Best Practices for Filing EU 261 Claims Against United? {Archive}
Mar 17, 2019, 3:28 pm
#1261
Suspended
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: DCA
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Posts: 50,262
EC 261/2004 delay compensation is not due from AC. The MAX was grounded by government (EU) order and that is a sufficient "extraordinary circumstance" as one need not analyze what AC could have done (short of, perhaps, bribing the EASA not to issue its order.
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Mar 17, 2019, 3:36 pm
#1262
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: 4éme
Posts: 12,045
Guess they could have selected Airbus over Boeing!
Mar 24, 2019, 1:31 pm
#1263
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: AMS
Programs: Emirates Skywards, UA Mileage Plus, Hilton Gold
Posts: 23
I had a recent experience with United's customer service regarding a EU Regulation 261/2004 claim. We flew AMS-IAD-LAX and arrived on time. After a plane change and 2h20 wait we were supposed to fly to LAX but due to technical issues they had to fly in a new plane. We departed IAD 5 hours later than scheduled and arrived at 1am at LAX. Upon arrival we saw we got a ETC token of appreciation for $100 for a 5 hour delay via email.
When we got back home we filed a compensation claim for 600 euros each under EU Regulation 261/2004. That was rejected at least 6 times within 24 hours by the same employee. She rejected the claim because United is a non-EU carrier and the delay occurred in the US. I substantiated multiple times with the right EU Court of Justice judgments but she wouldn't admit. She gave us, without asking, a ETC of $150 for the delay. I was not allowed to have my claim forwarded to a supervisor. I ended up writing a complaint to the head of customer services. She passed on my claim to, guess what, the same employee who previously turned down my claim 6 times. It's a prime example where a customer service employee does not have the legal knowledge of EU CoJ judgments and how to interpret them.
I filed a complaint with the Dutch Inspectorate who passed on my complaint to United and we got a notice from United two week later that they would pay out 1200 euros for us. We were asked to provice payment details and a week later the money was in our account. The Dutch Inspectorate justified our complaint.
I'm reading conflicting messages, but I can't redeem the two ETC's in a single payment for a flight right?
When we got back home we filed a compensation claim for 600 euros each under EU Regulation 261/2004. That was rejected at least 6 times within 24 hours by the same employee. She rejected the claim because United is a non-EU carrier and the delay occurred in the US. I substantiated multiple times with the right EU Court of Justice judgments but she wouldn't admit. She gave us, without asking, a ETC of $150 for the delay. I was not allowed to have my claim forwarded to a supervisor. I ended up writing a complaint to the head of customer services. She passed on my claim to, guess what, the same employee who previously turned down my claim 6 times. It's a prime example where a customer service employee does not have the legal knowledge of EU CoJ judgments and how to interpret them.
I filed a complaint with the Dutch Inspectorate who passed on my complaint to United and we got a notice from United two week later that they would pay out 1200 euros for us. We were asked to provice payment details and a week later the money was in our account. The Dutch Inspectorate justified our complaint.
I'm reading conflicting messages, but I can't redeem the two ETC's in a single payment for a flight right?
Mar 24, 2019, 2:58 pm
#1264
Moderator: United Airlines
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Mar 24, 2019, 4:23 pm
#1265
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Australia
Posts: 2,814
I had a recent experience with United's customer service regarding a EU Regulation 261/2004 claim. We flew AMS-IAD-LAX and arrived on time. After a plane change and 2h20 wait we were supposed to fly to LAX but due to technical issues they had to fly in a new plane. We departed IAD 5 hours later than scheduled and arrived at 1am at LAX. Upon arrival we saw we got a ETC token of appreciation for $100 for a 5 hour delay via email.
When we got back home we filed a compensation claim for 600 euros each under EU Regulation 261/2004. That was rejected at least 6 times within 24 hours by the same employee. She rejected the claim because United is a non-EU carrier and the delay occurred in the US. I substantiated multiple times with the right EU Court of Justice judgments but she wouldn't admit. She gave us, without asking, a ETC of $150 for the delay. I was not allowed to have my claim forwarded to a supervisor. I ended up writing a complaint to the head of customer services. She passed on my claim to, guess what, the same employee who previously turned down my claim 6 times. It's a prime example where a customer service employee does not have the legal knowledge of EU CoJ judgments and how to interpret them.
