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Old Timer's Airline Quiz and Discussion

Old Timer's Airline Quiz and Discussion

Old Nov 15, 19, 4:16 pm
  #16891  
 
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Originally Posted by Toshbaf View Post
AA did fly into Orly until around the early 1990's or so, then switched to CDG. Delta also used Orly only and switched to CDG late, like AA. They didn't switch right after CDG opened.
When CDG opened in 1974 there was plenty of runway capacity but a shortage of terminal space. Only the circular Terminal 1 was provided at first, and only flights which had run from the nearby Le Bourget transferred over, none of Air France who at that time were concentrated at Orly. Only when the much larger T2 on the other side of the airport was progressively built did the transfer start.

We did a university study trip to Paris about 18 months after it opened, and as it was the mega-project of the country at the time I wanted to see it. It was a spare Saturday in the trip and only one other of my class colleagues was interested enough to join me. We went to the east end of Metro Line 3 at Gallieni from where there was a city RATP bus nonstop to CDG, all covered by our inner Paris Metro tickets. The bus was a typical older era simplistic dark green comfortless Paris city bus, designed with low gearing for the city cobbled streets, which was driven absolutely flat out (so maybe 50mph) on the Autoroute that ran from Gallieni through open country out to the airport, taking about 30 minutes, with the driver taking both hands off the wheel at intervals to relight his Gauloise. About half a dozen passengers. The vibration and noise were worse than a 1950s piston airliner. We speculated on whether our teeth would be shaken out before the end, or if the bus windows would fall out first.

In the terminal it seemed pretty deserted, and an example of the bizarre 1970s French ultra-modernist concrete architecture we had seen the previous day in the Pompidou Centre, counter-intuitive for finding your way and with oddball escalators all around thrumming away to no effect. There was zero visibility of any aircraft. I was hoping to see one of UTA, unknown in other European countries (the first UTA I ever saw, was a few years later at LAX heading for Tahiti). They had transferred from Le Bourget.

So there we go. Meanwhile, here in London today's aviation story has been the nonstop Qantas B787 flight from Heathrow to Sydney. Didn't see it, but I did see the last nonstop, which was 30 years ago in 1989 when they took delivery of their first 747-400 and did the same thing, by all accounts rather more marginal than today's. It was climbing pretty gently on minimal power, and beat up our old office some miles from Heathrow. Unexpectedly I heard it coming, suddenly clicked in, and went out into the car park to see it go. These long-haul Qantas flights being trialled (they did another JFK to Sydney) are termed "Project Sunrise" honouring a prior Qantas operation called the "Double Sunrise".

Bonus question : What was the "Double Sunrise", which aircraft, and which two airports did it link ?

Last edited by WHBM; Nov 15, 19 at 5:38 pm
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Old Nov 15, 19, 10:04 pm
  #16892  
 
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Originally Posted by WHBM View Post
These long-haul Qantas flights being trialled (they did another JFK to Sydney) are termed "Project Sunrise" honouring a prior Qantas operation called the "Double Sunrise".

Bonus question : What was the "Double Sunrise", which aircraft, and which two airports did it link ?
Bonus question : What was the "Double Sunrise", which aircraft, and which two airports did it link ?
Consolidated PBY Catalina sea planes.
Linking Broome, WA to SLAF Koggala (Ceylon) and eventually to London.

What to Parisians call CDG? The last time I took a taxi, I told the driver (in French) that I wanted to go to the airport in Roissy.
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Old Nov 15, 19, 10:18 pm
  #16893  
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Originally Posted by WHBM View Post
So there we go. Meanwhile, here in London today's aviation story has been the nonstop Qantas B787 flight from Heathrow to Sydney. Didn't see it, but I did see the last nonstop, which was 30 years ago in 1989 when they took delivery of their first 747-400 and did the same thing, by all accounts rather more marginal than today's. It was climbing pretty gently on minimal power, and beat up our old office some miles from Heathrow. Unexpectedly I heard it coming, suddenly clicked in, and went out into the car park to see it go. These long-haul Qantas flights being trialled (they did another JFK to Sydney) are termed "Project Sunrise" honouring a prior Qantas operation called the "Double Sunrise".
IIRC, the 747 was towed to the end of the runway and/or refuelled there so as to depart with completely-full fuel tanks. Don't recall if it was fully dry-equipped (i.e., had all the regular seating) either.
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Old Nov 16, 19, 1:38 am
  #16894  
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Originally Posted by Toshbaf View Post
This I know. AA did fly into Orly until around the early 1990's or so, then switched to CDG. Delta also used Orly only and switched to CDG late, like AA. They didn't switch right after CDG opened.

