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Wow - selling the upgrades at the gate so explicitly.

Wow - selling the upgrades at the gate so explicitly.

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Old Mar 30, 18, 9:47 am
  #331  
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Originally Posted by nomad420 View Post
There have been reports of this going on now for several months. I myself experienced it out of DEN as well last October and didn't get my RPU upgraded (nothing new). It seems many reports of this have come out of DEN for whatever reason. I didn't complain, I just figured more business as usual. It is what it is....a money grab. But as many here say, UA is in the business of making money for their shareholders.
Been going on a lot longer than a couple months. At least a couple years.
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Old Mar 30, 18, 9:51 am
  #332  
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Originally Posted by bocastephen View Post
If they were yelling out "first class seats for $99", then I would definitely be writing in about this.
Why not just go bang your head against the wall? Equally effective.

Vote with wallet if you don't like UA's FCM policies.
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Old Mar 30, 18, 10:02 am
  #333  
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I find it shocking, simply shocking, that a for-profit business with a duty to its shareholders would attempt to sell a product before giving it away.

Seriously. UA is doing exactly what it ought to be doing. Whether it is upselling from the fare paid to the cheapest fare basis which books into F or it simply establishes a price, is irrelevant.

Bottom line is that if UA can't sell the seat, it gives it away.
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Old Mar 30, 18, 10:12 am
  #334  
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Originally Posted by Often1 View Post
Seriously. UA is doing exactly what it ought to be doing.
That's debatable. Alienating elites has a cost, and UA has made many bad decisions on that front since the merger. Regardless, UA management has gone all in on FCM, and now has by far the most aggressive FCM policies of any of the major US carriers.
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Old Mar 30, 18, 10:14 am
  #335  
 
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Originally Posted by Often1 View Post
I find it shocking, simply shocking, that a for-profit business with a duty to its shareholders would attempt to sell a product before giving it away.

Seriously. UA is doing exactly what it ought to be doing. Whether it is upselling from the fare paid to the cheapest fare basis which books into F or it simply establishes a price, is irrelevant.

Bottom line is that if UA can't sell the seat, it gives it away.
Bingo! I don't like it when I am waiting at the gate with an upgrade instrument in play at #1 on the upgrade list and they sell the seat out from me but I do get it. This has been going on for years as Baze just pointed out. But it seems to have taken a more in your face approach recently.
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Old Mar 30, 18, 10:18 am
  #336  
 
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Originally Posted by Kacee View Post
That's debatable. Alienating elites has a cost, and UA has made many bad decisions on that front since the merger. Regardless, UA management has gone all in on FCM, and now has by far the most aggressive FCM policies of any of the major US carriers.
I max out as a PM on DL, but after my experience this morning I'm definitely not switching to UA any time soon. There's a balance between the two interests and DL seems to have gotten it right.
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Old Mar 30, 18, 12:47 pm
  #337  
 
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Originally Posted by WWads View Post
I max out as a PM on DL, but after my experience this morning I'm definitely not switching to UA any time soon. There's a balance between the two interests and DL seems to have gotten it right.
I'm glad that's been your experience, but I feel I should point out that DL was the trailblazer in this, and they're the one that recently set the "80% of first class sold" target that got played up in the media. On a 738, that's an average of three upgrades; on a 739, it's four.

However, none of this really matters except at the margins -- they could upgrade people into every seat on the plane and there would still be premier members sitting in Y. I was #30 on the upgrade list for an AUS-SFO flight on a 739 in January as a 1K on a G fare. IIRC, nobody cleared on that flight, but even if they emptied the F cabin to upgrade people, I still would have been sitting in the back.

Operating at an 85%+ load factor, instead of a 70% load factor, means fewer upgrade seats available for more passengers. It's a simple capacity issue.

FWIW, I really don't see the big deal about gate agents making an upgrade announcement. Anybody who hears that announcement has already turned down an upgrade offer at least twice -- once at purchase and once at check-in. And every person on the flight can check for a new offer at any time via the app, website, or kiosk. All they're really doing is reminding people to check.
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Old Mar 30, 18, 12:55 pm
  #338  
 
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Originally Posted by eng3 View Post
The real test that UA continually is running is to see how far they can push an elite before they really lose their business. Once we are "loyal", they have our money so it makes sense to shift focus. Of course, if you ignore the elite long enough, they'll leave and you lose alot.

