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Lufthansa bilked us out of $5K [volontary cancel]

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Old Jun 23, 2020 | 10:57 am
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Lufthansa bilked us out of $5K [volontary cancel]

Last October, we purchased two round class business class tickets from JFK to SVG via FRA on LH for vacation travel in June. Once COVID-19 hit, we knew those plans would not happen but we waited until LH officially canceled the flights. I knew the flights would probably not operate since they were no longer bookable. I checked online every few days for weeks. Finally, when I logged into my LH account in mid-May, I saw the option online to cancel my flight for a refund. Since I had not seen that option available before, I made the stupid mistake of clicking it. However, when I received the email a few minutes later and saw that it said that I will receive a refund "if my ticket allows."

I immediately called Lufthansa customer service and politely asked the agent for clarification. I told her that if my tickets were not going to be fully refunded then I did not want to cancel and asked if this action could be canceled and the booking reinstated. The agent was polite and said she would would check for me. She said that unfortunately, my ticket would only be eligible for a refund of taxes and fees. She then put me on hold and said she would see about reinstating the booking. After about 15 minutes of being on hold, I was abruptly disconnected without the agent returning. I suspect I was hung up on. I immediately called back and politely explained to the agent who answered what had happened and what the previous agent said she was doing. She said that it was impossible to reinstate a booking cancelled online and that I should not have cancelled my booking online. I explained that the previous agent claimed she was working on reinstating it. She said that it would be impossible for the other agent to do anything and she refused to do anything further. When I politely asked to speak to her supervisor, instead of being transferred, I was again disconnected. A third call gave me a agent who basically said the same thing as the 2nd agent. She said I would receive a refund of taxes of fees but she was unable to tell me how much of a refund I would receive.

Sadly, a few days after my interactions, our flights were "officially" canceled. I blame myself for not more carefully reading the fine print although Lufthansa was deceptive in their practices and their customer service was terrible. An expensive lesson learned. While I am tempted to file disputes with the airline and regulatory agencies, I'm not sure it is worth the bother and I suspect I would ultimately lose. Nonetheless, I decided to at least dispute the original transaction with American Express. Unfortunately, a week later I was given a merchant credit of only $135.98 x 2.

My question here is, does anyone know if this seems like what I should receive? Given that the Lufthansa agents on the phone could not tell me how much I was entitled to have refunded, I have no way of knowing if I am being further bilked by Lufthansa.

Our original two tickets showed the following breakdowns:

Ticket: $1165.00 x 2
Taxes and Carrier Imposed Fees: $1,377.59 x 2
Total Costs: $5085.18

Is it likely that we are only entitled to less than 10% of the "taxes and fees" originally charged???
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Old Jun 23, 2020 | 11:17 am
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Originally Posted by BDKurt
Last October, [...snipp...]
Sadly, a few days after my interactions, our flights were "officially" canceled. I blame myself for not more carefully reading the fine print although Lufthansa was deceptive in their practices and their customer service was terrible. An expensive lesson learned. While I am tempted to file disputes with the airline and regulatory agencies, I'm not sure it is worth the bother and I suspect I would ultimately lose. Nonetheless, I decided to at least dispute the original transaction with American Express. Unfortunately, a week later I was given a merchant credit of only $135.98 x 2.
No dice. As you said, you cancelled the flight on your own. They are fully in their right to process this according to the ticketing rules. Neither complaining to the regulator, nor disputing the charge with AMEX will get you back your money.

In such situations, NEVER cancel the reservation. ALWAYS have the airline cancel it and then follow up what to do.


Originally Posted by BDKurt
My question here is, does anyone know if this seems like what I should receive? Given that the Lufthansa agents on the phone could not tell me how much I was entitled to have refunded, I have no way of knowing if I am being further bilked by Lufthansa.

Ticket: $1165.00 x 2
Taxes and Carrier Imposed Fees: $1,377.59 x 2
Total Costs: $5085.18

Is it likely that we are only entitled to less than 10% of the "taxes and fees" originally charged???
Very much possible.

Last edited by fassy; Jun 23, 2020 at 11:24 am
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Old Jun 23, 2020 | 11:27 am
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I saw the option online to cancel my flight for a refund. Since I had not seen that option available before, I made the stupid mistake of clicking it.
Sorry! There is nothing you can do here.

