LPDAL

WN's ability to compete with UA is hindered by their lack of a real international network (read: Europe, Asia, and Africa) and overall smaller size in comparison to United. The operational complexity of United is really not up for comparison with the operational complexity of Southwest.

It's like asking if Publix can have any significant effect on the market share of Walmart. Publix can, but they are limited in the fact that they are only located in the South (furthest one being in TN) while Walmart has locations worldwide, which dilutes any effort on Publix's part. One cannot compare a fruit the size of an apple to a watermelon.

-LPDAL

sbm12

WN carries more passengers than UA does in the USA on far more routes and runs ~25% more ASMs. It competes just fine in the markets both exist in.

LPDAL

Overall WN is in no position to challenge United because simply, United is much larger than WN in mostly every sector of the market, and there is no denying that [and, as I stated before, some markets, such as most of the world outside of the Americas, have no WN presence, thus United is superior by default]. If you include Lufthansa and other entities UA has large interests in, there is no comparison: UA is an elephant, and WN a cockroach. A cockroach can annoy an elephant into injuring itself, but an elephant can always squash a cockroach due to its superior size.

I think I will have some great difficulty if I try to fly WN to AKL or CPH.

-LPDAL

TravellingMan

I will say I am at 20% on clearing standby this year that I dont try anymore. Plus with all the recent flying with WN it does not even show up on the plans. If my WN flight is delayed then I head to the airport to get free standby on the next flight.

I reckon the seats are only going to get worse. I recently flew AA A319 in F and was shocked at the quality of the seats. I reckon those are the advanced slimlines for F class cabin

TravellingMan

The argument that WN does not have an international presence and hence I will not fly them is not a strong one. If the carriers have all "unbundled" the fares, then you ought to consider "unbundling" your flying options. There are so many airlines for international that wanting to only fly UA metal severely limits your options on quality and OT.

Each to their own.

sshank

Agreed. The slim lines on the UA Airbus fleet are by far the most uncomfortable airline seats I have ever sat on. The seat depth is the shortest I have seen, and if you are over 5'7" your thigh has no support and you are going to be miserable. So much so that I long for the CO Kioto park bench on the 738s.

I do my best to book away from Airbus segments. The irony is the these PMUA A3XX had the most comfortable Y seats in the fleet, and they have gutted the plane as part of the refurb process.

LPDAL

There is no question in my mind that some people have positive experiences on WN where United may have failed them.

However, it cannot be denied that United as a whole is much larger than Southwest. Passengers are not assets, they are not owned by any corporation, so let me go by aircraft: United has 719 active, in use mainline frames which range from the Boeing 737-700 and Airbus A319 at the smallest to the Boeing 747-400 at the largest. Non-mainline aircraft flying under the United Express brand total 566 active, in use airframes which range from the Dash-8-Q200 at the smallest to the Embraer ERJ-175 at the largest. Southwest has no such regional operations, so their fleet consists of 694 active, in use airplanes that range from the Boeing 737-300 at the smallest to the Boeing 737-800 at the largest, flown solely by the corporations' own, in house pilots.

If you count both United mainline and United Express fleets as one compared to Southwest = 1,285 > 694, a difference of 591 active, in use airframes;

If you do not count the United Express fleet compared to Southwest = 719 > 694, a difference of 25 airframes.

HOWEVER, what must be considered is that United flies a large amount of aircraft that are substantially bigger than Southwest's biggest plane, the Boeing 737-800, including the Boeing 747-400 (23) + Boeing 757-200 (67) + Boeing 757-300 (21) + Boeing 767-300 (35) + Boeing 767-400 (16) + Boeing 777-200 (74) + Boeing 787-8 (12) and finally the Boeing 787-9 (10) as of this writing.

Thus, United mainline is flying 260+ aircraft that are larger than the largest aircraft in WN's fleet which means the face value of 719 > 694 skewed in UA's favor. All of the aircraft that are larger than the Boeing 737-800 in United's mainline fleet are more or less flown domestically on both regular and irregular schedules (yep, even the 744) so their presence can be counted in the domestic market.

-LPDAL

dimramon

Larger does not mean better or superior.

If I make an analogy using your thoughts, we'd only have the big four and no boutique firms, since their existence wouldn't make sense and they would be inferior anyways.

BearX220

As a passenger can only fly on one plane at a time, this is immaterial to quality of customer experience. SQ operates only 104 aircraft, but UA is not 1200% better or more reliable than SQ. And a disturbing number of UA's larger aircraft are regularly incapable of executing their flying assignments, judging from this always-active thread.

As for network largeness, that too is immaterial to the vast majority of customers who fly either infrequently or to a few regular destinations.

A 1957 Greyhound Scenicruiser is much larger than an Audi TT, but not exactly a better or more reliable ride.

LPDAL

United isn't going to be driven out of business by Southwest any time soon. Any losses they sustain will be recovered elsewhere in their network which is much larger and complex than Southwest. WN's network and overall operation just doesn't compare to United. Unless, of course, I missed the press release where WN announced service to LHR and NRT, and got some airline partners to codeshare with earlier this afternoon.

And yes, United is larger than Southwest and I'd rather take United First any day over Southwest Business Select or whatever they call their "premium product". As the poster above me said, "Each to their own".

-LPDAL