chrisl137

I had a couple years where I had to drive "locally" to an off-site work location just about every day. It was technically local (about 35 miles) but because this is LA, at commute times it took me about as long door to door as it would to go anywhere in Silicon Valley (via BUR-SJC). Once or twice a month I'd fly to the east coast for a few days or up to a week - those trips actually turned out to be much easier than the daily drive. I'd fly at times that got me to LAX off-peak (though into IAD commute traffic), but once I was there I'd stay about 20 minutes from work in the anti-commute direction at a hotel with walkable food and entertainment, and I generally had more flexible hours than working the local off-site. Now that I'm not doing the drive (and have a 20 minute bike ride to work), the flying is starting to suck more - it tends to be transcons on short turns, so it eats up a lot of time that I'd rather be spending doing something else. So the unpleasantness of travel can definitely be a relative thing. I learned your last point above the first time I had a period with a lot of travel - the perks aren't really all that great, because they mean you're spending an awful lot of time traveling and all they really do is make it a little less unpleasant.

PaxALotl

I see a bunch of people standing around waiting for a flight. What is so bad about that? I just don't get this whole idea that loitering around the gate is somehow offensive to others. Look at the photo - that's pretty much every gate on every daytime flight at every airport. People standing around. So what?

trajanc

pinniped

I want the latter. That means my AA Gold upgrade request actually has a chance!! ^

darthbimmer

Definitely. The fact is some business travelers suck. And some leisure travelers suck. Basically, in the commercial flight industry, everyone and everything at some point sucks. The question, then, is not "Does A suck?" but rather "Which sucks worse in general, A or B?" As an A/B test, if I was told my next flight could either be 90% business travelers or 90% leisure travelers, I'd pick the business traveler heavy one.

COSPILOT

Comments like this are naïve at best. I'm in sales, and what I don't spend ends up in my pocket in year end profit for me. One way or another, my travel comes out of my pocket, directly or indirectly. Would you suggest that I don't deserve a nice car and the perks that come with it, or belonging to a country club? After all, if it wasn't for my employer I wouldn't have any of those nice things without a paycheck. A good friend agrees with you, and even suggested his 2K per year spend and gaming of the system is more important than my 12K spend on direct flights... After all, he is loyal, even if the airline lost money on him, and I should be a nobody.

pinniped

I'd phrase it a little differently. You both have "acquired" the status and should use the benefits that come from it.

The airlines have conditioned us to think of it as "earning" something, when in reality all we did was buy a lot of product from one company. My local sandwich shop gives me a "free" sandwich after I've bought 10 of them - perhaps they should take it one step further and give me a shiny card and double-cheese upgrades. Airline marketing people long ago figured out that we're all pretty vain and will drool over the idea that we're "elite" and have a shiny metal card to prove it. Making us think we've "earned" something is a part of that.

As for gaming the system, let's be honest: that's the entire reason we're all here and not on a bulletin board talking about free sandwiches. Flying for business and optimizing how we use miles for personal travel is one model. MS / mileage runs / etc. is another. There are multiple ways to skin this cat.

And ultimately, none of us are "loyal". We're playing this game to maximum advantage, and that means sometimes buying our product all from one vendor. Other times it does not...

COSPILOT

I think the better analogy would be the restaurants I frequent. Imagine if they asked if I was paying with my personal card, or my corporate card, before deciding how I'm treated?

I guess I don't fit your model, as I'm loyal to UA by personal choice, not by any corporate mandate. I'm allowed to pick whatever airline fits my needs, as do the others in my company. Some pick SW, some pick AA, others pick DL. Part of compensation is knowing how to travel without stress, something I do well. The OP I quoted suggested that because I travel for work, I should not be allowed any benefits because in his/her mind it didn't come directly out of my pocket. Well, it does come out of my pocket at the end of the year, and its my choice. I don't game anything at this point, as I look for the best flights for my meetings and family, balancing cost. RDM's aren't even a thought in how I pick flights.

But even for the young consultant types, I don't judge them, and I don't care who pays the bill. They have to start somewhere and will become a little more humble in years to come. Suggesting that only the payer should have the status sounds more like a monarchy or dictatorship, which doesn't sound good to me.

Suggesting I should slum it every week because I used a corporate card instead of my own seems silly, naïve, and foolish.

Back on topic to the original OP, I'm pretty open minded and one heck of a good listener. I enjoy conversations with both frequent business travelers as well as families. Since I fit both models, and I'm in sales, I'm pretty easy to get along with. The only person I hate is the one that thinks everyone else is wrong, cell phones are bad period, kids suck, and he/she should come first because they have been super loyal with their 2K/spend.

PaxALotl

Naive, yes.

I'm an employer. Treating employees well is important.
Business travel, especially long-haul trips packed with meetings, can be hard and tiresome.

Knowing that employees are, at least, getting travel status on UA and Hertz makes things a bit easier for them and they appreciate it.

As an employer, I want (and sort of need) my employees to have the best travel experience possible. I am paying for that, yes, and what I'm paying for is for them to have an easier time on the road.

So, I want what I paid for.

PaxALotl

Some great points.

I also forgive the young consultant types who act like jerks.
i forgive the rarer, but more annoying older consultant types who sort of are jerks.
I forgive the first time traveler who slows down the boarding process.
I forgive the stressed out mom, an infrequent flyer, who is doing her best but is having a rough go.
And I forgive the rarer, but more annoying leisure traveler who thinks they are somehow special.

Leisure vs. business is a non argument.

milepig

If you're standing at the curb waiting for an Uber how do you know when the bags came? Did you even walk past the baggage claim area? Perhaps the bags from your flight were already on the belt.

apodo77

I am a frequent business traveler. For the record I don't talk shop with my seatmate (whether thay are a colleague or not), rarely work on the plane, fly economy with little to no complaints, and almost always have my headphones on minding my own business. Sorry if somewhere along the way I have offended you just in case.

Solid and enjoyable rant.

PaxALotl

Yes, I walk right by the baggage claim. At DEN, my home airport, I regularly take the train to the terminal then walk by the passengers assembling at the carousel. And at many other airports as well.

I'm not saying that sometimes the bags come quickly. But are we actually debating the concept that simply walking to the car is generally (and sometimes much) faster than waiting for your checked bag? I am sort of stunned that they is up for debate. Even on a good day it's usually a few minutes waiting at baggage claim, and from time to time you have huge delays or lost bags.

GetSetJetSet

Whoops, looks like you're exactly the type of self-important person the OP is talking about. You realize lots of FT'ers are leisure travelers that still have status, know the drill at the airport and ride up front right?

ft101

Not at all, we're saying it's a false saving as the guy who waited at the carousel will have caught up with you in the bus/train/taxi/hire car queue or at the first traffic lights you stop at. Someone else will have carried his bags for him and he won't have worried about overhead space or had a bag at his feet.