wr_schwab

Let me ask this as a hypothetical, and I’m only using this example because I have seen you post a lot in the Travel and Security forum.

If they decided to unilaterally and arbitrarily stop counting posts in the Travel and Security forum would you be ok with it?

If they decided to unilaterally and arbitrarily made some other fundamental change to the Travel and Security forum, such as requiring 180 days and 180 posts to view it because people have been complaining about all of the TSA bashing threads would you be ok with it?

I doubt it.

This proposal is not about the OMNI post count. I don’t really care if the OMNI posts count or not. That is not why I have been arguing the entire time on this issue.

Yes, it directly affects that forum, and one of the possibilities of that could result from this motion passing is the restoration of the post count, but that is only because it had the misfortune of being caught in the cross fire of a much larger issue.

The issue is how as a community resolves problems and whether or not making unilateral decisions without gaining any input from either the elected representatives of the community or the community at large a good precedent.

If unilateral decision-making by Randy and the “powers that be” is that good for FlyerTalk, why do we even have a Talkboard? Why have elected representatives representing the community?

I’m guessing because, at least at one time, Randy and the “powers that be” thought it would be good for FlyerTalk’s membership to have a voice, to have input on things that matter to the community.

Now is the time for our elected representatives to stand up and say, “We have a voice. We want to be heard on issues that directly affect our membership. We do not approve of unilateral decision-making that directly affects our membership experience.”

wharvey

Now... I truly do not understand... you feel you need a MOTION in order to have a dialogue with Randy? Why not just PM him and ask for a conversation with the Talkboard? Or to a private chat session with the Talkboard?

Why a formal motion just to have a "conversation"?

I had assumed this motion wanted him to change his mind... but the motion does not say that. Heck "reconsideration" could be interpreted as meaning "You should go back to 2004 and take back all posts not just going forward".

itsaboutthejourney

I'll stop beating around the bush and ask why Randy didn't simply stop the one user (who's handle ends in k) who's actions seem to be what got a vocal minority asking about OMNI & post counts.

As jenbel said so well in another thread, many features that benefit everyone have been taken away because of the misuse of only a few. FT should be adding features, that make the customers happy. It puzzles me that controls (ie: technical limits on consecutive posting) or discipline for the abuser(s) wasn't implemented before the recent pulling of post counts.

Randy is human after all and is allowed to make mistakes. Of course, we still love him and appreciate everything he's done for us. But one hopes those advising Randy can or have raised the above questions in context of both "customer experience" and the motion on TB's table.

kokonutz

From my perspective onlyBecause no single person speaks for the entire TB which is made up of 9 individuals with 9 different opinions and priorities. The only time the TB officially 'speaks' is through a motion garnering a super-majority.

The motion is pretty clear about what option the TB would like Randy to go to. But it does not preclude other ideas like a games subforum or any other outside-the-box idea:

"that the Talkboard recommend that Randy reconsider his decision to implement the policy of not counting posts in OMNI toward post totals and instead count OMNI posts in a poster's post count."

Spiff

Yeah, I actually would be ok with it. It wouldn't be the end of the world.

That's really a horse of another color. I don't think restricting access to such forums makes sense as it does for Omni and CC, but even if TS&S were to disappear tomorrow, I'd get over it and not get upset about it. Maybe I'm just pretty easy-going or maybe I'm all about the IJAIBB (albeit the best) philosophy...

This isn't about absolutes. Sometimes there are going to be decisions made that are made without consulting the membership. It's private property, not a true democracy.

As a volunteer adviser to IB/Randy Petersen, it would take something that I perceive to be a colossal blunder or that the other FlyerTalkers could convince me of being a colossal blunder before I'd presume to tell IB/Randy Petersen something to the effect: "How dare you do something without consulting all FlyerTalkers!?" Sorry, I 1)Don't see this as such a blunder and 2)am just not that presumptive that IB/Randy Petersen must consult the community on all matters. Other TalkBoard members may feel differently.

Punki

The issue, wharvey, is not just having a conversation about post counts. It is about establishing sound policies that will guide us all in the future.

Perhaps wr_schwab best expressed my concern in this post:

magiciansampras

No need to get dramatic.

Randy took a unilateral action. What this proposal does is ask that he reconsider. That's it. Nothing more, nothing less. It does not presume that his action is unsound, it presumes that unilateral action is unsound. @:-)

magiciansampras

No one is saying this is the end of the world. What it has done is fragmented those who use and enjoy OMNI from the rest of FT. It has said to us: "Your posts don't matter."

Spiff

And, as I posted earlier, sometimes IB/Randy Petersen is going to sometimes make decisions without consulting the community. It's a fairly common process with a private, for-profit business. @:-)

Spiff

No, it actually says "your Omni posts will no longer continue to cause the number underneath your handle to increment by one when you click the button near the bottom of the screen."

Let me show you some example assembly code:

Before:

Inc eAX ;accumulator holds post count
Call Post ;calls the posting function

After:

Nop ;burn 3 clock cycles
Call Post ;calls the posting function

Omni posts still matter.

magiciansampras

OK, first of all, I have no idea what any of that means.

Second, I think you're wrong. A post count is a measure of posts. Those that aren't counted don't count. Seems pretty straightforward to me.

magiciansampras

And sometimes, as I posted earlier, customers are going to complain. This is also a fairly common process with a private, for-profit business. @:-)

Spiff

It's pretty straight-forward Intel 32-bit assembly language.

The posts still matter. The post count is just that: a counter. It says nothing about the quality of posts, nor do posts disappear if the counter is not incremented when the button near the bottom the screen is pressed.

I missed the part in the FAQs that states The post count is the metric that determines whether your posts matter. It is irrelevant if your post is a well-thought dissertation on the AA Challenges or if it's the 2000th time you've posted Dear Leader is a Boob. Only posts that cause the post count to increment are the posts that matter.

Spiff

Indeed. But not all complaints are with merit. @:-)

(this is a business observation only, not a reflection on the complaint(s) posted in this thread)

magiciansampras

Well, as you say, other TB members may feel differently.