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KVS Availability Tool

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Old Feb 12, 2015, 9:19 am
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Last edit by: TWA884
Please submit technical support and customer service requests directly to KVS through their website.
FlyerTalk is not KVS' customer assistance venue.
The primary purpose of the Travel Tools forum is to benefit the entire FlyerTalk community.
Anything related to the KVS Availability Tool may be discussed here, including member to member requests for troubleshooting.


Where does the KVS tool get its data and is KVS authorized to provide this data in the manner it is presented?

The tool is known to access a variety of web sites, many in a manner that is not authorized. Please see the next section of this Wiki for a list of sites believed to be accessed and their data access policies (where known).

Additionally, under some conditions the tool appears to access sites via a KVS-operated back end. This means that the tool is not just a 'web browser' that runs via a user's machine. No detailed public information is available about how this works or whether any of this back-end access is authorized.Note: To edit the wikipost, please contact the moderator by sending an alert or a private message.


Websites KVS Accesses and their relevant Terms of Use

http://book.aircanada.com/pl/AConlin...verrideServlet
http://book.aircanada.com/pl/AConlin...PreviewServlet
https://book.aircanada.com/pl/AConli...verrideServlet
https://www.aircanada.com
Terms of Use:
http://www.aircanada.com/en/about/legal/notice.html
Use of our web site for any other purpose, including any commercial use or purpose, is expressly prohibited.
Without limiting the generality of the foregoing, you agree that, in using or accessing our website, you shall not commit or participate in any of the following acts or actions, each of which is expressly prohibited under this User Agreement:
directly or indirectly, use or access, or encourage, solicit, permit, facilitate, aid, assist or abet, including, but not limited to, the selling, licensing, distribution or provision to any person of any means that permit, the use or access, or agree to provide the use or access, of our website through any manual process or any automatic, electronic or technical device, including but not limited to automated scripts, robots, crawls, screen scrapers, web "bots", deep-links, indexes, spiders, click-spams, macro programs, or any other device, program, software, system, algorithm, methodology or technology, now known or hereinafter discovered, that performs the same or a similar function, in order to, without limitation: "data mine"; "screen scrape"; data process; access, extract, copy, distribute, aggregate or acquire information; generate impressions or clicks; input or store information; search or generate searches; or manipulate or monitor any portion or content of our website;

http://data.flight24.com/flights/
Terms of Use:
http://www.flightradar24.com/terms-and-conditions
Websites information and Services are provided for personal, non-commercial use only. Permission is granted to temporarily download one copy of the materials (information or software) on Flightradar24s web site for personal, non-commercial transitory viewing only. This is the grant of a license, not a transfer of title, and under this license you may not:

Modify or copy the materials;
Use the materials for any commercial purpose, or for any public display (commercial or non-commercial);
Attempt to decompile or reverse engineer any software contained on Flightradar24's web site;
Remove any copyright or other proprietary notations from the materials; or
Transfer the materials to another person or "mirror" the materials on any other server.

This license shall automatically terminate if you violate any of these restrictions and may be terminated by Flightradar24 at any time. Upon terminating your viewing of these materials or upon the termination of this license, you must destroy any downloaded materials in your possession whether in electronic or printed format.

http://data.seatexpert.com/tpi/find.php
Terms of Use:

http://plane.lan.com/cgi-bin/recibo_...bo_eticket.cgi
Terms of Use:
http://www.lan.com/en_us/sitio_perso...-use/about-us/
You may use the information on our site solely for non-commercial purposes, and any use or modification of the website contents is not permitted.

https://book.austrian.com/app/fb.fly
Terms of Use:
http://www.austrian.com/Info/LegalRe..._lang=en&cc=AT
2. Proprietary rights
All trademark rights, copyrights, database rights and other intellectual property rights to the contents of the Austrian-website, (as well as the organization and layout of the website), together with the underlying software code rest, either with Austrian or with its licensors. You may not, either in whole or in part, copy, modify, distribute or use or reproduce in other form contents of the Austrian-website, or the underlying software code, without the prior written consent of Austrian.

