Official Rapid Rewards 2.0 speculation thread
Jul 4, 2008, 7:31 pm
#31
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: ORD, MDW or MKE
Programs: American and Southwest. Hilton and Marriott hotels primarily.
Posts: 6,463
Where I fly from (Chicago) and the places I go to, by my estimation basing the points on dollars spent and not segments as given in the survey examples will reduce the return (in free flights) seriously; to the point where at my level of flying I will rarely if ever earn an Award. Thus I will be driven solely by price and in Chicago SWA doesn't always win on that alone. Additionally I've patterned my hotel stays to maximize the potential of transferring points to SWA, factoring that in to justify occasional higher prices. If RR is diminished as I expect, my use of hotel loyalty programs will shift to maximization of hotel reward value or simply lowest cost with no regard to any airline.
Jul 4, 2008, 8:46 pm
#32
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: PVD
Programs: Rapid Rewards, WorldPerks
Posts: 465
Where I fly from (Chicago) and the places I go to, by my estimation basing the points on dollars spent and not segments as given in the survey examples will reduce the return (in free flights) seriously; to the point where at my level of flying I will rarely if ever earn an Award. Thus I will be driven solely by price and in Chicago SWA doesn't always win on that alone. Additionally I've patterned my hotel stays to maximize the potential of transferring points to SWA, factoring that in to justify occasional higher prices. If RR is diminished as I expect, my use of hotel loyalty programs will shift to maximization of hotel reward value or simply lowest cost with no regard to any airline.
Jul 6, 2008, 12:05 am
#33
Moderator, Southwest Airlines and Choice Privileges
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Central Texas
Posts: 3,039
Is it likely that RR 2.0 will occur at the same time as the first international alliance? I was suddenly hit with the realization that this proportionality of points to ticket dollar value could effectively nullify whatever advantage WN may gain by announcing any international alliances (at least for the leisure traveler). Doesn't the much greater "bang for the buck" have a lot to do with why the international opportunities are so important for the legacy FF programs?
Jul 6, 2008, 12:11 am
#34
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: LAS
Programs: SWA
Posts: 1,320
Rapid Rewards Changes - Some rumors heard
Just finished an interesting conversation in the hot tub with a WestJet Marketing person who has been working with SWA on the new RR program, as well as a few other items.
First, the point system appears to be the way it's going to go. Almost like a cash back system, points/dollars earned, exchanged for credit towards a flight. It was mentioned that the SWA credit card would be a great value, as earning potential there would be very positive. Short hop flights, not so much.
It was also commented that there is interest in emulating WestJet's food purchase program, that SWA might be adapting WestJet's software package to allow for purchases in payment other than cash.
Another interesting tidbit, no partnership seen on the horizon with WestJet.
First, the point system appears to be the way it's going to go. Almost like a cash back system, points/dollars earned, exchanged for credit towards a flight. It was mentioned that the SWA credit card would be a great value, as earning potential there would be very positive. Short hop flights, not so much.
It was also commented that there is interest in emulating WestJet's food purchase program, that SWA might be adapting WestJet's software package to allow for purchases in payment other than cash.
Another interesting tidbit, no partnership seen on the horizon with WestJet.
Jul 6, 2008, 6:54 am
#36
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: ORD, MDW or MKE
Programs: American and Southwest. Hilton and Marriott hotels primarily.
Posts: 6,463
Chicago Tribune had an article today on SWA. The article stated that there would be a Canadian partner ( and that it would likely be Westjet ) and that Canadian partner would fly a bunch of flights into Midway where the transfer of passengers between the 2 airlines would occur.
Jul 6, 2008, 10:30 am
#38
Moderator: Southwest Airlines, Capital One
Original Poster
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: California
Programs: WN Companion Pass, A-list preferred, Hyatt Globalist; United Club Lietime (sic) Member
Posts: 21,648
Jul 6, 2008, 10:16 pm
#40
Moderator, Southwest Airlines and Choice Privileges
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Central Texas
Posts: 3,039
What sort of expansion capacity does WN have at MDW to handle a codeshare there with an airline of the Canuck persuasion? Can WN add enough that they'd actually end up cutting prices on domestic flights to/from MDW?
I imagine there are other markets with even higher average cost per mile, but my impression for several years has been that MDW has gotten awfully expensive. From my home base it is so bad that I could almost envision booking WN codeshare flights to Canada to utilize the hidden city technique if I needed to get to MDW.
Granted the MDW prices may not be as offensive as prices to and from some legacy-dominated hubs, but it is not a pretty sight.
(Something to keep in mind when cheering the continued trouncing of the legacies by WN, IMO. MDW's history could be the future of your favorite airport.)
