Slow Demise of Global Services (Yes? No?) ....
#61
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: NYC
Programs: UA MileagePlus 2MM
Posts: 1,567
+1. I spend a $100k a year on air tickets. UA used to get nearly all of it. Now they get less than 10%. I used to love UA. They had a great hard and soft product and a great FF program. But spin88 hits the nail exactly on the head.....they simply are no longer a good choice for high spend customers who fly a lot.
Living in NYC close to the Holland Tunnel, flying out of EWR with GS and Pre Check (super expedited security screening) and Global Entry I probably save 2 hours a trip with UA. Norm for me on return from Asia/Europe with carry only - being back in my apartment 45 minutes after touchdown. If I fly 20 trips a year, that is 40 hours I get back (in theory) than if I held a lower status.
So even if GS is not what it once was, if it saves you time thru the airport, to the tune of 40 hours per year, that's a benefit which is hard to monetize. Depends on you.
#62
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NYC: UA 1K, DL Platinum, AAirpass, Avis PC
Posts: 4,599
Try flying Delta.. im sure you will love the product
*Diamond upgrades never clear (doing way better as a 1K)
*Food is gross - I haven't had an edible meal in 1st on DL this year. United snack flights are better than DL transcends (except for D1)
*Service on DL absolutely sucks... most overrated airline on planet earth. Board before you clear your upgrade.... or empty seats in 1st??? DL flips you the finger. Left me in the back #1 on the UG list with an empty seat next to my companion. Customer Relations supported the gate agents decision to avoid delay . flight left 8 min early. This is consistent with DL , UA ALWAYS comes onboard
*First class seats... on DL its "LCC" in 1st with the tightest pitch and no recline
*Award availability might not be great on UA.. but on DL, those Skymiles and seeing DL prices for last minute awards will make you puke. 120K Delta miles one way for last minute JFK-LHR flight. UA was round trip for the same price.
Trust me ... enjoy GS and avoid DL. IT wont be faster to get to LGA.. the traffic blows and the flight schedules aren't that great. Its a regional airport. JFK... DL Terminal 4 is much worse than EWR. Seems like you have to walk forever. Oh and lounges you can eat food in? Not sure I understand what you mean... the salad with the big bottles of Hidden Valley ranch is food you would eat? Or the DL Skyclubs enjoyable rubber chicken ? DL has no International departure lounge. You would miss that Polaris lounge for sure.
*Diamond upgrades never clear (doing way better as a 1K)
*Food is gross - I haven't had an edible meal in 1st on DL this year. United snack flights are better than DL transcends (except for D1)
*Service on DL absolutely sucks... most overrated airline on planet earth. Board before you clear your upgrade.... or empty seats in 1st??? DL flips you the finger. Left me in the back #1 on the UG list with an empty seat next to my companion. Customer Relations supported the gate agents decision to avoid delay . flight left 8 min early. This is consistent with DL , UA ALWAYS comes onboard
*First class seats... on DL its "LCC" in 1st with the tightest pitch and no recline
*Award availability might not be great on UA.. but on DL, those Skymiles and seeing DL prices for last minute awards will make you puke. 120K Delta miles one way for last minute JFK-LHR flight. UA was round trip for the same price.
Trust me ... enjoy GS and avoid DL. IT wont be faster to get to LGA.. the traffic blows and the flight schedules aren't that great. Its a regional airport. JFK... DL Terminal 4 is much worse than EWR. Seems like you have to walk forever. Oh and lounges you can eat food in? Not sure I understand what you mean... the salad with the big bottles of Hidden Valley ranch is food you would eat? Or the DL Skyclubs enjoyable rubber chicken ? DL has no International departure lounge. You would miss that Polaris lounge for sure.
I keep the status because it's easy to earn via the credit card and is useful for situations where UA flight isn't convenient, or there's a fare savings. I also find there's more advance upgrade space transcon on Delta, but as a GS you get the PN space so that doesn't matter.