3. Permissible use
All Austrian-website online services (including the booking machine) are provided solely for the purpose of enabling you to check the availability of goods or services relating to your journey (the timetable, for example), make legitimate reservations, use our online check-in or transact other business with suppliers. You may only use the website in accordance with these terms and conditions and for the legally permitted purposes described above. In particular, you indicate your agreement to the following:
...
3.5 You may not reproduce information from the Austrian-website for commercial purposes. This also includes providing prices for Austrian flights on another website or another online server. In particular you may not copy, distribute, in other way use or reproduce discarded content from the Austrian-website with the help of 'robots', other search machine technologies or through other automatic mechanisms.

https://booking.qatarairways.com/qri...Booking.action
Terms of Use:

https://book.tam.com.br/TAM/dyn/air/...ng/retrievePNR
Terms of Use:

https://classic.checkmytrip.com/plne...ievePNR.action
Terms of Use:
(D) not to use any automated system or software to extract data from the Application, Documents or Services for commercial purposes (such as screen scraping);

https://en.aegeanair.com
Terms of Use:

https://eservice.evaair.com
Terms of Use:

https://flymas.mobi/itravel/viewBooking.xhtml
Terms of Use:

https://fly.rj.com/MyBookings/Home/EN/Default.aspx
Terms of Use:

http://skyvector.com/airport/
Terms of Use:

https://m.aeroflot.ru/b/info/pnr/load
Terms of Use:

https://mm.alitalia.com/GB_EN/booking/apvsearch.aspx
Terms of Use:

https://mobile1.emirates.com/myb/review.xhtml
Terms of Use:

https://myb.s7.ru/getMyBooking.action
Terms of Use:

https://mytripandmore.com/Itinerary.aspx
Terms of Use:
https://mytripandmore.com/TermsAndConditions.aspx
Except as expressly permitted by these Terms, you may not:
...
9. use any "robot", "spider" or other automatic device, software, program, algorithm, routine, methodology, or any manual process or functionality:
...to monitor, assemble, analyse, index, copy, transmit, distribute, transfer, or link to any of the pages, data, materials, or content available on the Site,

https://pilotweb.nas.faa.gov/PilotWe...yICAOAction.do
Terms of Use:

https://prefunds.aa.com/refunds/receipt
https://www.aa.com/reservation/findReservationSubmit.do
Terms of Use:
https://www.aa.com/i18n/footer/siteUsage.jsp
Intellectual property notifications
...
D. American Airlines owns or uses by permission all software contained on the Site, including without limitation all HTML code and Active X controls. Copyright and other laws and international treaty provisions protect this software. The law expressly prohibits any modification, redistribution, or reproduction of the software, and such actions could result in severe civil and criminal penalties. American Airlines will seek and support prosecuting violators to the maximum extent possible.
E. You may not copy, display, distribute, download, license, modify, publish, re-post, reproduce, reuse, sell, transmit, use to create a derivative work, or otherwise use the content of the Site for public or commercial purposes. Nothing on the Site shall be construed to confer any grant or license of any intellectual property rights, whether by estoppel, by implication, or otherwise.
...
Limitations on your use:
You agree that you will not Misuse the Site. "Misuse" includes, but is not limited to, using the Site to do any of the following:
...
L. Copy or create derivative works from, display, distribute, license, perform, publish, recreate, reproduce, sell, transfer, or transmit any information, products, services, or software obtained by, from, or through the Site.
M. Monitor or copy any Content by using any manual process, or any robot, spider, or other automatic device, without first obtaining American Airlines' prior written consent.

https://raw.github.com/opentraveldat...i_airlines.csv
Terms of Use:

https://tickets.airtran.com/SeatAvailability.aspx
Terms of Use:
http://www.southwest.com/html/about-...ons/index.html
Prohibited Activities

You may not copy, display, distribute, download, license, modify, publish, re-post, reproduce, reuse, sell, transmit, use to create a derivative work, or otherwise use the content of this site for public or commercial purposes without our express written permission. Nothing on this site shall be construed to confer any grant or license of any intellectual property rights, whether by estoppel, by implication, or otherwise.

