sethb

DL sells "full Y" fares that come with instant automatic upgrades to F if you're a SkyMiles member (any level, no status required) and there's availability. But that's clearly a Coach ticket. It also sells several fare classes of F (and over a dozen fare classes of Y).

Kacee

That's not what I'm talking about. DL and AA sell UP fares that are essentially the same as UA's.

Weird DL UP Fares

How to Book UP Fares with Delta

When First Class is Not First Class Instant Upgrade P Restricted Fares

flyerCO

I seen it sell me a coach ticket that allows me to sit in 1st. However that was clearly a coach ticket upgraded. Generally refundable coach tickets have this type of option and have a UP as part of the fare. However in my case it was PUP. If anything to me that means if global first is available I should be sitting there. Regardless the DOT and credit card companies (at least according to my TA) are taking this fraud seriously.

embarcadero1

I just want to clarify that I did not purchase an Up fare. The fare I purchased was an A fare, described as "discounted global first".

United commits fraud when they sell up fares because they do not disclose the underlying terms of the fare. This is straight up fraud because of the lack of disclosure, not because of the terms.

It also appears that United is strong arming their agents into reducing rebooking costs, which I now believe is what the agent with whom I originally spoke attempted to do. That he started off with "I see you purchased a business fare that allows you to sit in first" tells me that this type of fraud is now their M.O. for reducing their very significant expenses in rebooking passengers on the 30% of their flights that are canceled or delayed.

DErg

I've experienced the exact same situation on UA 4 times so far this year which has finally prompted me for the last month to book AA and DL. I filed a DOT complaint about the most recent incident where I booked F class and later when making a flight change or during rebooking was told it was in fact Economy on 6/24. After 29 days I finally received a brief form letter nicely saying it was my fault for booking an economy ticket that gave me the option of an upgrade to an F class seat on that flight and I was SOL. I responded with the below message reiterating what the DOT complaint stated and of course they haven't replied yet. Will be interesting to see what happens.

mduell

I assume this is rhetorical, since you know the fare rules they offer unambiguously state economy.

spin88

That kind of "oh gee, we said its F, never disclosed anything else, but had you read 40 pages of fine print - which we don't show you, and don't make you review - you would have realized you really bought a ticket on Grayhound" move will probably work in a state that gave America crooked savings and loans, Enron, and Allen Stanford but it will not fly anywhere else.

Its fraud.

raehl311

Oh, it'll fly... just not in the cabin you purchased.

mgcsinc

Ah yes, the fare rules that are behind a minor link followed by a captcha that leads to an error half the time.

mduell

I just checked one of the domestic UPDI fares, and they now say:
THESE FARES APPLY FOR FIRST/BUSINESS/ECONOMY/COACH/OFF-
PEAK COACH CLASS SERVICE.

Which isn't something I recall seeing before.

Hadrian35

A colleague and I booked SEA-MUC rt together and my return flights were completely different than what hers were. Laptops side by side, she could not get the W fares on the flights we both wanted returning from MUC and she had a couple flights on her screen that were not on mine. I booked the flight and searched the same routes and dates again with her there and the flight was still there (3 seats left at this price) and it did not show on her computer.

Not calling fraud but how the heck is that not fishy as all hell?

Kacee

The UP fares I've purchased did not so state. The only clue they were economy fares was the fare basis.

I will add that I never had any serious difficult getting rebooked in the front cabin, but I know others' experiences have been different.

That's meaningless. Is it a "First/Business" fare or is it an "Economy/Coach" fare? Or is UA telling us it's whatever kind of fare they want it to be?

mduell

I read it for what it says - the fare can apply to travel in any of the listed classes. A big improvement from the wording that only said economy class.

DErg

Glad you agree, hopefully the DOT will as well. I'm still debating the best course of action to try and recover the fare difference between what I paid for an F seat and if I had booked a Y seat (what I ended up flying in this time). Not sure if I'll dispute the transaction or try small claims. Does anyone have some advice based on their experiences?

In United's form reply to the DOT complaint they didn't offer a thing except that I booked economy and to bad. Considering I spent over $20k on them last year and was on track to spend over $30k this year you would think they would have at least offered some token amount of miles.

sethb

If you dispute the transaction, they'll claim the same lie: you bought an economy seat and flew. You'll probably lose the dispute.

In Small Claims Court, I think you have a much better chance. You can show the judge what the booking process looks like and Untied can attempt to claim that some invisible unfindable terms override the clear "First Class" wording.