I filed a complaint with the Dutch Inspectorate who passed on my complaint to United and we got a notice from United two week later that they would pay out 1200 euros for us. We were asked to provice payment details and a week later the money was in our account. The Dutch Inspectorate justified our complaint.
I'm reading conflicting messages, but I can't redeem the two ETC's in a single payment for a flight right?
When we got back home we filed a compensation claim for 600 euros each under EU Regulation 261/2004. That was rejected at least 6 times within 24 hours by the same employee. She rejected the claim because United is a non-EU carrier and the delay occurred in the US. I substantiated multiple times with the right EU Court of Justice judgments but she wouldn't admit. She gave us, without asking, a ETC of $150 for the delay. I was not allowed to have my claim forwarded to a supervisor. I ended up writing a complaint to the head of customer services. She passed on my claim to, guess what, the same employee who previously turned down my claim 6 times. It's a prime example where a customer service employee does not have the legal knowledge of EU CoJ judgments and how to interpret them.
I filed a complaint with the Dutch Inspectorate who passed on my complaint to United and we got a notice from United two week later that they would pay out 1200 euros for us. We were asked to provice payment details and a week later the money was in our account. The Dutch Inspectorate justified our complaint.
I'm reading conflicting messages, but I can't redeem the two ETC's in a single payment for a flight right?
What is the Dutch Inspectorate ?
Mar 25, 2019, 3:35 am
#1266
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: AMS
Programs: Emirates Skywards, UA Mileage Plus, Hilton Gold
Posts: 23
It's similar as the Civil Aviation Authority in the UK, a governmental body that oversees aviation.
Mar 25, 2019, 7:36 am
#1267
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Mar 25, 2019, 9:58 am
#1268
Join Date: Oct 2015
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I had a recent experience with United's customer service.....When we got back home we filed a compensation claim for 600 euros each under EU Regulation 261/2004. That was rejected at least 6 times within 24 hours by the same employee.... I ended up writing a complaint to the head of customer services. She passed on my claim to, guess what, the same employee who previously turned down my claim 6 times. It's a prime example where a customer service employee does not have the legal knowledge of EU CoJ judgments and how to interpret them.
I filed a complaint with the Dutch Inspectorate who passed on my complaint to United and we got a notice from United two week later that they would pay out 1200 euros for us....
I filed a complaint with the Dutch Inspectorate who passed on my complaint to United and we got a notice from United two week later that they would pay out 1200 euros for us....
You are probably like me and only involve government agencies when there is no other option.
Not representing United in the best way with this situation .
Mar 25, 2019, 10:54 am
#1269
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 2,531
Regulators could solve this problem by including actual penalty provisions for failing to pay proper compensation within prescribed timelines. At the moment there is no incentive -- except possibly frowning customers -- for United not to just reject all EC261 comp and wait for complaint from the government or a lawsuit to be filed, then pay promptly.
If the EU wanted to actually get airlines to comply promptly, they could have just said the airline has to pay triple if not paid within 60 days of receiving a valid claim. Or if you want to avoid pax gaming the system, just a $1,000 fine for any rejected claims later sustained by a government regulator or lawsuit.
If the EU wanted to actually get airlines to comply promptly, they could have just said the airline has to pay triple if not paid within 60 days of receiving a valid claim. Or if you want to avoid pax gaming the system, just a $1,000 fine for any rejected claims later sustained by a government regulator or lawsuit.
Mar 25, 2019, 2:09 pm
#1270
Join Date: May 2006
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Regulators could solve this problem by including actual penalty provisions for failing to pay proper compensation within prescribed timelines. At the moment there is no incentive -- except possibly frowning customers -- for United not to just reject all EC261 comp and wait for complaint from the government or a lawsuit to be filed, then pay promptly.
If the EU wanted to actually get airlines to comply promptly, they could have just said the airline has to pay triple if not paid within 60 days of receiving a valid claim. Or if you want to avoid pax gaming the system, just a $1,000 fine for any rejected claims later sustained by a government regulator or lawsuit.