I'm also guessing like me as much as DL has its over rated tendencies, it's still better than dealing with AA.
Last edited by cerealmarketer; Jul 14, 2018 at 11:16 am
#63
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Apr 2003
Programs: UA*Lifetime GS, Hyatt* Lifetime Globalist
Posts: 12,332
Living in NYC close to the Holland Tunnel, flying out of EWR with GS and Pre Check (super expedited security screening) and Global Entry I probably save 2 hours a trip with UA. Norm for me on return from Asia/Europe with carry only - being back in my apartment 45 minutes after touchdown. If I fly 20 trips a year, that is 40 hours I get back (in theory) than if I held a lower status.
So even if GS is not what it once was, if it saves you time thru the airport, to the tune of 40 hours per year, that's a benefit which is hard to monetize. Depends on you.
That being said, based on my more than a decade of GS experience, I noticed minimum downgrades. Without GS, I’d rather have minimum work travel.
#64
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: NYC
Programs: UA MileagePlus 2MM
Posts: 1,567
With Gloal Entry comes with TSA Pre check feature, you don’t need GS to save the 40 hours you described above. It is Global Entry and Pre Check that are saving you time not GS. Yes, I do understand there is a dedicated GS line for pre check at EWR. The time saving between regular Pre Check line and GS Pre Check line is less than 10 min.
That being said, based on my more than a decade of GS experience, I noticed minimum downgrades. Without GS, I’d rather have minimum work travel.
At EWR they walk you right to the front of the Pre-Check line. I assume I can arrive an hour later for departure due to this feature.
OK granted returning GE can get you from plane to cab in 15 minutes. And as you point out, is not a GS but GE perk.
Still 20 hours or more a year at home count's a lot, for me.
#65
Join Date: Sep 2009
Programs: UA GS>1K>Nothing; DL DM 2MM; AS 75K>Nothing>MVP
Posts: 9,341
Naw! GE has nothing to do with GS. And going through GS check-in takes you to the head of the pre-check, which typically means you get to cut in front of 2 or 3 people. Saves you a minute or two max.
#66
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: dark side of the moon
Programs: papa card, UA 1K
Posts: 707
GS has only been devalued for a handful of people in the last few years --- the biggest devaluations have been loosing the ability to force certain things and also the loss of inherited status .... It's still a great status to have, particularly if you have done your homework. However you are still better off as a 1K who knows what they are doing than a GS who doesn't - but that's always been the case
Last edited by ermintrude; Jul 14, 2018 at 7:35 pm Reason: typo
#67
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: DEN
Programs: UA-GS; WN A-list;Hyatt - CC; Hertz - PC
Posts: 644
What I have notices the most over the last year is the amount of times I call in and I do not get an actual GS agent. Its like GS now is just the first in the line to someone "better" than most.
However, the screw ups on last second changes have increased massively. Just yesterday I had an agent tell me no seats were left on a last flight out when I tried to make a change to go home to DEN a day early. I was looking at the app when I called it in and saw it was available. I thanked her for her time, and she asked me if I needed a rental car in DEN when I got there. Then I just booked it direct on the App and called in the refund after I got someone good on the phone.
But yeah, I have seen a decrease in service this year especially on the phone.
However, the screw ups on last second changes have increased massively. Just yesterday I had an agent tell me no seats were left on a last flight out when I tried to make a change to go home to DEN a day early. I was looking at the app when I called it in and saw it was available. I thanked her for her time, and she asked me if I needed a rental car in DEN when I got there. Then I just booked it direct on the App and called in the refund after I got someone good on the phone.
But yeah, I have seen a decrease in service this year especially on the phone.
#68
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 7,875
At EWR they walk you right to the front of the Pre-Check line. I assume I can arrive an hour later for departure due to this feature.
OK granted returning GE can get you from plane to cab in 15 minutes. And as you point out, is not a GS but GE perk.
Still 20 hours or more a year at home count's a lot, for me.
