Lufthansa bilked us out of $5K [volontary cancel]
#1
Original Poster




Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 14
Lufthansa bilked us out of $5K [volontary cancel]
Last October, we purchased two round class business class tickets from JFK to SVG via FRA on LH for vacation travel in June. Once COVID-19 hit, we knew those plans would not happen but we waited until LH officially canceled the flights. I knew the flights would probably not operate since they were no longer bookable. I checked online every few days for weeks. Finally, when I logged into my LH account in mid-May, I saw the option online to cancel my flight for a refund. Since I had not seen that option available before, I made the stupid mistake of clicking it. However, when I received the email a few minutes later and saw that it said that I will receive a refund "if my ticket allows."
I immediately called Lufthansa customer service and politely asked the agent for clarification. I told her that if my tickets were not going to be fully refunded then I did not want to cancel and asked if this action could be canceled and the booking reinstated. The agent was polite and said she would would check for me. She said that unfortunately, my ticket would only be eligible for a refund of taxes and fees. She then put me on hold and said she would see about reinstating the booking. After about 15 minutes of being on hold, I was abruptly disconnected without the agent returning. I suspect I was hung up on. I immediately called back and politely explained to the agent who answered what had happened and what the previous agent said she was doing. She said that it was impossible to reinstate a booking cancelled online and that I should not have cancelled my booking online. I explained that the previous agent claimed she was working on reinstating it. She said that it would be impossible for the other agent to do anything and she refused to do anything further. When I politely asked to speak to her supervisor, instead of being transferred, I was again disconnected. A third call gave me a agent who basically said the same thing as the 2nd agent. She said I would receive a refund of taxes of fees but she was unable to tell me how much of a refund I would receive.
Sadly, a few days after my interactions, our flights were "officially" canceled. I blame myself for not more carefully reading the fine print although Lufthansa was deceptive in their practices and their customer service was terrible. An expensive lesson learned. While I am tempted to file disputes with the airline and regulatory agencies, I'm not sure it is worth the bother and I suspect I would ultimately lose. Nonetheless, I decided to at least dispute the original transaction with American Express. Unfortunately, a week later I was given a merchant credit of only $135.98 x 2.
My question here is, does anyone know if this seems like what I should receive? Given that the Lufthansa agents on the phone could not tell me how much I was entitled to have refunded, I have no way of knowing if I am being further bilked by Lufthansa.
Our original two tickets showed the following breakdowns:
Ticket: $1165.00 x 2
Taxes and Carrier Imposed Fees: $1,377.59 x 2
Total Costs: $5085.18
Is it likely that we are only entitled to less than 10% of the "taxes and fees" originally charged???
I immediately called Lufthansa customer service and politely asked the agent for clarification. I told her that if my tickets were not going to be fully refunded then I did not want to cancel and asked if this action could be canceled and the booking reinstated. The agent was polite and said she would would check for me. She said that unfortunately, my ticket would only be eligible for a refund of taxes and fees. She then put me on hold and said she would see about reinstating the booking. After about 15 minutes of being on hold, I was abruptly disconnected without the agent returning. I suspect I was hung up on. I immediately called back and politely explained to the agent who answered what had happened and what the previous agent said she was doing. She said that it was impossible to reinstate a booking cancelled online and that I should not have cancelled my booking online. I explained that the previous agent claimed she was working on reinstating it. She said that it would be impossible for the other agent to do anything and she refused to do anything further. When I politely asked to speak to her supervisor, instead of being transferred, I was again disconnected. A third call gave me a agent who basically said the same thing as the 2nd agent. She said I would receive a refund of taxes of fees but she was unable to tell me how much of a refund I would receive.
Sadly, a few days after my interactions, our flights were "officially" canceled. I blame myself for not more carefully reading the fine print although Lufthansa was deceptive in their practices and their customer service was terrible. An expensive lesson learned. While I am tempted to file disputes with the airline and regulatory agencies, I'm not sure it is worth the bother and I suspect I would ultimately lose. Nonetheless, I decided to at least dispute the original transaction with American Express. Unfortunately, a week later I was given a merchant credit of only $135.98 x 2.
My question here is, does anyone know if this seems like what I should receive? Given that the Lufthansa agents on the phone could not tell me how much I was entitled to have refunded, I have no way of knowing if I am being further bilked by Lufthansa.
Our original two tickets showed the following breakdowns:
Ticket: $1165.00 x 2
Taxes and Carrier Imposed Fees: $1,377.59 x 2
Total Costs: $5085.18
Is it likely that we are only entitled to less than 10% of the "taxes and fees" originally charged???
#2


Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: AGH
Posts: 6,793
Last October, [...snipp...]
Sadly, a few days after my interactions, our flights were "officially" canceled. I blame myself for not more carefully reading the fine print although Lufthansa was deceptive in their practices and their customer service was terrible. An expensive lesson learned. While I am tempted to file disputes with the airline and regulatory agencies, I'm not sure it is worth the bother and I suspect I would ultimately lose. Nonetheless, I decided to at least dispute the original transaction with American Express. Unfortunately, a week later I was given a merchant credit of only $135.98 x 2.
Sadly, a few days after my interactions, our flights were "officially" canceled. I blame myself for not more carefully reading the fine print although Lufthansa was deceptive in their practices and their customer service was terrible. An expensive lesson learned. While I am tempted to file disputes with the airline and regulatory agencies, I'm not sure it is worth the bother and I suspect I would ultimately lose. Nonetheless, I decided to at least dispute the original transaction with American Express. Unfortunately, a week later I was given a merchant credit of only $135.98 x 2.
In such situations, NEVER cancel the reservation. ALWAYS have the airline cancel it and then follow up what to do.
My question here is, does anyone know if this seems like what I should receive? Given that the Lufthansa agents on the phone could not tell me how much I was entitled to have refunded, I have no way of knowing if I am being further bilked by Lufthansa.
Ticket: $1165.00 x 2
Taxes and Carrier Imposed Fees: $1,377.59 x 2
Total Costs: $5085.18
Is it likely that we are only entitled to less than 10% of the "taxes and fees" originally charged???
Ticket: $1165.00 x 2
Taxes and Carrier Imposed Fees: $1,377.59 x 2
Total Costs: $5085.18
Is it likely that we are only entitled to less than 10% of the "taxes and fees" originally charged???
Last edited by fassy; Jun 23, 2020 at 11:24 am
#3
Suspended
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: PVG, FRA, SEA, HEL
Programs: UA Premier Gold
Posts: 4,783
I saw the option online to cancel my flight for a refund. Since I had not seen that option available before, I made the stupid mistake of clicking it.
Was there no dialogue on the website (a warning) about what will happen once you cancel a ticket?
#5
Suspended
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: DCA
Programs: UA US CO AA DL FL
Posts: 50,253
It is unlikely that the fees are refundable if the base ticket fare is non-refundable. This leaves the taxes and those might very well be what you got.
As others note, it is unfortunate, but if you cancelled before LH cancelled, then you are only due what the fare rules for your ticket provided. It sounds as though your fare rules were in a non-refundable fare bucket, although it seems worth your time to carefully review the fare rules to be certain that LH has it right.
In that situation, there is neither a valid complaint under EC 261/2004 nor US DOT rules nor is your card issuer likely to process a full refund unless LH makes a mistake and fails to respond to the card issuer (unlikely).
While unlikely, also consider exploring whether your travel insurance covers the ticket value as you are prohibited from travel (presuming that you do not meet one of the narrow exceptions). Unlikely, but worth the time to read the policy language carefully (again, don't rely on what phone agents tell you).
For the broader audience, never cancel until your flight has been cancelled or it is the day of travel. When the flight is cancelled, you are entitled to a refund. If the flight operates, then you take your lumps if you wish to travel.
As others note, it is unfortunate, but if you cancelled before LH cancelled, then you are only due what the fare rules for your ticket provided. It sounds as though your fare rules were in a non-refundable fare bucket, although it seems worth your time to carefully review the fare rules to be certain that LH has it right.
In that situation, there is neither a valid complaint under EC 261/2004 nor US DOT rules nor is your card issuer likely to process a full refund unless LH makes a mistake and fails to respond to the card issuer (unlikely).
While unlikely, also consider exploring whether your travel insurance covers the ticket value as you are prohibited from travel (presuming that you do not meet one of the narrow exceptions). Unlikely, but worth the time to read the policy language carefully (again, don't rely on what phone agents tell you).
For the broader audience, never cancel until your flight has been cancelled or it is the day of travel. When the flight is cancelled, you are entitled to a refund. If the flight operates, then you take your lumps if you wish to travel.
#6




Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: DFW
Posts: 331
It may be too little, too late now, but did you have an option originally of taking a credit instead of pushing for a refund of what little taxes and fees there were? A $5000 voucher sounds much more worthwhile than a $270 refund....
Unfortunately, it seems that the tax refund has already been credited to your account. I don't believe you are "entitled" to anything else. It may be worth writing nicely to LH customer service to see if they might issue you a goodwill voucher to offset some of the 4.7k loss
Unfortunately, it seems that the tax refund has already been credited to your account. I don't believe you are "entitled" to anything else. It may be worth writing nicely to LH customer service to see if they might issue you a goodwill voucher to offset some of the 4.7k loss
#7
Suspended
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: En Route
Programs: Many
Posts: 6,798
LH cancelled an F booking, they agree they owe me the $, I agree they owe me the $ yet I still have no $. This is a recurring theme with my cancelled LH bookings. I feel like I am at least owed a voucher for all these interest free loans.
#10




Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: USA, France
Programs: LH HON*****, AF/KL Gold; HHilton Diamond; Marriott Gold; IHG Platinium; Avis PresClub
Posts: 1,268
It is also not a question how he was treated. He was treated according to the rules everybody has to obey to and everybody expects the counterpart in a contract obeys to.
#11
FlyerTalk Evangelist



Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: London
Programs: Hilton, IHG - BA, GA, LH, QR, SV, TK
Posts: 18,279
Where the supplier plays fast and loose with contractual terms, it's a tad Stockholm to preach good faith to consumers.
Given the respect the airline is showing to rules, the game seems to have gone a bit wild-west.
#12
Suspended
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Canada, USA, Europe
Programs: UA 1K
Posts: 31,439
This really has nothing to do with any special circumstances. A passenger decided to cancel a non-refundable ticket, giving a refund of taxes etc. This is disclosed and has always been like this. That those flights were later cancelled by the airline is immaterial here. I agree that LH is not behaving in a proper way in not refunding tickets for cancelled flights is another matter entirely but not relevant here.
#13



Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: ZRH
Programs: LH SEN
Posts: 646
So if the special circumstances have nothing to do with this - can I then have my 250 under eu261 for every flight they cancelled without informing me?
Also if these circumstances have no influence - can I also have all the time back spent on hold because their website functionality is so woeful?
Also if these circumstances have no influence - can I also have all the time back spent on hold because their website functionality is so woeful?
#14




Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Berlin
Posts: 1,794
This really has nothing to do with any special circumstances. A passenger decided to cancel a non-refundable ticket, giving a refund of taxes etc. This is disclosed and has always been like this. That those flights were later cancelled by the airline is immaterial here. I agree that LH is not behaving in a proper way in not refunding tickets for cancelled flights is another matter entirely but not relevant here.



