Travel Expenses: Dumb Things your Company has Done
Dec 24, 2018, 5:47 am
#301
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 500
I work for the federal government now and on the whole my agency is pretty reasonable about travel expenses. The only place where logic seems to disappear is with rental cars. In the government, there is no concept that time equals money or that my time as a professional has any sort of price associated with it. On past trips, it has been suggested to me to drive coworkers 60 miles in rush hour traffic to an airport even though I was flying out of another airport to a different destination just so we could share one rental car (I pushed back on that one and succeeded). I attended a training where they only allowed 6 rental cars for a dozen travelers; we were told to wait at the airport to pick up our "rental car buddy," even though we were arriving on a Sunday at all different times. One person ended up waiting at the airport 5 hours for their "buddy" who had the rental car reservation because the flight was delayed. In cities where there is more than one airport, I've also been told to fly to a more expensive airport (i.e. DAL instead of DFW) just so I could catch a ride in someone's rental car instead of charging ground transportation. When I explain that my plan is more cost-efficient (i.e. flying to DFW and getting my own rental car), I always get approval to do what is more logical and reasonable, but it's never suggested from the start and I always have to make my case and get approval before doing what should be a no-brainer.
Dec 24, 2018, 4:03 pm
#302
Join Date: Mar 2010
Programs: Delta Diamond , Marriott Ambassador, Alaska MVP Gold, American Airlines Gold
Posts: 77
I really can’t complain about my current company — rules are reasonable (leniant, even), we're encouraged to travel comfortably and I feel taken care of. It’s a huge departure from my previous industry and employers.
I worked at one major media conglomerate who had some of the most draconian travel policies. We were booking a trip to Vegas for a conference and the Concur policy for booking travel refused to let us book in any hotel near the conference. I finally called the conglomerate's travel department (b/c Amex Travel, as kind as they are, couldn’t overrule the policy unless I booked direct) and explained we needed to be booked at a the MGM Grand (which had availability and was cheaper than the orher major strip casinos) and got into a 20 minute argument about why an off-strip motel 6 wasn’t appropriate (with outdoor access and a bunch of recent break-ins and at least 30 minutes away from where all our meetings and the conference would be), considering the fact that we were traveling with thousands of dollars worth of camera gear and the Uber/taxi fees would negate the cost savings.
We went through multiple rounds of arguments, I finally got approval, but then our per diem rules were insulting and basically undoable for Vegas. And then we arrive at the conference and I find our the sales staff is staying in suites at the Cosmopolitan. To say I was livid would be an understatement.
But I’m nothing if not resourceful and I convinced one of the sales bros to give me his corporate card for the trip so that my colleagues and I could drink and eat with impunity.
I worked at one major media conglomerate who had some of the most draconian travel policies. We were booking a trip to Vegas for a conference and the Concur policy for booking travel refused to let us book in any hotel near the conference. I finally called the conglomerate's travel department (b/c Amex Travel, as kind as they are, couldn’t overrule the policy unless I booked direct) and explained we needed to be booked at a the MGM Grand (which had availability and was cheaper than the orher major strip casinos) and got into a 20 minute argument about why an off-strip motel 6 wasn’t appropriate (with outdoor access and a bunch of recent break-ins and at least 30 minutes away from where all our meetings and the conference would be), considering the fact that we were traveling with thousands of dollars worth of camera gear and the Uber/taxi fees would negate the cost savings.
We went through multiple rounds of arguments, I finally got approval, but then our per diem rules were insulting and basically undoable for Vegas. And then we arrive at the conference and I find our the sales staff is staying in suites at the Cosmopolitan. To say I was livid would be an understatement.
But I’m nothing if not resourceful and I convinced one of the sales bros to give me his corporate card for the trip so that my colleagues and I could drink and eat with impunity.
Dec 25, 2018, 5:16 pm
#304
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Jupiter, FL
Programs: DL PM, Marriott Lifetime Titanium, Hilton Silver
Posts: 29,844
Ours as well. While it does a good job of lowest airfare, we can
Since the controls don't really have a pricing limit, we book an expensive hotel through the travel site, then go to the hotel site, cancel it and book the cheaper rate. Company is none the wiser, we save them money and stay in a nicer hotel.
