Cholula

Virgin may or may not go to all the places you can also fly on DL/KLM, etc. but one VERY important bennie of flying VS is their NS service to LHR. I can get on a VS flight at LAX and be in London many hours earlier than if I were to connect through ATL or JFK.
I’ve only had two flight experiences on VS and have been very pleased with both.

BER Flyer

If you compare the year end financial statements from those airlines for the last 5 years then yes, DL definitely towers any Skyteam airline in that very measurable aspect of the business.

By just looking on the figures i would say that DL's first Q 2005 losses are higher then all other Skyteam airlines losses for the year 2004 combined.
All that DL keeps alive right now is Skyteam.

MACH81

AF has been privatized recently, in 2003 and the government doesn't have more than 30% now,that's why it was possible to merge with KL.AZ hasn't privatized yet and it's in bad shape.AZ almost merged with KL in '99-'00,but then they failed to privatize and KL thought better to live them alone,paid a fine of €250 millions and got back €100 million from AZ that were for MXP development.The italian treasury still has 62% of AZ shares and until it goes well under 50% AZ is at risk.AF-KL will welcome(and probably eat them alive)AZ once privatized.
my 2 cents

Cholula

I don’t disagree with your points but why is everybody bringing up an airline‘s current financial status as a measure of their value to SkyTeam?
Granted that DL’s current finances are in the toilet right now. Next year this time somebody else in ST may be in the toilet. Finances are a fluid thing.
The way I think you need to judge an airlines importance to SkyTeam are as follows:

1. International and domestic route structure.
2. Number and type of aircraft.
3. Number of daily flights to wherever.
4. Ability to book award travel in class of service desired.
5. Onboard and ground services and amenities.
6.Operational issues like ontime arrivals and departures,baggage handling, safety, ease of transferring at hub airports, etc., etc.

The limited list above is more important, IMHO, than how much money a ST partner has in the bank on any given day.
Someone was bragging on Kenya’s sparkling new 777’s. That’s all well and good but if they only fly from one obscure airport in Africa to wherever once or twice a week, how much benefit are they to the overall ST alliance? And if they’re as stingy with award seats as non-ST partner, SQ, again what value do they bring?
I think one needs to look at the bigger, long-term picture here in evaluating the worth of the various ST partners and not at their current daily bank balance.

ewj

1.If you want to use those then of the major airlines DL is last in international departures and landings. While presence is strong in the US, it is very weak internationally compared to NWA, CO, KLM, AF, or KA.
2. Number and type of aircraft means really nothing. It is where you can land and how many birds you can put in the air at one time.
3. DL daily flights in the USA are great but being a US memebr of skyteam means flighst to Asia, Central Europe, Africa, the Pacific. Go to Poland, Italy, or Jo'berg and nobody ever heard about Delta - the five above yes, DL no.
4. Travel awards are nice on DL but the best I have had is KLM with NWA being the worst. I have never been able to get a international coach ticket and used miles to upgrade on DL and I have tried 5-6 times.
5/6 are USA domestic issue which DL does a very good job. BTW, teh two best hub airports for getting from one flight to the next is MSP ans AMS (no additional security, plenty of things to do and decent lounges) ATL is only slightly behind them. I can leave the airport, get to some nice places fast, and get back inside security is less than 7 minutes. Paris is by far the worst.

Tomco

Sooooo much pomposity on some of these quotes. Just to remind one or two folks on here that there is a world outside the United States and having excellent airlines like Copa and Kenya enter Skyteam is a bonus for travellers in different regions. Air Europa also offers good European-South American coverage and Tarom offers a link to S.E Europe.

jimrpa

I thought Delta boasted the most flights across the Atlantic of any US carrier. Is that not true anymore? I agree that Delta has forgotton about Asia beyond Tokyo and Mumbai, but I'd think Europe counts for SOMETHING?
What do you mean "the five above"?
I absolutely disagree! Onboard service is even MORE important to me when travelling internationally, as are ground service and amenities. AF has occasionally OUTSTANDING ground service at CDG (what other airlines meet you at the door of the plane, take you down the stairs to the ramp, where a car is waiting to whisk you to the terminal where your connecting flight is departing. All the while, an AF escort stays with you all the way, expediting passport control and security before turning you over to the gate agent? As fond as I am of Delta, and as much as I admire (bordering on worship in most cases) their front-line employees, I suspect it would be a VERY cold August day in Atlanta before Delta ever did that for pax connecting international to domestic!)
I've never seen MSP. I guess I'm the only person who's unimpressed with AMS. It was O.k. when I was there, but it didn't seem to be anything special (I must confess that, when I was last there, it looked like the airport was undergoing major construction and/or renovation). As for CDG, I find it great (once you learn the tricks to avoid using the busses and learn to walk), but then, remember, my hometown airport is PHL which IS, by far, the absolute worst airport in the world

hfly

This thread is now airliners.net material.

Carolinian

According to a recent issue of The Economist, AF/KLM had a PROFIT of nearly half a billion dollars in the year ending March 31, 2005. Actually making money is a big difference from the SkyTeam members on this side of the pond, especially DL. And AF made that profit while keeping amenities like meals and free alcohol in coach.

RobertS975

Announced the purchase of 18 B737-800s with options for an additional 12. Maybe they are expecting some increase in business from all this ST stuff.

CelticFlyer

WHAT?!!!!!! These third world, also ran, no good, unknown airlines are BUYING EQUIPMENT? OUTRAGEOUS!

RobertS975

And while we're at it, Alaska Air (virtually a ST member since one earns MQMs on their flights) also placed a sizeable order for 737-800s, 25 firm and options for another 25.

abrelosojos

= Guess you need to see the world more - BUT you can take it up to SKYTEAM - as they bill themselves as the alliance revolving around you

A.

Dick Ginkowski

I heard the four new SkyTeam airlines are ASA (Almost Southern Airlines), ACA, SkyWest and Com(munist)air.

Ceasy

I disagree. Good opportnity to practice your espanol. (They do have an English landguage website)