19103_aa

On a recent flight from PHL-LAS I assisted a woman with an eye problem, which believe it or not, turned out to be complicated. More complicating was the fact she was in F and had enjoyed a few too many Gin & Tonics prior to my interventions.

I didn't expect anything. I explained to her I was providing services as a Good Samaritan (with the FA as a witness).

I was grateful the pilot got a priority landing and we arrived in LAS 1 hr early!

LondonElite

Also here

Rudi

I only notice now, that this same topic (by the same poster) has been posted twice here in the UA forum

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/Forum50/HTML/026704.html

RobotDoctor

What ever happened to helping another person for the sake of being a humanitarian? I would think that the Hippocratic oath is more important than a free ticket. What if there were no free tickets for patient assistance in flight, then would doctors/nurses allow people to suffer and possibly die on an aircraft? If the airline approaches a person and offers this for medical attention provided on board then great, call it a bonus. However, when a doctor approaches the airline for doing what is the right thing to do then it sounds like the doctor is looking for a handout. I realize that doctors/nurses fly on their own time but I would think that the mission of their profession is to aid the ailing at any time. It appears to me that this responsibility comes with the job.

However, maciek504, best of luck in you pursuit for a complimentary ticket.

Rudi

I would expect the airline (for which the medical assistance was as much helpfull as for the sick passenger) to voluntarly compensate the MD for his help and the 2-hours travel-discomfort 'suffered', with some kind of future 'flight-comforting', like an international one-class upgrade voucher good on any fare.

Unfortunately I have experienced, that some (non USA nationality) medical persons known personally to me, were very reluctant to offer any medical help on flights of US-carriers - they argued that they are afraid of possible claims/recompensation for 'damages' later for 'bad-treatment' under US-'laws/juries/whatever' (and that their professional insurance doesn't cover them when outside their home-country) ...

I sure wouldn't mind maciek504 being on the same flight as I if I am in need ... thank you.

maciek504

I was approached and asked by FA to provide medical services at the time when I was sleeping. A Dr in front of my name identified me. Spending 2hrs on the floor of the galley attending very sick child was not exactly as sitting in my business class seat. On top of it, I could have easily adviced the pilot to divert, making sure that I am not going to be held responsible for possible liability to myself and hours and legal expenses spent in the court fighting malpractice lawyers if anything went wrong. Have B Watson and UnitedSkies thought about it? It is quite a difference to be a MD in the office/hospital than in the air. I have gladly helped and I suggest that everybody else--lawyers/financial advicers, etc. next time while on the plane, instead of playing Solitaire or watching movies, provide their services to the airline or passengers in need of it.

ade99

I have to support maciek504 and have to say that I'm really disappointed in some peoples response to his post.

Being a doctor here in the UK means six years at medical school then at least eight years as a junior doctor working roughly 65 hours weeks each week for most of your life.

We therefore have quite limited leave and as so try to make the most of it. We don't fly for business purposes (I wish) and so there is a high probability that when we are onboard a plane it is purely pleasure orientated.

Actually we no longer take the hypocratic oath but something like it, and yes doctors do become doctors to help people (I guess it's like our calling - maybe we're just like priests and nunns)

However I'm not sure anyone unless you are a doctor can understand the complete dread of a situation when you are asked if there is a doctor on board. We are a few miles above the ground, in a metal tube, with hundreds of people in close proximity and very limited medical supplies (even on the best airlines the medical kits are very small).

When we work on the ground we have numerous pieces of equipment and staff to help and support us. So when you find yourself in a plane with no-one to help and very little equipment miles from any other assistance it's just you. The feelings of helplessness at trying to be able to resuscitate a patient in cardiac arrest and the patients family and everyone else looking at you, an asthmatic where there is only one amplue of salbutamol with an airport being at least two hours away or a baby fitting due to a severe infection with no anti-biotics available for other an hour and the mother crying desperate for here baby to stop fitting is undescribable.

This will often mark the start or end of your holiday. So I think it is appropriate for the airline to at least say thank-you. And yes why shouldn't our dedication to patient care be recognised by a small thank-you from the airline. Those of you who are a bit critical of maciek504 should ask themselves this:

If that was my husband, wife or child who's heart stopped beating at 37,000 and the doctor managed to bring them back to spend the rest of you lives togetether, then why shouldn't the airline say thankyou?

maciek504

I was approached and asked by FA to provide medical services at the time when I was sleeping. A Dr in front of my name identified me. Spending 2hrs on the floor of the galley attending very sick child was not exactly as sitting in my business class seat. On top of it, I could have easily adviced the pilot to divert, making sure that I am not going to be held responsible for possible liability to myself and hours and legal expenses spent in the court fighting malpractice lawyers if anything went wrong. Have B Watson and UnitedSkies thought about it? It is quite a difference to be a MD in the office/hospital than in the air. I have gladly helped and I suggest that everybody else--lawyers/financial advicers, etc. next time while on the plane, instead of playing Solitaire or watching movies, provide their services to the airline or passengers in need of it.