Dec 25, 2018, 6:05 pm
#305
Suspended
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: DCA
Programs: UA US CO AA DL FL
Posts: 50,262
They do this for two reasons (only one of which is even remotely valid). The company gets kick backs based on volumes. It also allows companies to enforce travel policies and get metrics on travel data.
Ours as well. While it does a good job of lowest airfare, we canalmost always beat the hotel price.
Since the controls don't really have a pricing limit, we book an expensive hotel through the travel site, then go to the hotel site, cancel it and book the cheaper rate. Company is none the wiser, we save them money and stay in a nicer hotel.
Ours as well. While it does a good job of lowest airfare, we can
Since the controls don't really have a pricing limit, we book an expensive hotel through the travel site, then go to the hotel site, cancel it and book the cheaper rate. Company is none the wiser, we save them money and stay in a nicer hotel.
In addition to rebates, many corporate travel portals and their associated software will handle the back office accounting with employer's own accounting software. Not having to pay people to enter data can save a lot more money than some discount someone chased while on company time.
Dec 25, 2018, 6:36 pm
#306
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: YVR
Programs: AC SE 2MM; UA MP Premier Silver; Marriott Bonvoy LT Titanium Elite; Radisson; Avis PC
Posts: 35,255
@jrl767
I told the controller, in a politely paraphrased response, to "kiss my double bass", and advised that I will be booking the direct non-stops or at the very least, with one connection. I didn't hear a peep from anyone after that and stayed on for the rest of the project.
I told the controller, in a politely paraphrased response, to "kiss my double bass", and advised that I will be booking the direct non-stops or at the very least, with one connection. I didn't hear a peep from anyone after that and stayed on for the rest of the project.
Dec 25, 2018, 7:39 pm
#307
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: MSN
Programs: Delta DM, Bonvoy LT Titanium, Hertz PC
Posts: 1,987
I do this all the time, although the "enhanced" Marriott web site is making it a bit more difficult to change existing reservations to the lower (usually AAA or client rate) code.
Dec 25, 2018, 11:59 pm
#308
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: SEA (the REAL Washington); occasionally in the other Washington (DCA area)
Programs: DL PM 1.57MM; AS MVPG 100K
Posts: 21,373
I’ve had 100% success with that sort of rate change by speaking directly with the reservations manager (either by phone or in person on an earlier stay)
Dec 26, 2018, 12:15 am
#309
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Colorado
Programs: UA Gold (.85 MM), HH Diamond, SPG Platinum (LT Gold), Hertz PC, National EE
Posts: 5,656
Maybe I've mentioned it before, but one thing that drove me crazy was policies that didn't look at the big picture. Say for example I fly COS-DEN-XYZ, but flying out of COS exceeded the airfare limit by $50. That sets off the alarm, and I understand by itself. But the company has to pay for miles, toll road, expensive parking at DEN, all of which far exceed the $50 extra in airfare doing what I do. I will never forget when a colleague flew into an airport 400 miles away from our meeting with a client, because it met the airfare limits, then spent an extra two nights in a hotel in order to avoid the red flag. That was for a small company with less than 100 employees... Saved $125 in airfare, but cost us an extra 2 nights in hotel and 2 days in car rental. Stupid policy, but didn't violate it.
Or better yet; the call from the jerk boss with zero congrats for the highest commision check in the history of the 60 year old company (profit based commission). Instead it was a complaint that my expenses for the month were also number 1. Well duh, I made the company $200K in profit in 30 days, and it cost us $15K to do it that month. During that employment period (almost 10 years) I was #1 every year by a mile in revenue and profit.
So I'm my own boss now, but if I ever work for someone again and they demand that I sleep at the Motel 6, eat dinner at Applebee's, and drive a subcompact sedan from some no name rental company, they will enjoy my resignation letter instead.
Or better yet; the call from the jerk boss with zero congrats for the highest commision check in the history of the 60 year old company (profit based commission). Instead it was a complaint that my expenses for the month were also number 1. Well duh, I made the company $200K in profit in 30 days, and it cost us $15K to do it that month. During that employment period (almost 10 years) I was #1 every year by a mile in revenue and profit.