If the EU wanted to actually get airlines to comply promptly, they could have just said the airline has to pay triple if not paid within 60 days of receiving a valid claim. Or if you want to avoid pax gaming the system, just a $1,000 fine for any rejected claims later sustained by a government regulator or lawsuit.
Mar 27, 2019, 1:44 am
#1271
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: AMS
Programs: Emirates Skywards, UA Mileage Plus, Hilton Gold
Posts: 23
I am glad you received the correct compensation and I hope the Head of CS is reprimanded. Seriously if you send the same thing to the same person six times with the same result what makes them think the seventh would be any different? Shocking CS.
You are probably like me and only involve government agencies when there is no other option.
Not representing United in the best way with this situation .
You are probably like me and only involve government agencies when there is no other option.
Not representing United in the best way with this situation .
The option of going to an agency here in The Netherlands that would start a legal procedure again United has always been my last option. They work on no-cure-no-pay and start by sending out a letter. In case of success and United decides to pay straight after that letter, I'm losing 200 euros out of 600 euros. So I'm being penalized 30% just to get my right. The right route here in The Netherlands is as following:
1) file a complaint/compensation claim with the airline yourself
2) proceed to the European Consumer Center (government body that negotiates for free on your behalf)
3) proceed to the Dutch Inspectorate (governmental body that oversees aviation)
4) proceed to a commercial agency that costs you 30% legal fees
At the time I didn't know the ECC negotiates for consumers in airline compensation claims so I went straight on to step 3.
Mar 27, 2019, 10:34 am
#1272
Join Date: May 1999
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I was on UA 41 today, FCO-EWR. Just prior to pushback, we were advised that everyone had to deplane and go through security again, while our aircraft was inspected. We were told the delay would be about 1 hr (nice try with a Full 767). Back at the gate we were now advised the delay would be 173 minutes, a bit later that changed to 243 minutes and then finally we were told boarding would begin. But it was then announced that the flight was to be cancelled, all passengers were to spend the night at the Airport Hilton, and we’d be rebooked on the new flight the next day. Some of use received a piece of paper with the EC 261 rules and info given out br UA staffers. Almost immediately we all got a We’re Sorry msg from UA with a link to Customer Cares. What they offered was a choice of a $200 travel cert or 10,000 UA miles. I assume this is UA’s initial offer.? Last time a similar situation occurred UA finally offered a 900 travel cert or 27,500 miles. I was not going to accept this first offer but write to them and explain the distress's/ hardship caused by this cancellation and hope for a higher offer.
Any thoughts?
Any thoughts?
Mar 27, 2019, 10:48 am
#1273
Join Date: Apr 2009
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Posts: 6,852
I was on UA 41 today, FCO-EWR. Just prior to pushback, we were advised that everyone had to deplane and go through security again, while our aircraft was inspected. We were told the delay would be about 1 hr (nice try with a Full 767). Back at the gate we were now advised the delay would be 173 minutes, a bit later that changed to 243 minutes and then finally we were told boarding would begin. But it was then announced that the flight was to be cancelled, all passengers were to spend the night at the Airport Hilton, and we’d be rebooked on the new flight the next day. Some of use received a piece of paper with the EC 261 rules and info given out br UA staffers. Almost immediately we all got a We’re Sorry msg from UA with a link to Customer Cares. What they offered was a choice of a $200 travel cert or 10,000 UA miles. I assume this is UA’s initial offer.? Last time a similar situation occurred UA finally offered a 900 travel cert or 27,500 miles. I was not going to accept this first offer but write to them and explain the distress's/ hardship caused by this cancellation and hope for a higher offer.
Any thoughts?
Any thoughts?
Mar 27, 2019, 11:15 am
#1274
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: HNL
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Posts: 6,447
I strongly believe United trains it customer service staff to deny such claims on the simple reason "non-EU airline so the Regulation is not applicable". Staff has no clue what EU judgements mean. Maybe I was unlucky with this employee, but I don't believe she ever read the 3 judgments I had sent along.