thank you ... I know Iím nowhere as knowledgeable of airline esoterica as many others
Originally Posted by Toshbaf View Post
4A - BHM-DTW, Northwest, McDonnell Douglas MD-80
4B - DTW-YMX-BRU, Sabena, Boeing 747 (though they used the DC-10-30 on many occasions and mixed up ORD, DTW. YYZ as tag ends with BOS and YMX)
4C - BRU-BEY MEA / Sabena codeshare, Boeing 707
sorry, this wasnít your day :/

4A: DTW incorrect, NW incorrect, M80 incorrect
4B: YMX incorrect, SN incorrect
4C: SN incorrect
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Old Nov 16, 19, 2:04 am
  #16895  
 
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Originally Posted by jrl767 View Post

sorry, this wasnít your day :/

4A: DTW incorrect, NW incorrect, M80 incorrect
4B: YMX incorrect, SN incorrect
4C: SN incorrect


But I AM determined to get to BEY!

4A: BMH-IAH, Continental, McDonnell Douglas DC-9-30
4B: IAH-CCS-AMS, VIASA Boeing 747
4C: AMS-BEY MEA/KLM codeshare, Boeing 707
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Old Nov 16, 19, 2:15 am
  #16896  
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Originally Posted by Toshbaf View Post
But I AM determined to get to BEY!7

I admire your determination (just fyi, AeroMexico is not part of the answer )

Originally Posted by Toshbaf View Post
4A: BHM-IAH, Continental, McDonnell Douglas DC-9-30
4B: IAH-CCS-AMS, VIASA Boeing 747
4C: AMS-BEY MEA/KLM codeshare, Boeing 707
once again, props for a very admirable effort ... however, only a bit of success

4A: IAH incorrect, CO incorrect, D9S incorrect — this does, by process of elimination, identify the aircraft type
4B: CCS incorrect, AMS incorrect, VA incorrect — but hold that thought
4C: KL incorrect

HINT: the enroute stop on leg 4B was in the U.S.
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Old Nov 16, 19, 7:24 pm
  #16897  
 
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Trying again!

4A: BHM-TPA, Republic, McDonnell Douglas DC-9-10
4B: TPA-MCO-FRA, Lufthansa, Boeing 747 (not sure if this was the correct tag end but will try)
4C: FRA-BEY MEA LH codeshare, Boeing 707
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Old Nov 16, 19, 8:38 pm
  #16898  
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Originally Posted by Toshbaf View Post
Trying again!

4A: BHM-TPA, Republic, McDonnell Douglas DC-9-10
4B: TPA-MCO-FRA, Lufthansa, Boeing 747 (not sure if this was the correct tag end but will try)
4C: FRA-BEY MEA LH codeshare, Boeing 707
on your way; well done!

4A- TPA correct, RC correct, DC9 correct
4B- MCO incorrect, FRA incorrect, LH incorrect
4C- LH incorrect

HINT (which I probably should have provided in the original question): the TPA-XXX-YYY flight was also a code-share; for a number of years prior to 1983 it had originated at another U.S. city, and in its earliest days that other city had actually been an intermediate stop as well
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Old Nov 16, 19, 9:04 pm
  #16899  
 
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Originally Posted by jrl767 View Post
on your way; well done!

4A- TPA correct, RC correct, DC9 correct
4B- MCO incorrect, FRA incorrect, LH incorrect
4C- LH incorrect

HINT (which I probably should have provided in the original question): the TPA-XXX-YYY flight was also a code-share; for a number of years prior to 1983 it had originated at another U.S. city, and in its earliest days that other city had actually been an intermediate stop as well
Today, I have a cold but I am SO happy with that post!