In DEN, when they sell off an F seat for TOD and the elite loses his spot, how many of them actually decide to take their business elsewhere and how many just curse UA and continue giving them money. I am willing to be 99% are the later. Therefore the test is a success.
I fall into this category. I'm 35% of the way to Million Miler status with UA, and closer to 0% with DL and AA. There is no incentive to fly WN, and most of my travel is between SFO and ORD...so I fly UA. I wish I could explain the psychology behind it, but they've got me.
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Old Mar 30, 18, 2:13 pm
  #339  
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Originally Posted by Often1 View Post
I find it shocking, simply shocking, that a for-profit business with a duty to its shareholders would attempt to sell a product before giving it away.
Seriously. UA is doing exactly what it ought to be doing. Whether it is upselling from the fare paid to the cheapest fare basis which books into F or it simply establishes a price, is irrelevant.
Bottom line is that if UA can't sell the seat, it gives it away.
The issue with this isn't the CPUs, it is the instrument supported upgrades. Those are earned by behavior that is profitable to United and given as an incentive. Whether an upgrade is purchased with cash or an earned instrument, it is purchased. If UA wants to abandon the FF program upgrade perk and sell all the seats, fine. But trying to have it both ways has a cost.
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Old Mar 30, 18, 2:25 pm
  #340  
 
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Originally Posted by skgolf91 View Post
not defending United or anything but they are running a business and trying to make as much money as they can.. just like we all do!
if they’re gonna make every upgrade an auction, then might as well stop benefits above gold. No reason for Plat it 1K. Maybe it’s getting close to the time when there’s simply no reason to stay loyal anymore!
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Old Mar 30, 18, 2:27 pm
  #341  
 
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Originally Posted by LRMErnst View Post
I fall into this category. I'm 35% of the way to Million Miler status with UA, and closer to 0% with DL and AA. There is no incentive to fly WN, and most of my travel is between SFO and ORD...so I fly UA. I wish I could explain the psychology behind it, but they've got me.
no way! 35%~ you mean 350k miles? You’re not even vested yet!
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Old Mar 30, 18, 2:31 pm
  #342  
 
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Originally Posted by nomad420 View Post
I don't like it when I am waiting at the gate with an upgrade instrument in play at #1 on the upgrade list and they sell the seat out from me but I do get it. This has been going on for years as Baze just pointed out.
On the flip side, if I'm #3 on the upgrade list, with 1 or 2 seats left (especially my HNL-SFO) flights, I like the flexibility to jump the queue so to speak. As a 1K, I'm rarely #1 on the list anymore from HNL or SFO (or DEN or EWR) with so many GS, so it works for me to be able to buy up more cheaply than paying for it a ticketing.
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Old Mar 30, 18, 3:31 pm
  #343  
 
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Originally Posted by Often1 View Post
I find it shocking, simply shocking, that a for-profit business with a duty to its shareholders would attempt to sell a product before giving it away.

Seriously. UA is doing exactly what it ought to be doing. Whether it is upselling from the fare paid to the cheapest fare basis which books into F or it simply establishes a price, is irrelevant.

Bottom line is that if UA can't sell the seat, it gives it away.
Wrong. UA can't have it both ways
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Old Mar 30, 18, 3:43 pm
  #344  
 
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Originally Posted by tryathlete View Post


no way! 35%~ you mean 350k miles? You’re not even vested yet!

Dont forget some people make status by segments. Now that's loyalty. Even getting status, you don't get to enjoy most of the benefits.

Originally Posted by HNLbasedFlyer View Post
On the flip side, if I'm #3 on the upgrade list, with 1 or 2 seats left (especially my HNL-SFO) flights, I like the flexibility to jump the queue so to speak. As a 1K, I'm rarely #1 on the list anymore from HNL or SFO (or DEN or EWR) with so many GS, so it works for me to be able to buy up more cheaply than paying for it a ticketing.
I do find it a little disheartening to always find myself #1 or so on the upgrade. Might as well be #50
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Old Mar 30, 18, 3:52 pm
  #345  
 
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Originally Posted by HNLbasedFlyer View Post
On the flip side, if I'm #3 on the upgrade list, with 1 or 2 seats left (especially my HNL-SFO) flights, I like the flexibility to jump the queue so to speak. As a 1K, I'm rarely #1 on the list anymore from HNL or SFO (or DEN or EWR) with so many GS, so it works for me to be able to buy up more cheaply than paying for it a ticketing.
I have struggled with that many times as well as I work Hawaii and make the SFO-HNL (KOA/OGG) runs regularly. My problem is I hold a fist full of upgrade instruments and always try to use them. I have been there many times at T24, standing on a RPU, and they throw the TOD at me. It just happened last weekend on a DEN-SFO flight where I think I was 3 or 4 on the upgrade list! Well literally 8 times out of 10 the instrument hasn't cleared and indeed it didn't clear on the DEN-SFO flight.
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