Good Job Burkey!

mmmm... that sounds a bit like "I am right and you guys are wrong. End of discussion. Period."

mmm... could it be that you not understanding (as you state) why that argument continues means that ... perhaps you could be wrong. I mean... perhaps? maybe?

The way I read you is as basically saying "take it or leave it, but this is my final decission". Ok. Fine. Now I know. Whatever you say, Lord of The Locked Threads. Given that you have the power and clearly you will use in the way you want, no matter what the community says, may I suggest that you save yourself time and do not even tell us what you think, but just simply act and lock the threads. If you ignore us long enough, do not reply to these posts and keep locking at will, people will get tired and will not post anymore discussing this topic. Well,... just a friendly suggestion.

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The trouble with resisting temptation is..... that you may not get another chance.

I thought Hitler died long time ago! I never asked whether there would be moderators, but"DO WE NEED MODERATORS" The tone of this posting is so dictatorial and offensive, IMHO your postings are those which need moderation.

If Flyertalk miles is only for miles and miles only, either you do not read all the postings or do not apply the same yardstick to all the posting.

[This message has been edited by drbala (edited 08-12-2001).]

Maybe Randy should consider a review process of some sort after the moderators have been on the job for some period of time.... or maybe they should stand for "reelection". Some will no doubt do a terrific job but my guess is that a few will become dizzy with their newfound power and become major pains in the butt.

I guess I don't know any better then to stay out of this thread so here is my $0.02;

As I recall, we always had moderators, only before July all they could do was post something like this thread belongs in the AA or UA forum. Now there is a title, and a small bit of power with the ability to lock threads.

The only real need for moderators was when the thread managed to get nasty, but a lot of those seemed to get worked out by themselves. People would post a reply stating that the first post was not meant to harm or inflame anyone. Few of us here are children and so only very infrequently do we need to be reprimanded or diciplined.

IMO I see the role of a moderator similar to that of a police offer directing traffic in a intersection with operating traffic lights, they're in control but its a bit confusing.

Clearly I'm a better frequent flyer than I am a housewife. At home, all my laundry end up in a pile until I have time to sort them out.

Seriously though, isn't the current problem where people are posting everything to the MilesBuzz forum an evidence of the forum's popularity? All other forums where some of these posts should belong don't have enough posters and therefore not enough responses.

Does moving a topic to its "correct" forum bring along the traffic that it needs to that forum? It seems that people are posting to MilesBuzz because this is where people get responses. Simply a supply and demand situation.

When I see some locked topics, I go read the posts, but I don't go to the new forum to find follow-up messages. Am I one of the norm?

My suggestion is to leave the "offending" post for a week or when it gets over 20 responses, then move it to where it belongs.

Moderator1, thanks for taking on an un-thankful job. You are helping to set the standards for other moderators, so please understand that the posts regarding the moderators are meant to be helpful. If we didn't care, we wouldn't have bothered to post. After all, if we don't like FlyerTalk, we could move somewhere else.

Hitler?
Don't you think that's a bit much, drbala?

I'm all for open and honest discussions of issues that affect FTers on this board (e.g. moderators).

However, IMHO, any useful and positive discussions of these issues should include a minimum amount of respect toward all participants, including the moderators.

Anagnorisis ("Lord of The Locked Threads) and drbala ("Hitler"):

Are these type of references advancing your arguments? I appreciate your opinions, but when they are expressed with provocation such as this, they are diminished.

Dudemon: I like your post. If I recall correctly, you were recently the subject of unprovoked nastiness. This incident settled itself fairly quickly with an apology, without moderators.

I come to FT for information and entertainment. Initially I lurked when I was only seeking mileage opportunites and travel tips. I joined when I found myself enjoying the spirit, humor, and camaraderie of the board.
I look forward to the light-hearted discussions about general travel topics here. Should this take place on the Buzz? I think so, but it ain't my board. I do know I don't follow a thread that is moved. And I think it is ridiculous to lock an interesting thread.
The greatest asset of this board is the intelligent and witty group of travelers that comprises it. Encourage them, don't censor them.

Chase - At first that was the case, but looking at just yesterday, there were more active topics in FT Travel Buzz then there were in FT Miles Buzz (14 vs. 11)

So it does seem the other FT boards are getting traffic now... granted it was slow in the begining with the introduction of the new FT.



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burkey
FlyerTalk Miles Moderator
The Buzz
American Airlines
[email protected]

"At the end of the day, the bottom line, take home message is that FlyerTalk Miles is for the discussion of Miles & Points, not whiskey, not kids in first class, not tipping the FA's, and not if overweight people should buy 10 seats or not. All that is for FlyerTalk Travel, peroid."

Burkey,

Wow. That is strong and harsh, when the overwhelming response of people here is that closing and moving threads -- what I call over-categorization and the zealous enforcement thereof -- isn't working.

As I mentioned previously, there are two, not very complicated, fixes:

1. Re-categorization...this is probably a periodic, ever-green process; and

2. Non-enforcement of "misplaced" posts -- allowing the "marketplace" so to speak to determine the fate of a given thread.

At this point, ignoring the issue, and even worse, refusing to allow discussion of the issue, isn't an acceptable response for many of us...it only alienates and frustrates people who are trying to contribute to the FT community.