What we know:
4A -BMH-TPA, Republic, DC9

New answer:
4B: TPA-MIA-LGW, British Airways, 747
4C: LGW-BEY, MEA / British Caledonian code share, 707
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Old Nov 16, 19, 9:10 pm
  #16900  
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Originally Posted by Toshbaf View Post
Today, I have a cold but I am SO happy with that post!

What we know:
4A -BHM-TPA, Republic, DC9

New answer:
4B: TPA-MIA-LGW, British Airways, 747
4C: LGW-BEY, MEA / British Caledonian code share, 707
getting closer by the minute!

4B- MIA incorrect, L correct, GW incorrect, BA partially correct (not for this leg)
4C- BR incorrect

Last edited by jrl767; Nov 18, 19 at 12:16 pm
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Old Nov 16, 19, 9:55 pm
  #16901  
 
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4A: BMH-TPA, Republic, DC9
4B: TPA-IAD-LHR, Pan Am, 747
4C: LHR-BEY, MEA / British Airways codeshare, 707

This might be it. Or getting closer not not a cigar yet.
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Old Nov 18, 19, 12:12 pm
  #16902  
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paging WHBM ...
Why has placement of jet engines changed?
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Old Nov 18, 19, 12:16 pm
  #16903  
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Originally Posted by Toshbaf View Post
4A: BHM-TPA, Republic, DC9
4B: TPA-IAD-LHR, Pan Am, 747
4C: LHR-BEY, MEA / British Airways codeshare, 707

This might be it. Or getting closer not not a cigar yet.
4B- LHR correct, PA partially correct; still need the code-share airline (this should not be at all difficult)
4C- BA correct

BONUS QUESTIONS (all of which have been discussed several times in the earlier days of this thread):
4D: for a number of years prior to 1983 the TPA-IAD-LHR flight originated at another U.S. city ... what was this city?
4E: in this interchange flight's earliest days, that other city had actually been an intermediate stop as well ... what was the initial point of origin?
4F: what was the equipment on this two-stop flight?

Last edited by jrl767; Nov 18, 19 at 12:28 pm
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Old Nov 18, 19, 4:22 pm
  #16904  
 
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Originally Posted by jrl767 View Post
4B- LHR correct, PA partially correct; still need the code-share airline (this should not be at all difficult)

BONUS QUESTIONS (all of which have been discussed several times in the earlier days of this thread):
4D: for a number of years prior to 1983 the TPA-IAD-LHR flight originated at another U.S. city ... what was this city?
4E: in this interchange flight's earliest days, that other city had actually been an intermediate stop as well ... what was the initial point of origin?
4F: what was the equipment on this two-stop flight?
I'll try these....

4B: I believe the code-share airline was Delta.

4D: I'll guess New Orleans (MSY).

4E: I think we are looking for another U.S. city here. If so, let's try Houston Hobby (HOU) as the initial point of origin (although this is probably incorrect as there was a BN/PA interchange service back then between Houston and London).

4F: Let's go with a DC8.
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Old Nov 18, 19, 5:15 pm
  #16905  
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Originally Posted by jlemon View Post
I'll try these....

4B: I believe the code-share airline was Delta.

4D: I'll guess New Orleans (MSY).

4E: I think we are looking for another U.S. city here. If so, let's try Houston Hobby (HOU) as the initial point of origin (although this is probably incorrect as there was a BN/PA interchange service back then between Houston and London).

4F: Let's go with a DC8.
welcome back! you hit the "traffic light" with one answer in each of the three colors!
4B- correct
4D- partially correct there's not much remaining in the way of choices given the next answer, so I'll just wrap it up here
4E- incorrect the earliest timetables that I can find (Aug 1966 DL and Aug 1966 PA) show this flight operating MSY-ATL-IAD-LHR; when I took DL106 in Dec 1972, it originated ATL
4F- correct
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