PTravel

aptX, including aptX HD, is a lossy codec.

FLAC is compressed, but lossless. Put it over EDR or aptX and it becomes lossy. Any way you look at it, it is inferior to wired.

This is a perfect example of what I mean about Apple's philosophy. CD quality may be good enough for most people, but certainly not for all, and not remotely as good as HD audio. I had a portable HD audio player that I use when I want highest quality. It plays a variety of codecs, including FLAC, at up to 192k/24-bit, which is considered studio quality. Interestingly, my Note 8 handles FLAC, too, but I haven't been able to find out the specs of the audio section. In any event, they are discernibly less my HD audio player. However, they are certainly better (through a wired phone) than aptX. Until there's a new iteration of Bluetooth than can handle lossless audio codecs at full range, I would not consider owning a pair of Bluetooth cans.

kb9522

PTravel

That's basically what I do when I travel, though I use my Bose QC25s for their noise cancelling. I use a Fiio x5ii player with a Fiio e12 amplifier.

kb9522

PTravel

Thanks, I'll check it out.

nkedel

Interesting; that's not how Qualcomm markets it, but I haven't looked into the technical details so I'll need to take you word on that.

Yes, I'm well aware FLAC is lossless compression. My point was that one could do a raw data stream over Bluetooth (rather than A2DP, or aptX) and EDR would have plenty of bandwidth for FLAC or (CD-quality) LPCM; Bluetooth has no more trouble with reliable delivery than any other modern network protocol. It will still be inferior to wired, because of packet loss and latency leading to potential latency or jitter, and it will still be dependent on the quality of the DACs and amplifier in the headphones.

Not all Bluetooth headsets even support aptX at this point; Bose doesn't, and I'm not sure if Apple does. Most high-end BT headphones of the big, noise-cancelling variety have the option of plugging in an analog 3.5mm cable because BT is technically not for use on airplanes.

Because of the energy profiles involved and intended range, I doubt you're ever going to see lossless HD audio over 2.4ghz BT -- in practice, EDR tops out not much beyond 2Mbps in real conditions and as I understand it the "high bandwidth" Bluetooth extensions for 20+ Mbit transfers work by using Bluetooth to negotiate a private 802.11-something connection on a different radio. Plus the 2.4ghz band is nearly saturated many places.

As for CD-quality is good enough, I've got an undiscriminating ear and have most of my music collection on 64kbit WMAv2, and an awful lot of that downconverted from 128kbps MP3. All of which sounds fine to me. So while I've got sympathy for those who need/want better audio, this is very much another point of YMMV and better audio path support would not be a selling point for me.

kb9522

nkedel

kb9522

PTravel

"apt-X Lossless for HD audio

The new apt-X Lossless audio codec supports high-definition audio up to 96 kHz sampling rates and sample resolutions up to 24 bits. The codec optionally permits a “hybrid” coding scheme for applications where average and/or peak compressed data rates must be capped at a constrained level. This involves the dynamic application of a form of “near lossless” coding – but only for those short sections of audio where completely lossless coding cannot respect the bandwidth constraints. Even for those short periods while the “near lossless” coding is active, high-definition audio quality is maintained, retaining audio frequencies up to 20 kHz and a dynamic range of at least 120 dB. "

https://web.archive.org/web/20120508...-lossless.html

And that's really the whole point. It might not be a selling point for you, but the lack of a wired headphone jack on a device intended for music is a complete disqualifier for me. Apple has made the choice based on "what's good enough for must people." That's been the touchstone for all of their products. Android (and, particularly, the top-of-the-line Samsungs) offers that option, and also Bluetooth. As I've learned from kb9522, I can bypass the relatively unimpressive DACs that are built into all cellphones and feed an external DAC directly. That's a big plus for me, if I'm going to use my phone as a music player at home or at the office (because I use Bose almost exclusively on aircraft, audiophile quality is less of an issue, as Bose are not audiophile). In fact, after reading kb9522's post about this, I did some research and found that Fiio (a favorite company because they offer high-quality HD audio gear at very reasonable prices) offers a DAC/heaphone amp for only $99 that works well with the USB-output music players.