You may not modify, re-render, frame, mirror, truncate, add to, inject, filter or change the order of the information contained on any page of the Southwest Airlines sites, including, without limitation, by any way of reproducing Southwest Airlines or SWABiz web pages or Company information on any other web site without our express written permission.

You may not copy, derive, edit, translate, decompile, reverse engineer, modify, use, or reproduce any code or source relating to our sites, including without limitation, any service or product Southwest offers.

You may not cause to appear any pop-up, pop-under, exit windows, expanding buttons, banners advertisement, or anything else which minimizes, covers, or otherwise inhibits the full display of the Southwest Airlines sites.

You may not use any deep-link, page-scrape, robot, crawl, index, spider, click spam, macro programs, Internet agent, or other automatic device, program, algorithm or methodology which does the same things, to use, access, copy, acquire information, generate impressions or clicks, input information, store information, search, generate searches, or monitor any portion of the Southwest Airlines sites or Company information.
...
You may not disguise the origin of information transmitted to, from, or through the Southwest Airlines sites. You may not circumvent any measures implemented by Southwest Airlines aimed at preventing violations of the Use Agreement. You may not violate the restrictions in any robot exclusion header.

When you use the Southwest Airlines sites or Company information for an authorized purpose, you must include all proprietary notices without changing, hiding or deleting them.

You may not engage in any conduct that is, or that Southwest Airlines deems to be, in violation of this Use Agreement.

https://wftc3.e-travel.com
Terms of Use:

https://wtrweb.worldtracer.aero/WorldTracerWeb/pax.do
Terms of Use:

https://www121.jal.co.jp/JmbWeb/JR/S...MileCalc_en.do
Terms of Use:

https://www4.thy.com/mybookings/ETDisplay.tk
https://www4.thy.com/mybookings/getPnr.tk
Terms of Use:

https://www.airfrance.fr/cgi-bin/AF/...chPnrAction.do
Terms of Use:

https://www.alaskaair.com/booking/reservationlookup
Terms of Use:

https://www.bookonline.saudiairlines...verride.action
https://www.bookonline.saudiairlines...verride.action
Terms of Use:

https://www.britishairways.com/trave...g/public/en_gb
Terms of Use:
http://www.britishairways.com/en-gb/...rms-conditions

All Materials on this website, the appearance, organisation and layout of this website, the underlying software code and the underlying data are subject to trade marks, copyright, database rights and other registered and unregistered intellectual property rights which are owned either directly by Us or by Our licensors.

Unless otherwise authorised within these Terms and Conditions, You must not copy, modify, alter, publish, broadcast, distribute, sell or transfer (whether in whole or in part) any Material on this website or the underlying software code or underlying data.
...
Your access to this website is on a temporary basis, and we reserve the right to withdraw, restrict or amend the services accessibly to You on the website without notice at our absolute discretion.

You may only use this website in accordance with these Terms and Conditions and, in any event, for lawful and proper purposes which includes complying with all applicable laws, regulations and codes of practice within the UK or other jurisdiction from which You are accessing this website. Except as expressly permitted by Us, You shall not use this website for any purpose.

In particular, You agree that, You must not:

post, transmit or disseminate any information on or via this website which is or may be harmful, obscene, defamatory or otherwise illegal;
use screen scraping, any automated algorithm, device, method, system, software or manual process to access, use, search, copy, monitor or extract Material (in whole or in part) from or through using this website unless We have given Our express written agreement;
...

https://www.checkmytrip.com/CMTSERVLET
Terms of Use:
https://www.checkmytrip.com/cmt/apf/...&SITE=NCMTNCMT
3. Licence restrictions

