STS-134

The folks at Amex clearly think that the reason people are going for the CSR is the benefits (travel credit, Priority Pass, etc) and not the points for spend. I think they are misguided. I hold the CSR for the bonus points. The benefits are only there to offset the annual fee; I'd get the CSR even if it had no annual fee and no travel credit and no Priority Pass. But here's what I don't get: even if we do assume that people are getting the CSR for the benefits, why does Amex give us benefits that are annoying, difficult, or impossible to use? The new Uber credit, broken up into $15 increments that must be used or lost each month, is a good example of this.

Dieuwer

Because AMEX is run on pure greed: Charge vendors more than the competition to accept AMEX cards, charge higher AFs than the competition, give "benefits " that only can be used with one provider (e.g. airline credit, private transport credit), only give high points when shopping at the AMEX "company store", etc.

drwilliams

And Chase runs on?

4aks

AMEX is making things ("benefits") way too hard ... the plenti network is worthwhile, but I have to login to the website on a full size browser (few people want to do that vs mobile app) , then somehow navigate to the plenti exchange (this takes effort) and enter several verifications (vs a fingerprint verification on a mobile app) ... it's a waste of time to get my 1% credit

No one wants to have their time wasted

ats262

+1. Outside of the US, I find AmEx hard to be accepted to the point where I often don't even bother asking anymore and just handover my CSR Visa card. Within the US, I don't have too much of a problem with Amex acceptance.

JHake10

I was at a restaurant in Budapest once and we went to pay with a Visa. The waiter said "we only accept American Express or cash". Besides that one experience, I normally don't even bother with AMEX outside the US.

jediwho

You mean net of $300 or less depending on whether you use Uber credits for personal card and GoGo for Business. Also, the GoGo passes are valid on international flights.

gsxsilver

There are very few restaurant can say its customers "needs" them, the vast majority of restaurants needs their customers. While I do carry a visa I default to amex; any restaurant who causes annoyance/embarrassment by not accepting my prefer form of payment is going to have offer some incentive to have me as a repeat customer. Very few places are established enough to have the type of pull to limit forms of payment.

Regardless of the posted annual fee on premium credit cards; end of year out of pocket expense is easily brought down to ~100. Factoring out the one time sign up bonus and double dipping on the first year, chase would actually charge me a higher fee on the csr than amex on the plat (even with the increase annual fee).

Noctilum

CSR is simply more flexible for me, both in acceptance and benefit usage. Combine that with a lower annual fee, and how it amplifies the point value of other Chase cards that earn UR points, it really just pays for me to stay in the Chase family.

SchmeckFlyer

Outside the USA, many retailers do not accept AMEX as it is simply too expensive to process. I just spent two months in the Caribbean and after being refused so often, I just put my AMEX card away. In countries like the Netherlands where credit card use is increasing, acceptance of AMEX on the other hand still remains quite low. I once asked a retailer "Do you take AMEX" and she responded with one word "Never".

I personally think the lower rate of acceptance is a big reason many 'millennials' may not want to get an AMEX card. They want a card that works, not a card that might be refused. They want to be able to have their interesting experiences abroad easily paid for and avoid hassle at the cashier, not the ability to flash a bit of tacky plastic/metal. Speaking for myself, I got rid of my Platinum due to acceptance problems outside the USA. I recently told KLM of my opinion that they need to ditch AMEX in favour of VISA or MasterCard.

And Shanghai is not in Japan.

Explorer789

Acceptance is one aspect of it. But here in the states, pretty much everyone takes Amex except some small businesses and family-run restaurants. When shopping online, everyone seems to take amex as well.

CSR is definitely what I would use internationally. In the states, I would always use what gets me the most benefit for a particular purchase.

tmiw

I've actually run into an online store that didn't take AmEx. My electric/gas utility doesn't accept AmEx either--only Visa/MC. As you mention, though, that definitely isn't common.

(Conversely, Comic-Con registration didn't accept Discover this year, but did accept AmEx. That seems kinda weird for such a high-profile event.)

gregsfortytwo

Hardly. The folks at Amex are stuck between a rock and a hard place -- they need to make money off of interchange and annual fees. Chase has been quite open about the fact they expect the CSR customer base to be hugely profitable *because* they're going to sell mortgage and other banking services to them. Even with the extra Infinite interchange rates, they lose money upfront on every restaurant and travel purchase, and they need to make it back off of unbonused spend, interest charges, and other income from the customer.

Amex, meanwhile, is still trying to enable interest income off of their Platinum cardmembers (by enrolling people in their Pay over Time feature), and really has nowhere else to send them to capture more banking services value. So the only way for them to compete at all is to offer benefits which are worth more to consumers than they cost Amex to provide. Thus the focus on hotel statuses and Delta lounge access (presumably negotiated in bulk), on Uber credits (certainly bought at a discount, and for less than face value), and airline incidental fee credits (which not everybody will fully use). Offering 3x points on everything would mean they lose money on every swipe with no way to make it back! (That's also obviously why Amex has maximum rebates on their premium cards like BCP. Chase does the same with the Freedom, because they don't expect to make enough money off that target market to allow unlimited bonuses.)

Personally, I suspect I'll be holding on to my CSR and Platinum for similar lengths of time -- until my current travel patterns shift enough they're not not worth it. I've got work sending me on trips about every quarter and have to travel (sometimes overseas) whenever I want to see family, so I easily spend enough on travel and dining to make the CSR annual fee worth it. But Delta SkyClub access and Gold hotel status (which I could never make on my own, but which I travel enough to really appreciate) are worth much more than the cost of a Platinum's un-rebatable annual fee (especially since I have a decent investment account at Schwab -- and while I've got it I might as well put flights on it). If Amex cut those less-quantifiable travel benefits in exchange for higher spend earnings rates I'd probably dump it, unless they were losing so much money on the card it was more valuable to me than the CSR.

terryversay

This is what I meant One * can * drive a car himself around the town, but given other factors, he might choose to call a taxi/Uber. I think the idea behind is quite similar. For me, it is more than 30min. Restaurants (and even hotels) for a 7d trip to London. Theatre tickets, and one-day trip to the Stonehenge...The concierge service has saved quite some time for me.

jamesinclair

I think the article is spot on. Amex comes off as pretentious. I wouldnt want to pull one out at a first date because it sends a message that I am trying to impress with cash, which is not cool. Sharing pictures of my last trip? That involves a lot more money, but doesn't come off as pretentious at all.

And it doesnt help that I have zero inventive to swipe the amex, ever.

Corporate, if youre reading this, I am a millennial, I have have a PRG for 3 years, and I think I am about to cancel.