One thing I've only mentioned in passing is the Note 8's ability to function as credible, multi-tasking, windowing computer. All it needs to do this is a small and inexpensive dock, which contains an HDMI port, an ethernet port and 2 USB ports. I use it with a Bluetooth mouse and a small, folding Bluetooth keyboard. When I'm not sure of the availability of a monitor, I have a thin and light 15" Displaylink monitor which works great with it. The OS is compatible with Word 365 (which I don't use), but also with a number of the Android Word work-a-likes. I can VPN into my home network, either over the ethernet connection or via the phone's data capability. I can also VNC the same way and get full access to my home computers. Focusrite has an Android driver that lets me use my studio-quality Scarlett recording interfaces with this setup, and there's a great, very inexpensive Android app called Audio Evolution that provides a full-featured multi-track DAW.

This feature hasn't gotten a lot of coverage for some reason. Samsung isn't the first manufacturer to try this - Motorola had a considerably-less capable version a number of years of ago. However, it is the first manufacturer to have really gotten it right. The idea that the device which I carry with me in my pocket everywhere can also function as a decent multi-tasking computer with a couple of small and inexpensive accessories is, to me, huge if not revolutionary.

And that's really my whole point. A top-of-the-line phone isn't needed by everyone, and that's why all phone manufacturers (except Apple) offer different tiers. For those of us who do need one or more top-of-the-line features, they're available in Android, and those of us who buy them are not "suckers" for doing so.

synthkeys

While I haven't dabbled in the ultra-cheaps, $100 android phone, I am currently sporting a mid-range phone, Samsung C9 Pro in China/HK, which cost me 2800RMB ($425). I could have paid less in HK. I swapped out in May from another mid-ranger, Samsung A9 Pro, that I lost in a taxi.

C9 is pretty stacked for a mid-range -- 6BG memory, 64GB storage, SD card slot, AMOLED screen, Snapdragon 653, Dual SIM, 6" 1080p screen, wired headphone in. Finally just got the OS upgrade to Nougat.

Build quality is very nice, reminds me of the IPhone 6S+ I had for a while.

Of course there are weaknesses, the camera for one is not as good as the high end phone. Also no wireless charging. I've not tried this phone with anything but a China/HK SIM card, so I can't vouch for its global reach.

Chinese market has a lot of mid-rangers from Huawei, Oppo, Honor, Xiaomi, etc.

I just can't justify ~$1000 spend on a device that I use to communicate, read some news and listen to some music. I like a big screen, but I don't need the pixel density of a 2K or 4K device.

cubbie

I have an old-model Samsung Galaxy phone, and although I've thought about upgrading it, I'm really turned off by the fact that Samsung has gone the Apple way of using nonremovable batteries. Talk about planned obscelence. When it does come time for me to switch to a newer phone, I guess, and I'm sorry to say, it won't be a Samsung.

Dodge DeBoulet

Good luck finding an alternative that has a replaceable battery. Even LG, one of the last holdouts, has gone the non-user-replaceable route.

I used to feel the same way, and carried an extra battery back in my Blackberry and earlier Android days. Battery life, power management and physical supplementation options have grown significantly since then, though. I no longer worry about being stranded with a dead phone.

LAXlocal

I have been using an old Nexus 6 since I cracked the screen on my Nexus 5 ,

Google updated it to android 7 which has many things I hate , but many cheaper phones were never updated by the makers or carriers and are stuck at Android 5 ,

I am sure updating is a good thing for security , but then they push a lot more "features" that you may not like and no easy way to say "No Thanks"

But $1000 for my lifestyle of using it at outdoor work does not make it a smart deal for me ....

nkedel

There's a great deal of variance in how "non-replaceable" non-replaceable batteries are. iFixit is useful for evaluating models.