3.1 Except as expressly set out in this EULA or as permitted by any local law, you agree:
...
(D) not to use any automated system or software to extract data from the Application, Documents or Services for commercial purposes (such as screen scraping);

https://www.delta.com/mytrips/findPnr.action
http://www.delta.com/ism/SeatMapDisplay.action
http://www.delta.com/shared/components/blank.jsp
Terms of Use:

https://www.finnair.com
Terms of Use:

https://www.flysas.com
Terms of Use:

https://www.iberia.com/web/retrievePNR.do
Terms of Use:

https://www.lot.com
Terms of Use:

https://www.lufthansa.com
Terms of Use:
http://www.lufthansa.com/online/port...d=2016866&l=en

2. Proprietary rights
...You may not, either in whole or in part, copy, modify, distribute or use or reproduce in other form contents of the Lufthansa-website, or the underlying software code, without the prior written consent of Deutsche Lufthansa AG.
https://www.routehappy.com/
Terms of Use:

https://www.swiss.com
Terms of Use:

https://www.tripforyou.net/t4u/PTopAction.do
Terms of Use:

https://www.tripple.jp
Terms of Use:

https://www.united.com/web/en-US/app...n/default.aspx
Terms of Use:
https://www.united.com/web/en-US/content/legal.aspx This website is for the User's personal, noncommercial use only. User agrees not to modify, copy, alter, distribute, transmit, display, perform, reproduce, publish, license, create derivative works from, transfer, or sell any information, software, products or services obtained from this website without Uniteds prior written permission. User agrees not to use any robot, spider, other automatic device, or manual process to monitor or copy this website or the content contained therein or for any other unauthorized purpose without Uniteds prior written permission. ... United reserves the right to investigate any illegal and/or unauthorized use of this website, including, but not limited to, unauthorized framing of this website or unauthorized use of any robot, spider or other automated device, and to take appropriate legal action, including, without limitation, civil, criminal and injunctive redress.

https://www.viewtrip.com/GetItin.aspx
Terms of Use:

https://www.virginamerica.com/book/ow/a1/
Terms of Use:

https://www.virgin-atlantic.com/en/g...ndBooking.next
Terms of Use:

https://www.virtuallythere.com/new/reservations.html
Terms of Use:

http://weather.noaa.gov/weather/current/
Terms of Use:

http://worldaerodata.com/wad.cgi
Terms of Use:

http://www.airframes.org/fleet/
Terms of Use:

http://www.cathaypacific.com/cx/en_H...oking-now.html
Terms of Use:

http://www.flightradar24.com/
Terms of Use:

http://www.FlightStats.com/go/Flight...ingByFlight.do
http://www.FlightStats.com/go/Flight...tusByFlight.do
Terms of Use:

http://www.flightview.com/TravelTool...eryResults.asp
http://www.flightview.com/TravelTools/viewairport.asp
Terms of Use:

http://www.gcmap.com/airport/
http://www.gcmap.com/mapui
Terms of Use:
http://www.gcmap.com/faq/using
Q: May I use the Great Circle Mapper's maps on my web page?
A: You may use maps generated by the Great Circle Mapper on non-commercial web pages (q.v. commericial use below) so long as you do not profit from them and you include the following credit on pages which include maps:
...
Q: May I use the Great Circle Mapper's maps for commercial sites or publications?
A: Please write to Karl L. Swartz regarding terms for commercial use of the maps.

http://www.iata.org/about/members/Pa...line-list.aspx
Terms of Use:
http://www.iata.org/Pages/terms.aspx
2. Your Conduct

The content on this Site is for your personal use only within the organization or entity to which you are attached as applicable, and it is not intended for commercial exploitation unless expressly agreed in writing by IATA through a duly authorized representative. IATA authorizes you to download or reproduce selected materials at this Site only for your personal, non-commercial use, in the ordinary course of business provided that you retain all copyright and other proprietary notices contained in the original materials on any copies of the materials and that the title or database brand name and IATA name is stated as the source.