Was there no dialogue on the website (a warning) about what will happen once you cancel a ticket?
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Old Jun 23, 2020 | 12:05 pm
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Sorry to hear about this one.
I did the same once myself, but that was only a 500$ trip.
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Old Jun 23, 2020 | 12:14 pm
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It is unlikely that the fees are refundable if the base ticket fare is non-refundable. This leaves the taxes and those might very well be what you got.

As others note, it is unfortunate, but if you cancelled before LH cancelled, then you are only due what the fare rules for your ticket provided. It sounds as though your fare rules were in a non-refundable fare bucket, although it seems worth your time to carefully review the fare rules to be certain that LH has it right.

In that situation, there is neither a valid complaint under EC 261/2004 nor US DOT rules nor is your card issuer likely to process a full refund unless LH makes a mistake and fails to respond to the card issuer (unlikely).

While unlikely, also consider exploring whether your travel insurance covers the ticket value as you are prohibited from travel (presuming that you do not meet one of the narrow exceptions). Unlikely, but worth the time to read the policy language carefully (again, don't rely on what phone agents tell you).

For the broader audience, never cancel until your flight has been cancelled or it is the day of travel. When the flight is cancelled, you are entitled to a refund. If the flight operates, then you take your lumps if you wish to travel.
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Old Jun 23, 2020 | 4:15 pm
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It may be too little, too late now, but did you have an option originally of taking a credit instead of pushing for a refund of what little taxes and fees there were? A $5000 voucher sounds much more worthwhile than a $270 refund....

Unfortunately, it seems that the tax refund has already been credited to your account. I don't believe you are "entitled" to anything else. It may be worth writing nicely to LH customer service to see if they might issue you a goodwill voucher to offset some of the 4.7k loss
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Old Jun 23, 2020 | 4:59 pm
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LH cancelled an F booking, they agree they owe me the $, I agree they owe me the $ yet I still have no $. This is a recurring theme with my cancelled LH bookings. I feel like I am at least owed a voucher for all these interest free loans.
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Old Jun 23, 2020 | 5:00 pm
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Originally Posted by Andaz
Hahahahaha, that is a good one!
Never said it was likely to work :P
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Old Jun 23, 2020 | 8:48 pm
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OP, Im really very sorry to hear youve become a victim here.

Like others say, I dont think theres anything you can do right now. Just remember how you were treated next time you are tempted to buy a flight with that airline.
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Old Jun 23, 2020 | 10:09 pm
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Originally Posted by smartytravel
OP, Im really very sorry to hear youve become a victim here.

Like others say, I dont think theres anything you can do right now. Just remember how you were treated next time you are tempted to buy a flight with that airline.
Sorry, the OP is not a victim. The OP decided himself to cancel his booking, having in mind that his tariff was non-refundable. He in addition cancelled without contacting the airline beforehand and investigating other options.
It is also not a question how he was treated. He was treated according to the rules everybody has to obey to and everybody expects the counterpart in a contract obeys to.
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Old Jun 24, 2020 | 2:11 am
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Originally Posted by athome
.....He was treated according to the rules everybody has to obey to and everybody expects the counterpart in a contract obeys to.

Where the supplier plays fast and loose with contractual terms, it's a tad Stockholm to preach good faith to consumers.


Given the respect the airline is showing to rules, the game seems to have gone a bit wild-west.
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Old Jun 24, 2020 | 2:28 am
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This really has nothing to do with any special circumstances. A passenger decided to cancel a non-refundable ticket, giving a refund of taxes etc. This is disclosed and has always been like this. That those flights were later cancelled by the airline is immaterial here. I agree that LH is not behaving in a proper way in not refunding tickets for cancelled flights is another matter entirely but not relevant here.
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Old Jun 24, 2020 | 2:35 am
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So if the special circumstances have nothing to do with this - can I then have my 250 under eu261 for every flight they cancelled without informing me?

Also if these circumstances have no influence - can I also have all the time back spent on hold because their website functionality is so woeful?
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Old Jun 24, 2020 | 2:49 am
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Originally Posted by LondonElite
This really has nothing to do with any special circumstances. A passenger decided to cancel a non-refundable ticket, giving a refund of taxes etc. This is disclosed and has always been like this. That those flights were later cancelled by the airline is immaterial here. I agree that LH is not behaving in a proper way in not refunding tickets for cancelled flights is another matter entirely but not relevant here.
How is a counterparty only enforcing the rules when it benefits them not relevant?
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Old Jun 24, 2020 | 2:57 am
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If I cancel a non-refundable ticket I don't expect to get anything but taxes back. It has been like that for ages.
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