View Poll Results: Is an American Airlines/US Airways merger good for the traveling public?
Yes
84
28.19%
No
214
71.81%
Voters: 298. You may not vote on this poll
Nov 12, 2013, 2:24 pm
Last edit by: aztimm
Note:
There is an existing thread in the AA forum that may be useful to US and AA Flyertalkers:
US-AA Merger: Just the Facts thread
As facts become posted, that should be the place to look.
Merger discussion, speculation, and other questions can be directed here, or the similar thread in the AA forum:
MERGER: US and AA 9 Dec 2013 and implications for AA flyers (new)
AA - US Merger Agreement / Announcement / DOJ Action Discussion (consolidated, and now closed to new posts)
There is an existing thread in the AA forum that may be useful to US and AA Flyertalkers:
US-AA Merger: Just the Facts thread
As facts become posted, that should be the place to look.
Merger discussion, speculation, and other questions can be directed here, or the similar thread in the AA forum:
MERGER: US and AA 9 Dec 2013 and implications for AA flyers (new)
AA - US Merger Agreement / Announcement / DOJ Action Discussion (consolidated, and now closed to new posts)
US/AA merger- MASTER DISCUSSION THREAD/incl 'when will US leave STAR'
Dec 4, 2013, 4:31 pm
#2521
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: SYR
Programs: US/AA-Platinum, Hilton-Diamond, Marriott-Gold, AVIS-Presidents Club, National-Executive Elite
Posts: 2,755
Dec 4, 2013, 4:56 pm
#2522
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: High Point, NC
Programs: None
Posts: 9,171
I think it's a safe bet that you'll be able to get either AA or US miles, assuming that the trips are after 1/7/14. Unless you need them for 2014 CP status I guess it doesn't matter which you credit to.
Anything else is anyone's guess. You might take a look at the AAdvantage top tier benefits though I don't know how much that will really help. I just can't picture AA giving US FFs but not AA FFs unlimited FC upgrades and that sort of thing.
Jim
Anything else is anyone's guess. You might take a look at the AAdvantage top tier benefits though I don't know how much that will really help. I just can't picture AA giving US FFs but not AA FFs unlimited FC upgrades and that sort of thing.
Jim
Dec 4, 2013, 6:06 pm
#2523
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: ONT
Programs: AA Gold, WN A-, UA S, HH ♦, IHG Spire, Hertz Prez O, TSA Disparager
Posts: 2,159
From AA.com
I did not find anything similar on the US website.
The New American
In our plans to combine with US Airways, we will continue bringing you the unparalleled service and rewards you've come to expect as a member of our AAdvantage® program. At this time, American and US Airways will remain separate companies and each airline will maintain its current loyalty program – our AAdvantage program and US Airways Dividend Miles. You will not earn AAdvantage miles on US Airways flights, but your AAdvantage Miles are secure and existing miles will continue to be honored. Likewise, your elite qualifying miles and your elite status, including lifetime status granted under the AAdvantage Million MilerSM are secure and remain intact. And, as always, you can continue to book, track and manage flights and your AAdvantage account on aacom.
In our plans to combine with US Airways, we will continue bringing you the unparalleled service and rewards you've come to expect as a member of our AAdvantage® program. At this time, American and US Airways will remain separate companies and each airline will maintain its current loyalty program – our AAdvantage program and US Airways Dividend Miles. You will not earn AAdvantage miles on US Airways flights, but your AAdvantage Miles are secure and existing miles will continue to be honored. Likewise, your elite qualifying miles and your elite status, including lifetime status granted under the AAdvantage Million MilerSM are secure and remain intact. And, as always, you can continue to book, track and manage flights and your AAdvantage account on aacom.
Dec 4, 2013, 8:14 pm
#2524
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Stuck Between the Moon and CLD or SAN, Your local Taco Bell
Programs: AA EXP/LT PLT, DL PM, UA Silver, SPG Plat, Marriott Plat, Hyatt Globalist
Posts: 3,510
Note the use of "At this time" in the post above. I suspect you'll see that change next week when they announce what exactly "reciprocal benefits" really is for 1/7/14.
Dec 5, 2013, 7:55 am
#2525
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 462
I decided to wait on booking a mid-January transcon and am instead waiting on some announcements next week. Hopefully they release the full plan then and fares are still the same.
Dec 5, 2013, 8:01 am
#2526
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 755
Jim:
Given the east-west animosity, what is the picture on integrating 3 pilot groups?
Reading another board, it seems that nothing much has changed - and now another merger again throws the lists into chaos - is this going to be even uglier or is there an acceptable solution on the table?
Given the east-west animosity, what is the picture on integrating 3 pilot groups?
Reading another board, it seems that nothing much has changed - and now another merger again throws the lists into chaos - is this going to be even uglier or is there an acceptable solution on the table?
Dec 5, 2013, 8:05 am
#2527
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 462
Over on the AA board there are also reports of AAngels (Admirals Club employees) telling flyers that reciprocal club access is starting on January 6th (although it seems January 7th would make more sense). Good news as my current home airport of SNA has only a United and American club and I was worried about losing access.
Anyone know the general features of Admiral's Clubs? Pros/cons to USAirways clubs?