You may not otherwise modify, disassemble, create derivative works, distribute, reproduce, publicly display, perform, transmit, re-transmit, sell, rent, sublicense, or otherwise use any materials or content on this Site for commercial or non-commercial exploitation by yourself or the organization or entity to which you are attached or permit third parties to so do. Without limitation, unlimited or wholesale reproduction, copying of the content for commercial or non-commercial purposes and unwarranted modification of data and information within the content is not permitted, and any use of these materials on any other website or networked computer environment for any purpose without IATAs prior written consent is prohibited.
...
4. Intellectual Property Rights

...You must not modify, decompile, or reverse engineer any software IATA discloses to you via this Site, and you must not remove, overprint, or deface any notice of copyright, trademark, logo, legend, or other notice of ownership from any originals or copies of software or information from the website. "IATA Trademarks" means all names, marks, brands, URL names or addresses, logos, designs, trade dress and other designations IATA uses in connection with Products or Services. You are not permitted to incorporate any IATA Trademarks into any other trademarks, service marks, company names, Internet addresses, domain names, or any other similar designations. Any unauthorized use of any materials contained on this website may violate copyright laws, trademark laws, the laws of privacy and publicity, and communications regulations and statutes.

http://www.itn.net/cgi/get
Terms of Use:

http://www.kenya-airways.com/kqbook.aspx
Terms of Use:

http://www.myairlines.ru
Terms of Use:

http://www.qantas.com.au/regions/do/dyn/checkmytrip
Terms of Use:

http://www.seatexpert.com/multiple_results.php
Terms of Use:

http://www.seatguru.com/ajax/findseatmap.php
Terms of Use:

http://www.seatmaestro.com/airlines-...eckmytrip.html
http://www.seatmaestro.com/themes/de...te_airline.php
Terms of Use:

http://www.seatplans.com/ajax/Airline
http://www.seatplans.com/ajax/airports-and-city
http://www.seatplans.com/find-and-compare/
Terms of Use:
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KVS Availability Tool

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Old Feb 5, 2015 | 12:58 pm
  #256  
KVS
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Originally Posted by IMH
I imagine everyone would be even more interested to hear KVS's authoritative voice on the future of his product.
KVS Tool Members will continue to enjoy its unsurpassed Award Availability Coverage, which includes 100% Award Coverage across all Star Alliance, OneWorld and SkyTeam airlines, as well as a variety of other useful features and functions for frequent travellers.

Originally Posted by IMH
It has now been months since "Availability" became "Currently Unavailable"
Actually, Regular Availability continues to be accessible via the KVS Tool Mobile Companion.

Originally Posted by IMH
yet subscriptions are still being offered
Indeed.

Originally Posted by IMH
and the app is still called the "Availability Tool".
More accurately, it's called KVS Tool, although both names have been used interchangeably for many years now. Also, the term "Availability" encompasses all types of Availability (including Award & Upgrade Availability).

Originally Posted by IMH
What happens next, KVS?
The same thing that has been happening over the last 10+ years, since the inception of the KVS Tool in 2004 -- its Members will continue to enjoy the benefits it provides.
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Old Feb 5, 2015 | 1:10 pm
  #257  
Moderator: Travel Safety/Security, Travel Tools, California, Los Angeles; FlyerTalk Evangelist
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Originally Posted by KVS
More accurately, it's called KVS Tool, although both names have been used interchangeably for many years now. Also, the term "Availability" encompasses all types of Availability (including Award & Upgrade Availability).
The homepage is titled: KVS Availability Tool: Global Flight Availability, Award Availability, Fares, Timetables, Seat Maps.
TWA884 is offline  
Old Feb 6, 2015 | 2:41 am
  #258  
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Originally Posted by KVS
More accurately, it's called KVS Tool, although both names have been used interchangeably for many years now. Also, the term "Availability" encompasses all types of Availability (including Award & Upgrade Availability).
KVS, your own screenshots suggest something else... Have a look here [deleted by moderator] And I have taken time stamped forensically clean screen shots of that link, so do not try to change them [deleted by moderator] again...