I imagine there are other markets with even higher average cost per mile, but my impression for several years has been that MDW has gotten awfully expensive. From my home base it is so bad that I could almost envision booking WN codeshare flights to Canada to utilize the hidden city technique if I needed to get to MDW.
Granted the MDW prices may not be as offensive as prices to and from some legacy-dominated hubs, but it is not a pretty sight.(Something to keep in mind when cheering the continued trouncing of the legacies by WN, IMO. MDW's history could be the future of your favorite airport.)
Jul 7, 2008, 1:35 am
#41
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: BNA
Posts: 234
I can see indirect capacity additions at MDW through the addition of nonstops between other markets, reducing the domestic connecting traffic through MDW to make room for our friends from the North.
Jul 7, 2008, 2:01 am
#42
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: BNA
Posts: 234
Chicago Tribune had an article today on SWA. The article stated that there would be a Canadian partner ( and that it would likely be Westjet ) and that Canadian partner would fly a bunch of flights into Midway where the transfer of passengers between the 2 airlines would occur.
http://www.chicagotribune.com/busine...6.story?page=1
Jul 7, 2008, 9:36 am
#43
Original Member and FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 1998
Location: Kansas City, MO, USA
Programs: DL PM/MM, AA ExPlat, Hyatt Glob, HH Dia, National ECE, Hertz PC
Posts: 16,579
Just finished an interesting conversation in the hot tub with a WestJet Marketing person who has been working with SWA on the new RR program, as well as a few other items.
First, the point system appears to be the way it's going to go. Almost like a cash back system, points/dollars earned, exchanged for credit towards a flight. It was mentioned that the SWA credit card would be a great value, as earning potential there would be very positive. Short hop flights, not so much.
It was also commented that there is interest in emulating WestJet's food purchase program, that SWA might be adapting WestJet's software package to allow for purchases in payment other than cash.
Another interesting tidbit, no partnership seen on the horizon with WestJet.
First, the point system appears to be the way it's going to go. Almost like a cash back system, points/dollars earned, exchanged for credit towards a flight. It was mentioned that the SWA credit card would be a great value, as earning potential there would be very positive. Short hop flights, not so much.
It was also commented that there is interest in emulating WestJet's food purchase program, that SWA might be adapting WestJet's software package to allow for purchases in payment other than cash.
Another interesting tidbit, no partnership seen on the horizon with WestJet.
Jul 7, 2008, 9:36 am
#44
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: DCA / WAS
Programs: DL 2+ million/PM, YX, Marriott Plt, *wood gold, HHonors, CO Plt, UA, AA EXP, WN, AGR
Posts: 9,388
My reaction:
They're making it as complex as a Legacy program.
Not likely to affect my flying - but may make WN less attractive compared to a legacy as they break-down the A-list. A-list and fees are the important features to me, but there is no way - with my current travel patterns - that I'll ever make the high status levels on WN. I've got too much international (Eur/Pac) travel.
They're making it as complex as a Legacy program.
Not likely to affect my flying - but may make WN less attractive compared to a legacy as they break-down the A-list. A-list and fees are the important features to me, but there is no way - with my current travel patterns - that I'll ever make the high status levels on WN. I've got too much international (Eur/Pac) travel.
Jul 7, 2008, 9:55 am
#45
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Pittsburgh
Programs: Whoever Has the Best Bonus
Posts: 5,183
It seems Southwest is adopting a hotel model (pay more, get more points) for frequent flying. When frequent flier programs were first invented people paid more to go further, so giving rewards based on distance was fine, but we all know that has changed, not the least because of competition from airlines like Southwest.
While this change may affect me negatively I'm not against it -- except that it seems they are way overcomplicating it. Make it like Marriott or Hilton, ten points per dollar spent, bonuses for elite levels, and maybe make redemption at a few levels corresponding to hotel categories (ie I can search for a category 1 flight and redeem at the lowest level -- ie a Fairfield Inn in Podunk, IA, or category 7 for a flight right before Thanksgiving, ie the Marriott in Paris). Like another poster, no change fees will keep me with Southwest for my personal travel. For business travel, however, the jury is still out.
While this change may affect me negatively I'm not against it -- except that it seems they are way overcomplicating it. Make it like Marriott or Hilton, ten points per dollar spent, bonuses for elite levels, and maybe make redemption at a few levels corresponding to hotel categories (ie I can search for a category 1 flight and redeem at the lowest level -- ie a Fairfield Inn in Podunk, IA, or category 7 for a flight right before Thanksgiving, ie the Marriott in Paris). Like another poster, no change fees will keep me with Southwest for my personal travel. For business travel, however, the jury is still out.