Anyone know the general features of Admiral's Clubs? Pros/cons to USAirways clubs?
Dec 5, 2013, 8:46 am
#2528
Join Date: May 2008
Location: NYC
Programs: DL PM; UA 1K; AA 1MM
Posts: 4,520
Seating is comfortable, snacks are very bare, actual food is available for purchase. Certain beer and house liquor is complimentary. The staff at the AC are top quality and are amazing when you need help, especially during IRROPS. All clubs (IME) have computers and printers.
Dec 5, 2013, 9:18 am
#2529
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: High Point, NC
Programs: None
Posts: 9,171
The issue in this trial is more centered on representation. USAPA insists that only it can represent all US pilots, east and west, and that nothing ties it's hands in doing that. So it can take an opening stance using the list it has wanted since it's formation - straight DOH. The company and west pilots are effectively saying "hold on there - USAPA (controlled by the east majority) - can't claim to represent all the US pilots while at the same time promising to start with a east/west integrated list that favors east pilots at the expense of west pilots." The company has filed this time to get a judge's ruling that the west can have separate representation in negotiations/arbitration to arrive at an integrated US/AA pilot seniority list. Of course, that's the last thing that USAPA wants.
A new wrinkle is the US/US pilots MOU, which is basically a new contract when the corporate merger is concluded. During voting on that MOU, USAPA was telling everyone who would listen that it was neutral on the east/west seniority issue. Of course, as soon as the MOU passed member ratification that changed and a small provision added by USAPA is claimed to "wipe the slate clean" and allow USAPA carte blanche.
There's also another wrinkle - the US/APA MOU gives a timeline for what most consider will be USAPA losing a representative election and ceasing to exist, courtesy of the APA majority. Of course, among east pilots there is talk that USAPA would still represent US pilots (east and west) until the seniority issue is settled - a position that runs totally contrary to NMB rules which only allow one representative body at a time once the election is held.
Jim
Dec 5, 2013, 10:03 am
#2530
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: SEA
Posts: 3,955
Sounds like it's time to dump the unions and start over. That sounds more like entrenched union management than it does the actual pilots themselves, unless I'm misunderstanding. Are the rank and file east/west union members actually ok with the posturing? I suppose if it does represent how the actual pilots want to handle things, it's legitimate.
Dec 5, 2013, 10:22 am
#2531
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2001
Location: LAX; AA EXP, MM; HH Gold
Posts: 31,789
I've long speculated that the pilot seniority issue will be settled via arbitration, and that the arbitration panel will integrate the AA pilots and the US pilots by combining just two lists: the APA seniority list and the George Nicolau-prepared list that the East pilots have never recognized and was the reason they left ALPA and formed the USAPA.
The East pilots will not be all that happy with the outcome but unlike last time, they won't have the votes to form yet another union in an attempt to run away from the binding arbitration result.
The East pilots will not be all that happy with the outcome but unlike last time, they won't have the votes to form yet another union in an attempt to run away from the binding arbitration result.
Dec 5, 2013, 10:22 am
#2532
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: High Point, NC
Programs: None
Posts: 9,171
Not actively working, and haven't been since before this blew up with the arbitrator's ruling in 2007, it's hard for me to judge the sentiment of the east pilots other than to say that it's probably mixed - some just want it over and at least the vocal minority want what they consider the due, most west pilots at the bottom of the combined list.
Like politics anywhere else, different factions want different things including their way.
Jim
Like politics anywhere else, different factions want different things including their way.
Jim
Dec 5, 2013, 11:47 am
#2533
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: EWR
Programs: AA Exec Plat, United MM Gold, Hyatt Glob, Marriott Platinum, Packer Owner
Posts: 262
I am EWR-based and two days ago I stopped in the Admirals Club there to see if I could get any intel. The AAngel there said she'd heard that Club reciprocity would happen December 9th, the date the merger takes effect. Here's hoping....
Dec 5, 2013, 12:26 pm
#2534
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 755
I've long speculated that the pilot seniority issue will be settled via arbitration, and that the arbitration panel will integrate the AA pilots and the US pilots by combining just two lists: the APA seniority list and the George Nicolau-prepared list that the East pilots have never recognized and was the reason they left ALPA and formed the USAPA.
The East pilots will not be all that happy with the outcome but unlike last time, they won't have the votes to form yet another union in an attempt to run away from the binding arbitration result.
The East pilots will not be all that happy with the outcome but unlike last time, they won't have the votes to form yet another union in an attempt to run away from the binding arbitration result.
Since they have no dog in the Nic fight, if they are happy with merging the Nic list, that's what should happen.
Nic attempted to keep everyone's relative position the same (If Jim says otherwise, I would take his word for it), which is the only "fair" way to do it, but we all know how fair life can be!
Dec 5, 2013, 12:35 pm
#2535
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 755
Sounds like it's time to dump the unions and start over. That sounds more like entrenched union management than it does the actual pilots themselves, unless I'm misunderstanding. Are the rank and file east/west union members actually ok with the posturing? I suppose if it does represent how the actual pilots want to handle things, it's legitimate.
Throw in the larger pilot group from AA, and how long they can hold on to that position becomes unclear.
Hopefully it can get resolved now.