So I'm my own boss now, but if I ever work for someone again and they demand that I sleep at the Motel 6, eat dinner at Applebee's, and drive a subcompact sedan from some no name rental company, they will enjoy my resignation letter instead.
Dec 26, 2018, 6:54 am
#310
Suspended
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Watchlisted by the prejudiced, en route to purgatory
Programs: Just Say No to Fleecing and Blacklisting
Posts: 102,095
A friend’s company was hired by a much larger entity to perform a service for them in a relatively high cost locality. The contracting entity complained about the way they were billed for the lodging by my friend’s company. The friend’s company was buying hotel points to pay for room nights that included breakfast and supper in order to keep down the reimbursable expenses for the assignment. Instead of having a c. $350 daily cost per person for lodging and meals, the friend’s company had been informed how to do it for c. $135 per person per day by buying hotel points. This using of purchased points to save money didn’t make the contracting client happy, and so the friend’s company had to go back to a more traditional way of booking hotel stays and paying for meals that were to be reimbursed. Some parties just can’t handle too much proactive or out of the box thinking, and others just don’t want assignments completed under budget by too much.
Dec 26, 2018, 7:18 am
#311
Suspended
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Ontario, Canada
Programs: Aeroplan, IHG, Enterprise, Avios, Nexus
Posts: 8,355
The dumbest thing was an government employer who challenged some expenses after a week-long trade mission to Japan. I had submitted about $100 in incidental expenses and all of the receipts were, quite naturally, in Japanese. They hired a translator to confirm they were legitimate and were quite pleased to provide me with her report that identified a $20 receipt that was outside the guidelines. The cost of the translator was many times the value of the money they saved.
Dec 26, 2018, 9:42 am
#312
Suspended
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Watchlisted by the prejudiced, en route to purgatory
Programs: Just Say No to Fleecing and Blacklisting
Posts: 102,095
They are not kick backs. They are rebates. The former are criminal fraud. The latter are good business practice. In addition to rebates, there may also be outright discounts. Those are not necessarily transperent to the traveler.
In addition to rebates, many corporate travel portals and their associated software will handle the back office accounting with employer's own accounting software. Not having to pay people to enter data can save a lot more money than some discount someone chased while on company time.
In addition to rebates, many corporate travel portals and their associated software will handle the back office accounting with employer's own accounting software. Not having to pay people to enter data can save a lot more money than some discount someone chased while on company time.
Some rebates are elementally criminal fraud.
Dec 26, 2018, 10:00 am
#313
Join Date: Jan 2003
Programs: American Airlines Platinum, National Executive
Posts: 3,790
At the time, my colleagues considered the requirement to pay higher prices via the corporate travel site, rather than booking tickets directly with the airline at a lower cost (sometimes several hundred dollars lower per domestic coach trip), was probably due to the company having a minimum spending amount with the airline, and anything not booked through that site didn't count.
Dec 31, 2018, 5:20 pm
#314
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 291
I worked for a consulting company and they sent a consultant from another branch to our project and booked them on points to "save money" but the flight took all day (2 hour direct flight normally) and had three different stops and she had to leave on thursday instead of friday so billed two less days and pissed off the client. That's when I knew it was time to find a new job.
Jan 3, 2019, 7:13 am
#315
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Cockeysville, MD
Programs: Marriott Rewards Lifetime Titanium, Amex Plat, Hertz Gold 5*, National Exec, AA Plat
Posts: 9,467
Keeping employees "whole" is only one part of it. When you travel, you're also giving up being at home, with your family, doing things you would be doing otherwise on evenings and weekends. It's not easy to put a dollar amount on that and reimburse an employee for the personal time they're giving up, but the next best thing, IMO, is not to be stingy about reimbursement for meals, accommodation, and reasonable other incidental costs during travel to keep employees comfortable. One hopes that the value the company is getting out of the employee's travel is not so low that a few dollars more or less materially affects the business case for the travel.
I do love to travel, but I do say that those who think work travel is glamorous have never done it. Leaving Sunday nights. Getting home late Friday. Delays. Early mornings. Don't get me wrong-its a choice and I have made it. But don't argue over $20.00 please.