OK granted returning GE can get you from plane to cab in 15 minutes. And as you point out, is not a GS but GE perk.
Still 20 hours or more a year at home count's a lot, for me.
#69
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Clinging to the edifices of a decadent past from the biggest city in America nobody really cares about.
Programs: (ಠ_ಠ)
Posts: 9,077
I guess I am in the enviable position of just paying for F if the flight is over about 3 hours or so (unless F is priced crazy) and I really can't see the benefits - to me at least - of giving UA my business to get GS. But the entire point of GS is to gain/retain the business of those who can/will pay for more expensive tickets.
/snip/
I avoid them to Hawaii (77HD) or due to the new 77W and the tight 787. At this point the hard product takes UA off my radar for family trips (unless they will give me 3-4 J seats, which is not gonna happen) and when I am paying for J or PE why would I choose United?
/snip/
I avoid them to Hawaii (77HD) or due to the new 77W and the tight 787. At this point the hard product takes UA off my radar for family trips (unless they will give me 3-4 J seats, which is not gonna happen) and when I am paying for J or PE why would I choose United?
Moving beyond my unique travel patterns to a more general observation about UA, I've found UA to generally to offer a decent advance purchase, restricted domestic F product. This comes at the expense of comp upgrades and UA committing a higher number of their domestic F seats to, what I assume to be, lower yielding PRASM fares and I hope UA's savvy enough to make sure they're not displacing premium international customers for lack of a front-cabin domestic connection...but that's for another thread.
spin - you asked why would someone fly UA when paying for J. Beyond an unflexible schedule constraint or
Case and point: I'm looking at a $2.7k P fare IAH > AMS > IAH later this year. In round numbers, I'll need ~175k bank points to ticket that and I'll be paying a 55k point premium when compared to a traditional 120k award. Let's also say I'll earn ~28k in UA RDMs for the paid option, which shrinks the delta to ~27k points over an award, not making any allotment for EQDs/EQMs/lifetime/etc. earnings. Moreover, if I really wanted to get cute, I suppose I could route onto LH and apply a GPU to go from P > F, with this option but notwithstanding such one-off awards my point is the new front cabin product (read: new Polaris seat/lounge /new domestic F) UA offers at their discounted F price point strikes me as reasonable.
Am I paying J prices? Absolutely not. If I were would I be on UA? ....probably not. Do I feel like I'm getting value for P? Yes. Would I blindly book a UA P fare without shopping the comps? Absolutely not...as an EXP I'm loving those QR R fares when offered!
Finally, I say this with the understanding like you, I too would book away from Y in UA. I also generally book away from Polaris in UA if it's not the new seat unless there's some deal which would otherwise compel me to book UA (e.g. using my GPUs to upgrade Y > C awards).
As far as AA, I've found their program almost is like the reverse of UA for myself. With UA I'll often aim to book far enough out to score a P/PN. AA is generally my go to when I need a cheap Asia > US fare I can buy and upgrade at the last minute (HKG > LAX/DFW is generally my go to and can generally find space 1-2 days prior to departure). As a UA GS I can access upgrade on an award but as an AA EXP I can upgrade any Y ticket to C. Don't know which is better - or even if one can objectively answer that question - but I've found AA to be useful for filling the last-minute-ex-Asia-cheap-Y-upgrade need I tend to have a few times a year.
Not to take this to far off topic, but given....
- No more GF
- No more GFL
- Relatively inexpensive domestic F fares
- Never book paid or award economy tickets anymore
- Rarely need to speak to any kind of agent
- Access to United Clubs with Chase card
- Totally noncompetitive international premium product (last two trips were CX and JL F)
- Massive devaluation of mileage redemption for premium partner awards
- Have Pre-Check, GE and ABTC
- Used to be GS, now Platinum.....
