messages to your device ("Move your butt out of the lounge, we're closing the door!").
Has anyone seen this in action? It's possible it hasn't been deployed yet, but the system has been built.
The GA gets a list of where everyone is, and can tell if you're at the gate, or in the lounge, or at check-in, or wherever.
It would also let them push more personalized messages to your device ("Move your butt out of the lounge, we're closing the door!").
Has anyone seen this in action? It's possible it hasn't been deployed yet, but the system has been built.
So, the percentage of the flying population that this could be applied to is what.....?
I guess only time will tell if this was a waste of money or not? Also which airports will have this? All or just the main ones like YYZ, YUL, YVR, YYC, YHZ, etc?
Jan 21, 2015, 8:57 am
#40
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Why? Why? Zed! / Why? You? Elle! / Gee! Are You!
Programs: Irrelevant
Posts: 3,543
Jan 21, 2015, 9:07 am
#41
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: MLL / AC Cafe
Programs: It's hard to get status when the website won't let me book flights.
Posts: 5,706
If I don't ever want to be tracked - don't allow iBeacon on my phone
If I don't want to be tracked at a certain time, turn off bluetooth
If I want to pick and choose which app / company can use iBeacon, I can.
As a consumer, I have way way way more control and the ability to control my information than with the current wifi tracking (if I want to use their wifi systems I am screwed)
Jan 21, 2015, 9:09 am
#42
Join Date: Jan 2007
Programs: No single airline or hotel chain is of much use to me anymore.
Posts: 3,279
Our landlord in Los Angeles is trying to sell us on this IBM iBeacon platform for parking, building access and building services.
We're skeptical because we think they want to use it to do away with assigned parking so they can over-sell it.
We're skeptical because we think they want to use it to do away with assigned parking so they can over-sell it.
Jan 21, 2015, 9:24 am
#43
Join Date: May 2004
Location: yyz
Programs: AC*SE 1MM. a bunch of hotel programs.
Posts: 1,592
Big Brother indeed.
Jan 21, 2015, 10:13 am
#44
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Original Poster
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: SFO
Programs: AC SE MM, BA Gold, SQ Silver, Bonvoy Tit LTG, Hyatt Glob, HH Diamond
Posts: 44,347
At the rate AC updates its Android app I wouldn't be so sure that this feature will ever make it over I found an article which suggests Apple is purposefully making the spec difficult to be mirrored for use on Android devices anyway. I don't know enough about technology to know if this problem would require near-duplicate hardware throughout the airport.
I searched for info on how iBeacons work since none of the news articles I read in 2013 (when they were new) mentioned first downloading an app before walking around the Apple store. But it does seem like you need the app installed before messages can be received.
I therefore change my opinion to tentatively optimistic!
I found an article which suggests Apple is purposefully making the spec difficult to be mirrored for use on Android devices anyway. I don't know enough about technology to know if this problem would require near-duplicate hardware throughout the airport.I searched for info on how iBeacons work since none of the news articles I read in 2013 (when they were new) mentioned first downloading an app before walking around the Apple store. But it does seem like you need the app installed before messages can be received.
I therefore change my opinion to tentatively optimistic!
Also, the information I have about this specific project for AC explicitly mentions that it only works for passengers with the iOS or Android app installed.
Jan 21, 2015, 10:40 am
#45
Suspended
Join Date: Sep 2014
Programs: AC SE100K-1MM, NH, DL, AA, BA, Global Entry/Nexus, APEC..
Posts: 18,877
iBeacon me
I will let AC notify me that boarding has started
I don't mind being tracked in Victoria's Secret (could be amusing)
I will let them see me buy tsk-tsk party snacks at duty-free
(esp if they can zip me a coupon code to use at check-out)
I will even let them buzz me in the lounge bathroom
ONLY IF I GET AQMs !!!!!!! No free lunch, baby
I don't mind being tracked in Victoria's Secret
(could be amusing)I will let them see me buy tsk-tsk party snacks at duty-free
(esp if they can zip me a coupon code to use at check-out)
I will even let them buzz me in the lounge bathroom
ONLY IF I GET AQMs !!!!!!! No free lunch, baby