RobotDoctor

I agree that spending 2 hours aiding a very sick girl is not the same as sleeping in a business class seat. From where I sit, aiding the sick child is more important than anything we can do on an airplane. While I certainly respect your position maciek504, just read to your last post again. It sounds like you are angry that you were bothered. Remember the oath you took and the lifestyle you have due to your profession. If you wish not to be bothered on an aircraft in the future, I suggest that you drop the Dr. on your profile and be referred to as something else. If this is not possible then you either have to accept that you might be asked to provide your services in situations like this or stop traveling. I can guarantee that if the aircraft is suffering from an engineering/technical standpoint, I would be the first to offer assistance to the crew as this is my profession.

I am in hopes that if I travel with my children and they become very sick that some kind doctor will be more than happy to offer their assistance instead of being bothered from their nap in their business class seat.

[This message has been edited by RobotDoctor (edited Mar 09, 2004).]

maciek504

[QUOTE]Originally posted by maciek504:
[b]Spending 2hrs on the floor of the galley attending very sick child was not exactly as sitting in my business class seat.


All that I meant was that I was approached by a FA rather than showing up as a volunteer. I would have done it if I had heard it (done it many times in the past). Maybe you are right and I should remove Dr from my profile. After all, there are many MDs on the board, who don`t even bother to ask what`s the problem. Sitting comfortably in your seat, sipping champagne and complaining about everything and everyone (mostly about UA), is more appealing to most travellers. I like flying UA and I advice all those who complain--start buying business/first class tickets and the airline will do much better. They will be able to afford their own MDs on the board then and nobody will be inquiring for a "thank you" note anymore.

maciek504

answering JLEA question:

Yes, I did show a medical ID, my name, address and business card were collected, I did use the medical kit from the cockpit, filed the papers, etc.

For ALL of you, who talk about the oath, read it before making any comments. You are MISTAKEN in your assumption.

tfong007

Why is the airline responsible for compensation? Shouldn't it come from the parents of the child if anyone?

Isn't it a good thing to help someone in their time of need even though there is some self sacrifice required? Did you make the little girl sign a disclaimer before you assisted?

What has this world come to?

SkiAdcock

I don't think when he assisted his main thought was if I do this I'll get something. The expectation was set afterwards in his mind when the FA mentioned it.

At minimum, a thank you note from UA (and the patient); possibly more like a future upgrade cert. Obviously, that's not going to happen if he hasn't heard from UA by now & is unfortunate.

However, in the scheme of karma, it will come back to him in a positive manner sometime in the future. I, for one, am thankful for docs like him & others who do step up to the plate in not so great circumstances, and that might have to do in terms of his receiving anything.



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Sharon

USLurker

Obviously, some of the posters do not understand the medical malpractice crisis in many states. Of course the airline should give you some sort of bonus for stepping up and offering to help out--they give out compensation when you volunteer to give up your seat. Why not in this situation? You are helping them out. The doctor, in all likelihood, helped the airline to avoid all sorts of fees and costs for not diverting the plane, helped them to avoid having angry passengers because of missed connections and ruined vacation plans, and the doc coming forward probably helped to keep the pax calm because assistance was being rendered.

EsquireFlyer

Is your position that "no one is expected to respond" changed now that the doctor has explained he was approached personally at his seat and asked to help?

Also, what's this about an oath? If you refer to the Hippocratic Oath, read it before you cite it. It says only that the physician is to take care of "him who taught me this Art" and teach medicine to his sons "without fee or stipulation." That is LIMITED TO "him who taught me this Art"--that is, the physician should not bill his teacher. This is a reasonable promise.

The remainder of the oath, however, stresses DOING NO HARM.

There is nothing about being OBLIGATED to help, or of following Good-Samaritan mandates.

It does say that the physician will aim to offer help--but does not say that this help should be free (whereas helping his teacher, which is specifically required to be free--this was not merely an oversight).

There is certainly nothing about being on-call 24/7 to provide free services without expecting compensation even while putting onself in harm's way (both because of risk of injury/illness and by placing oneself at risk for liability lawsuits).

Two versions of the text for your reference.

http://www.euthanasia.com/oathtext.html

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/doctors...classical.html