markwtaylor

As if. Signs or announcements don't stop gate lice from clogging the elite carpet or blocking pre-boards. Nor does it prevent people from planting their butts in the seats in LAS labelled "Only for customers using slots". Too many people have the self-appointed right to do what they darn well please.

num1bearsfan

If we're talking about domestic flights, I don't think the meal is any major loss. I also think IFE systems sort of became irrelevant when people started bringing their laptops on flights. Now almost any serious traveler would not be caught dead without their laptop (the ultimate IFE) on the plane with them. Especially now that onboard WIFI is a reality.

I will give you the first class thing though. I'm a big guy and I would definitely enjoy a larger seat. I would welcome some larger premium seating on Southwest flights. Even if they sort of mirrored Spirit with the "big front seats" by just having a few premium seats up front, that would be cool. But for some reason or another Southwest bean counters have decided that it's not cost effective and I trust their judgment.

num1bearsfan

Wow,.. So apparently I'm not all by myself in this boat. There's even a name for it,.. "gate lice".. I guess this is exactly what I'm talking about..

Daze

After you put up the sign, erect a rope around the area, and assign a WN employee at the entrance to check boarding passes, and presto, the LUV CLUB! Another item that there's no fee for.

sammy0623

last time i visited the luv club, i was seated next to ron mexico

SWABrian

I take it that "ron mexico" doesn't mean Remain Over Night in the Western Hemisphere's largest city?

FCfree

I think it really depends on your flying patterns and most common routes.

There is a lot of talk about complimentary upgrades. Not at United. They give four 500-mile upgrades per 10,000 miles flown after you reach 2P status. They do give you free upgrades with status to E+. Its somewhat of an upgrade, but I really want more width than more pitch. When I was with United, I found that I was going through those upgrades pretty fast and that I would only get to use them when the plane wasn't very full. Then United "fixed" that problem by going TED on my routes. I wasn't going through the upgrades at all -- as a matter of fact they were expiring and going back into my account as 500-2000 miles. Now, TED is going away, so maybe they will put first class back on those planes.

Back when I did get some first class upgrades on United, sometimes it was free drinks only and no food service.

Frontier, yes, they do have DirecTV which is free for elites and $5 for everybody else. That wouldn't be a bad deal if it didn't come with the bag fees and change fees.

Now, if your travels do take you on NW or CO routes, the free, unlimited first class upgrades make more sense. As a SILVER in 1999-2001, I had excellent upgrade success. I hear that there are not as many upgrades for Silvers as there used to be, but that GOLDS still do pretty good. However, NW has downgraded some routes from DC-9 and A-320 aircraft to CRJ aircraft that does not have first class. If your choice is a CRJ vs. a WN 737, I'd rather have the WN 737.

It really comes down to this:

1) Where is your home airport and who serves that airport?
2) Where are you going?
a. Is it frequently between your home airport and one city, or
b. frequently between your home airport and many different cities, or
c. frequently a very complex pattern of home to city to city, etc. to home, or
d. Some other pattern?

After you know that, it almost comes down to just 1-3 airlines.

Now for me (and YMMV), when you put WN heads up against UA/TED and F9, WN is the winner, primarily because of the no change fee feature. I'll take my A-list seat and open seat selection over assigned seating, because open seat selection *for me* means a better chance at the exit row seats and/or open middle. As a mere 2P at United, there is no chance at exit row and my chances of open middle were only slightly better than having GM status. If United would have more frequently given me an open middle, I might have believed more in assigned seating, but as a *mere* 2P, that didn't happen much.

However, if I went to a different city every week and some of those cities weren't Southwest cities but all were United cities, then, duh, United becomes a more clear choice (at least for the non-Southwest cities). I'd sit down and figure out if I flew exclusively on United what my status and perks would be, vs. if I spread my business between the 2 airlines vs. if I spread my business between multiple airlines.

There is no single right answer for everyone. But, I do think to make the most informed decision, you have to have the right info. Part of that right info is knowing the junk fees or lack thereof, the current boarding process (at WN that is the post Nov 2007 system, not the old system), how the upgrade processes work at the legacy carriers and what the real frequency of upgrade is for your status level. There is no doubt that anyone would rather fly any carrier's first class than WN's coach. The question is, what hassles do you have to put up with at the other carriers, as well as what other benefits do you get with other carriers, vs. sticking with Southwest?

There also is a barrier to entry when you switch carriers, as you have to earn your way back to status unless the new carrier will comp you based on your old status. Toward this end, United and Frontier would be smart to comp 2P / Ascent status for A-list status. But, that isn't going to happen.

jrpaguia

^ Excellent post!

BTW, 90% of my trips are SJC-ONT-SJC.

sammy0623

heh not quite: ron mexico

alanh

If you're flying enough to earn high-level elite status (generally 50K or better) on a legacy carrier, or if you're flying internationally a lot, you're better off with a legacy.

However, if you're buying coach fares and don't have a good change of scoring an upgrade to F (silver or no status), I don't see how the legacies are better than WN. If you're not reserving far in advance, WN's model works to your favor -- reserved seats don't help if all you have left to choose from is middle seats.

trekwars2000

I agree with some of what you say but other parts I just really disagree with...

Agreeded.

I disagree. First E+ is a huge benifit - extra 5-6 inches of legroom is no laughing matter. In addition, E+ is the last section to fillup and if there are going to be open seats they have a great shot of being in E+... Being nice with the GA before they will the seats can often get you the empty seat next to you... Even living in LAS as a UA 1K I use my SWUs, CR1s and almost never need to use my e500s unless I am with my wife (normally a DEN->east connection).

With the disbanding on TED wouldn't you rather be in F LAS-DEN even if it is just the bigger seat and 3-4 free drinks? I know on a Friday afternoon when I am flying back home from a business trip thoes drinks are looked forward to

As a prior NWA SE and PE I can say the SE upgrades out of Vegas are very very good (probably 80%) and my PE upgrades were like 97%. The CRJs NW is running now also has First class.
Agreeded. My question to you is when UA becomes Mainline in and out of Vegas are you going to look at them again. With no fees for elites all the extra fees become moot.

I just don't see how you didn't have many open seats as a 2P in E+... Where were you sitting in the cabin? I often perfer (if not Exit Row) Rows 7 or 8. They have full recline and if the GA fills up E+ from the front of the plane, as often happens, they are some of the last seats to get filled.

Have you asked United if they comp to A list status? I got comped 1P from my NWA PE status.

Something you did miss in your good assestment was the main reason NWA/CO/US do free unlimited upgrades vs UA/AA's "coupon" upgrade system is that they do not provide international upgrades whereas UA and AA do. That is my biggest benifit of flying UA... I take 2-4 international business trips a year and it is key for me to be able to upgrade the TransPac flights, that is worth it to me more than anything else.

bbison

Saw one this morning at LAX, plopped in the cushy leather chairs by Gate 7. He had a US Airways ticket in his briefcase; from where he was sitting you couldn't even see a US gate.

The only thing that struck me funny was his seat assignment--1F. If he's in F, couldn't he have just gone to the club by Gate 1?

TheRoadie

Typically International F gets you a club pass for the day of flight. Domestically you have to buy a separate membership, and being upgraded or paid F doesn't get you any love.

SDCA

Quote:
Originally Posted by bbison View Post
...He had a US Airways ticket... in F, couldn't he have just gone to the club by Gate 1?

Does USAirways ever give you love at all when flying them in F or Y class?

GoSpurs

Love? - no. Fees and grief, yes!