Last edited by TWA884; Feb 6, 2015 at 9:02 am Reason: Personal exchange
vbroucek is offline  
Old Feb 6, 2015 | 2:47 am
  #259  
40 Countries Visited
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Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Tasmania, Australia
Programs: M&M SEN, Amex Plat, Marriott, HHonors & Accor Gold, Velocity Silver, Qantas Bronze
Posts: 3,813
Originally Posted by vbroucek
Finally as a challenge, can someone who still has KVS subscription find me some reasonably priced REVENUE availability between HBA and FUN, return? I think it could be FUN to try to check that post box KVS has its domain registered to
[deleted by moderator] How about KVS? Aren't you interested in a bit of FUN?

Last edited by TWA884; Feb 6, 2015 at 9:06 am Reason: FlyerTalk Rule 12.3
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Old Feb 6, 2015 | 11:32 am
  #260  
KVS
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Originally Posted by Lurker1999
Can KVS currently search accurately for Star Alliance upgrade space (i.e. I class)?
Most certainly -- KVS Tool supports I Class Award/Upgrade Availability on all 29 Star Alliance member carriers.
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Old Feb 8, 2015 | 10:22 am
  #261  
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: MSP
Posts: 398
I've read through a little bit, but I just wanted to confirm that Fare Availability (e.g. F0 J0 .... Y0) no longer exists right?

I hadn't realized this change had occurred.
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Old Feb 8, 2015 | 10:25 am
  #262  
Moderator: The British Airways Club
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Originally Posted by shuom
I've read through a little bit, but I just wanted to confirm that Fare Availability (e.g. F0 J0 .... Y0) no longer exists right?

I hadn't realized this change had occurred.
It's not in the desktop tool but is available via the mobile companion (kvstool/mc). The trouble I found is that the POS can vary and it's not clear what POS has been used to produce the results.
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Old Feb 8, 2015 | 2:29 pm
  #263  
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Issue with AC-Star Alliance method

When searching a date at the edge of the booking window (e.g. + 252 days) I sometimes (but not always) get an error stating I cannot search dates beyond date xxxx (where xxx is +255 days) when I am not searching beyond that date.
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Old Feb 8, 2015 | 3:28 pm
  #264  
KVS
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Originally Posted by pschafer
When searching a date at the edge of the booking window (e.g. + 252 days) I sometimes (but not always) get an error stating I cannot search dates beyond date xxxx (where xxx is +255 days) when I am not searching beyond that date.
It's a limitation of the [Awards/AC-StarAlliance] Engine, which requires a return date for searches. Accordingly, the Maximum Date Range for that Method can vary from 352 to 355 days, depending on the Time Zones and routes involved.

We will be introducing a POS option for that Method in the next update, which should provide a work-around for this issue.
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Old Feb 11, 2015 | 3:00 am
  #265  
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
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SQ website/KVS showing different data

Hi,

Just wondering if you can help me with something: The KVS tool is showng CM+, but I can't book this u/g via the SQ website. Is it worth calling and asking about it? I could change my flights to something more amenable to u/g otherwise...

TIA
PG
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Old Feb 11, 2015 | 3:21 am
  #266  
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Posts: 3,813
Originally Posted by Placebogirl
Hi,

Just wondering if you can help me with something: The KVS tool is showng CM+, but I can't book this u/g via the SQ website. Is it worth calling and asking about it? I could change my flights to something more amenable to u/g otherwise...

TIA
PG
KVS (Availability) Tool is no longer reliable source of information...
vbroucek is offline  
Old Feb 11, 2015 | 11:43 am
  #267  
KVS
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Location: Worldwide
Posts: 12,952
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Originally Posted by Placebogirl
Just wondering if you can help me with something: The KVS tool is showng CM+, but I can't book this u/g via the SQ website. Is it worth calling and asking about it? I could change my flights to something more amenable to u/g otherwise...
CM are Medium Level Awards, not Upgrades.
For Business Upgrade availability, you need to look for CS Class.

Please consult the SQ section of the KVS Tool User Guide for details:
http://Help.KVSTool.com/#SQ
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Old Feb 11, 2015 | 10:44 pm
  #268  
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No HA availability, but available on AA.com??