Earlier this year I was connecting through SFO to HKG and my inbound took an ATC delay. Got to the gate with a - 3-minute connection but a GS agent was there in the jetway. We hustled down the stairs, jumped into the car, drove to the connecting gate, ran up the stairs, and the GA closed the door immediately after I boarded. The point here is I really needed to make that flight and GS was able to coordinate it (as well as offer multiple protection options). UA hustled, I made my connection, and I appreciate the effort it took to make it happen.
Returning to the OP's question as to the slow demise of the program: my take is no, not really from my viewpoint of being either 1K or GS for ~the past 4 years. I do sense UA's tried to focus the program on the experience (e.g. scrambling to allow you to make your connection) and away from the hard goodies (upgrades) but I see this more as an industry trend and less of a specific GS program issue.
#70
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: PHX
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#71
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: NYC
Programs: UA MileagePlus 2MM
Posts: 1,567
You missed the point. The fact that I can get to EWR faster by road or rail than LGA or JFK from where I live in Manhattan is not the benefit of GS. The fact that I can arrive 1 hour before int'l departures, ISO of 2 hours, is the perk. Is that such a difficult concept to grasp?
Last edited by WineCountryUA; Jul 15, 2018 at 2:02 pm Reason: merging consecutive posts by same member
#72
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 7,875
You missed the point. The fact that I can get to EWR faster by road or rail than LGA or JFK from where I live in Manhattan is not the benefit of GS. The fact that I can arrive 1 hour before int'l departures, ISO of 2 hours, is the perk. Is that such a difficult concept to grasp?
Is that a perk?
You know there are options other than EWR. I don't know if you know but there are other airlines, other airports, that might take you also to the same destination. Like, LAX, SFO, SEA. Maybe even DEN. Wow, there are a lot of these things called international airports.
But I guess if you have no option other than EWR, because you have to fly UA, then yes, that is a perk.
#73
Join Date: Mar 2018
Programs: UA 1K, AA EXP. Hilton Diamond
Posts: 1,134
This is exactly what I do. If I'm not in a paid F seat from the start, I'll buy up at check in (or before) if the price is right and I really want insure a seat up front, rather than putting my hopes and dreams into an upgrade clearing. I'm only a 1k and have good success on most routes, but hub to hub? Forget about it. Usually too low on the status pole to have success unless its late at night or midweek or something. I guess I've been conditioned to do exactly what UA and the carriers want- to spend, spend, spend on the extras and higher priced fares.
#74
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: NYC
Programs: UA MileagePlus 2MM
Posts: 1,567
Yes. I can get to the airport 1 hour before an international departure. I don't live in New York. I live near an airport that isn't a hot mess like EWR.
Is that a perk?
You know there are options other than EWR. I don't know if you know but there are other airlines, other airports, that might take you also to the same destination. Like, LAX, SFO, SEA. Maybe even DEN. Wow, there are a lot of these things called international airports.
But I guess if you have no option other than EWR, because you have to fly UA, then yes, that is a perk.
Is that a perk?
You know there are options other than EWR. I don't know if you know but there are other airlines, other airports, that might take you also to the same destination. Like, LAX, SFO, SEA. Maybe even DEN. Wow, there are a lot of these things called international airports.
But I guess if you have no option other than EWR, because you have to fly UA, then yes, that is a perk.
Where do you live so we can make this a purposeful conversation? Where do you fly to?
#75
Join Date: Sep 2009
Programs: UA GS>1K>Nothing; DL DM 2MM; AS 75K>Nothing>MVP
Posts: 9,341
I am not going to argue what the times savings are of holding GS status and Pre-Check for departures - it obviously depends on time of day and other factors. The reality is that I can plan to arrive at EWR for departures 1 hour before int'l flight time and never worry about cutting it too close. If I was 1K with Pre-check I would definitely plan to arrive 2 hours before STD. YMMV.
I get that GS works for some people, but objectively if you're flying a lot and booking in the front to start with, there really is almost no value in GS.
Last edited by 5khours; Jul 15, 2018 at 12:00 pm