In order for a given board to be valuable, it needs volume/activity...MilesBuzz provides a good catch-all for travel and miles oriented topics that don't fit into specific airline/supplier categories, or otherwise aren't trip reports, coupon exchanges, or totally non-traveler related issues which seem to go in Omni (not really sure what those are...but maybe advice on getting a good mortgage, although I am not sure we really care if a post found it's way into the Buzz when it seemingly belonged in Omni).

The point is that the new categorization doesn't work; enforcing it only makes matters worse; and silencing the debate just fuels the flames.

I would think you would welcome and appreciate the suggestions and take the matters/suggestions up with a higher authority?



[This message has been edited by nologic (edited 08-12-2001).]

nologic - Of course we are open to feedback, we want it, however the structure of FlyerTalk is divided into four UBBs, each with its own specific content area. Right now the moderators hands are tied, as we cannot move threads between boards. At first we only moved threads out of MilesBuzz to other forums in FlyerTalk Miles, and left the Travel ones in place. This was a transparent process over the last week or two to most users, except those whom threads we moved.... it wasn't fair to move/close some and not others, simply because we didn't have the ability to do it.

So when the few threads were closed, an email was sent stating that the topic is more appropriate to FT Travel, and the orgional was locked. In the future we, the moderators will repost it in FT Travel by hand since we can't do it automatically.

This will make an already over time budget volunteer job for us even more time consuming, but until we get a quicker fix, we're without other option.

That's where you all play the biggest part, and that is to follow the format of FlyerTalk, and make your posts in the appropriate board and forum.



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burkey
FlyerTalk Miles Moderator
The Buzz
American Airlines
[email protected]
------------------------
Please remember the format of FlyerTalk.com when making posts:
FlyerTalk Miles
Stick with FlyerTalk Miles for all your miles and points information.
FlyerTalk Travel
FlyerTalk Travel is the place to bring up all of your general travel questions and comments.
FlyerTalk Dining
Check out FlyerTalk Dining to learn where the food's good, where it's bad, and how to get there.
FlyerTalk Airports
Visit FlyerTalk Airports to discuss everything from parking, to the best airport restaurants and shops.

I don't think that those opposing the present moderation policy should conclude that my (and others) absence of the debate means that we don't agree with the moderators.

My guess is that (as a majority) the contrary is true - those not involved in the discussion here so far might in fact not dissagree about the current moderation policy.

I (in principle,not in every detail) agree and hope that, better sooner then later, posts will be posted to the (more) appropiate places. And at this early stage of the the new FlyerTalk concept and the new moderation policy, I can't see this happening fast without 'a strong' moderator hand. This will help also to refind them (using the search function) later on.

I am glad that some volunteers do that moderaion work, and myself I will never volunteer for such a (needed) job.

Moderator 1 wrote "At the end of the day, the bottom line, take home message is that FlyerTalk Miles is for the discussion of Miles & Points, not whiskey, not kids in first class, not tipping the FA's, and not if overweight people should buy 10 seats or not. All that is for FlyerTalk Travel, period. "

Thank you very much. I don't have that much time on my hands so a quick visit to the buzz and the AA forum is usually all I have time for. I check those forums for mileage and AA related issues respectively. Having to wade through allot of none mileage related issues in the Buzz reduces the forums utility for me and obviously I am not alone. When I have more time or I want to research a topic that is not mileage related I will often visit other forums like Travel and trip reports (thank you to all who post their trip reports, good source of ideas and travel inspiration and just plain fun to read many of them).

Bottom line is that FT will have more utility for us all if we stick to topics that are related to the forum description (if I wanted to know about tipping FA's would I really think of searching the Buzz first?)As some have difficulty figuring out which forum is the most appropriate one (he wrote while perpetuating an off topic thread http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/redface.gif ) I think a moderator who will help the forum stay on topic is a great asset to us all.

Sure we could have FT without moderators but we have had that and while it was good(Ok great http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif ) FT with moderators is a better site because it is more organized and thus a more useful site to visit. So let me just add my vote of thanks and my support to the volunteer moderators who do indeed have a difficult and often thankless job.

FWIW moving a topic to another more appropriate forum is not censorship IMO (even if it is moved off FT entirely as there are plenty of places on the internet where someone can freely publish their non travel related thoughts)

Now, how about moving this topic out of the Buzz http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif

[This message has been edited by Mvic (edited 08-12-2001).]

Rudi,

I appreciate your perspective. Maybe I was too quick to interpret the responses.

I clearly don't agree that more separate boards are better, that they save time, improve the quality of the experience/responses, etc., but I would not want to impose my will unilaterally on others, if it wasn't in the majority...so more feedback is needed/appreciated here to better measure the pulse of the "majority".

I also would support a moderator/FT position that said: "we hear you and understand your concerns...let's see if we can't get more traction on the Travel boards, and then re-gauge the situation in a few (days, weeks)”, followed by real time traffic monitoring and reporting.

IMHO, if the Travel boards don't get a comparable amount of traffic, they will never be as good; and I can't see how they will EVER be as popular/active as the Miles boards, and therefore, as good.



[This message has been edited by nologic (edited 08-12-2001).]