I understand some of the issues re. screen scraping but as someone pointed out time is money and kvstool does a reasonable job of simplifying (or rather organizing) cumbersome multiple searches. I used it for a bunch of award searches recently and I think I could replicated the functionality using the underlying data sources that KVS itself uses; however the convenience and (once you get used to it) the (artificial) similarity of the views across multiple sources is useful.

So after a 2 month trial, I signed up for an annual subscription. A sucker perhaps but whatever.

Anyways...a question. KVStool claims award availability for Hawaiian is only available in the mobile companion. Per the guide, the econcomy class booking code is T.

HA Hawaiian Airlines T Economy Award# P First Additional/HM "Flex" Award

P First Upgrade [Mobile Companion] # Partner redemptions only
Here's the output:
HA 45 SJO
07:50 OGG
11:15 763/0
03:25 Info
Seat Map
F7 J5 P3 C0 A0 Y7 W7 X7 Q7 V7 B2 S0 N0 M0 I0 H0 G0 K0 L0 Z0 O0
Another strange KVS quirk is that it sometimes converts San Jose CA (SJC) to SJO (San Juan Puerto Rico???) on output. However the flight number is a valid HA flight from San Jose. Ignoring this quirk, why is there no T availability?

AA.com shows at least one seat is available in Economy. (This is for Feb 25, 2015)

American Airlines
Alaska Airlines
Hawaiian Airlines
All Area Airports
San Jose
SJC - San Jose International
OAK - Oakland Metropolitan Oak Intl
SFO - San Francisco International
Kahului
OGG - Kahului Airport Kahului Maui

Tue Feb 24
Wed Feb 25
Thu Feb 26

Additional eligible airports for award travel may be included.
17.5K
HA 45
7:50 AM
SJC
11:15 AM
OGG
Hawaiian Airlines
Seat information not available Meal: Breakfast
Aircraft: 763 Booking Code: T
Total travel time: 5hr 25min Cabin: Economy
Flight Details
rj123456 is offline  
Old Feb 11, 2015 | 11:29 pm
  #269  
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Originally Posted by rj123456
I understand some of the issues re. screen scraping but as someone pointed out time is money and kvstool does a reasonable job of simplifying (or rather organizing) cumbersome multiple searches. I used it for a bunch of award searches recently and I think I could replicated the functionality using the underlying data sources that KVS itself uses; however the convenience and (once you get used to it) the (artificial) similarity of the views across multiple sources is useful.
It might also be easier and faster to walk into a bank with a gun when looking for money vs. filling out a withdrawal slip. But that's theft and it's unarguably wrong. The data sources KVS uses generally prhibit the use KVS makes of them. That's theft, too. It may be easier, but that doesn't make it right.

I'd have no problem paying for data if I knew it were legitimately obtained. In this case it is most clearly not and the funds paid are going into the pocket of someone who has taken it against the wishes of its owners/sources.
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Old Feb 12, 2015 | 1:30 am
  #270  
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Originally Posted by Xyzzy
The data sources KVS uses generally prhibit the use KVS makes of them....That's theft
[deleted by moderator]

How is it prohibited? By the Terms of Service? Which part of ToS exactly does it violate? Most critics of KVS have said that ToS often forbid scraping, so I assume that is what you are saying. Scrapers generally read the information and store it which KVS does not do. KVS immediately presents the information in a different format without storing anything. Therefore KVS tool should be considered as an alternative browser.

If you want to argue that the ToS can forbid alternative presentation of a site, I am not sure that the law supports that*. And such a stance would mean that anybody who (for example) turns off of displaying images, changes the font size, uses a translation or similar widget, or has a disability that requires a special browser cannot access any such sites. And that they (or the vendors of those browsers) are also thieves.

(*Many users are not located in the US. Are you an expert in how those ToS apply in each country in the world? Also note that many of the websites are also not US websites.)

Last edited by TWA884; Feb 12, 2015 at 8:45 am Reason: Comment on moderation
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