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Old Jul 9, 2009 | 10:51 am
  #76  
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Originally Posted by Bart
Originally Posted by goalie
could you then please drop a dime with that same logic and argue in favor of eliminating the blue shirting at the gates?
If I were king for a day.....
it's good to be the king . all hail king Bart, the one-th!
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Old Jul 9, 2009 | 10:59 am
  #77  
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Originally Posted by magellan315
Since Ron started posting here he has used a variety of excuses when backed into a corner with the incorrect/invalid statements he makes. At first he claimed he was being trolled or the rules had changed. Currently he claims we don't have the education/intelligence to understand certain things so he doesn't have to answer anything he is challenged on. He has yet to explain what his educational training/background is.

He can either put up or shut up. I would say the analysis of his education based on his probable military service is accurate, unless Ron wants to prove otherwise.
Actually, I have. Not in this thread, but in the Who are we thread. Maybe not the detail you would like, but lifes a rock. Take a few moments and look it over. Ill have that plate of crow waiting for you when you get done.

As for challenges, bring one concerning the TSA that at my level I should know and I might take the time to address it.

Concerning my military service, 14 years is close. The answer to the other question is: VSI/SSB. Look it up. As for my education, well lets just say that I didnt waste my time like most of my fellow military service members, I took classes all the time. I suppose if I wanted to I could have gotten more than the one degree I did (I certainly have the hours), most of the classes I took were not for a degree but because I was interested in the subject.

PT brought the questions about the validity of his legalistic claims upon himself. He was asked to be very specific, and failed. He used a shotgun to swat a fly, and missed the swarm at his back. To bad for him. His choice, not mine.

And. As for the other various vapid concerns, I give them the weight they deserve.
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Old Jul 9, 2009 | 11:17 am
  #78  
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Originally Posted by TSORon
PT brought the questions about the validity of his legalistic claims upon himself. He was asked to be very specific, and failed. He used a shotgun to swat a fly, and missed the swarm at his back. To bad for him. His choice, not mine.
I think PT provided more than enough credibility and proved his position.


Originally Posted by TSORon
And. As for the other various vapid concerns, I give them the weight they deserve.
There have been some very valid follow-up questions that you have conveniently side-stepped. You're free to do that, but at the peril of your own credibility (which, really isn't much right about now).
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Old Jul 9, 2009 | 12:11 pm
  #79  
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Last edited by Bart; Sep 18, 2009 at 10:22 am
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Old Jul 9, 2009 | 12:12 pm
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Originally Posted by TSORon
As for my education, well lets just say that I didnt waste my time like most of my fellow military service members, I took classes all the time. I suppose if I wanted to I could have gotten more than the one degree I did (I certainly have the hours), most of the classes I took were not for a degree but because I was interested in the subject.
Another vague answer as usual. You took classes, but you won't say which ones. You took enough to get more than one degree, but you didn't bother to get one.

And new tactic of not answering questions you find vapid, is just another way to avoid answering anything you can't back up with real facts.

As to your VSI/SSB the Rand Corporation had this to say:
The Program increased separation rates, especially among lower class personnel
LINK.
If you wanted to convince me your smarter than the rest of us you're not helping yourself. Hope I'm not being to vapid.

Last edited by magellan315; Jul 9, 2009 at 12:22 pm
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Old Jul 9, 2009 | 12:14 pm
  #81  
 
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Originally Posted by Bart
credibility \ˌkre-də-ˈbi-lə-tē\ noun

1 : the quality or power of inspiring belief an account lacking in credibility
2 : capacity for belief strains her reader's credibility
3 : only reserved for non-TSA FlyerTalk forum members (see also objectivity, neutrality and independent judgment)
Bart in case you haven't noticed there are TSA members on the forum who get respect, like HVTSO Dean. Every time some of you make a claim that can not be substantiated with real facts just makes you that less credible.
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Old Jul 9, 2009 | 12:23 pm
  #82  
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Originally Posted by TSORon
PT brought the questions about the validity of his legalistic claims upon himself. He was asked to be “very specific”, and failed.
On the contrary, I was very specific. You, however, either couldn't understand the responses, or simply believe that you know more about constitutional law than I do.

Believe me. You don't.

He used a shotgun to swat a fly, and missed the swarm at his back. To bad for him. His choice, not mine.
If you think the Constitution is a "shotgun," so be it. I'm not interested in writing, "A Child's Golden Wonder Book of Constitutional Law," though one clearly appears to be needed by TSA. Constitutional jurisprudence is arcane, which is why it takes a post-graduate degree and a licensing exam to practice it. You seem to expect it to be articulable in Romper Room, "Do bee/don't bee," fashion and, when it's explained to you and you don't understand the explanation, resort to insult. It's rather amusing to hear someone whose comprehension of these topics barely achieves a high school level criticize the education of others.

And…. As for the other various vapid concerns, I give them the weight they deserve.
As I said, when you don't understand something you resort to insults. It's a transparent tactic and a primary reason you are not given the respect to which you think you are entitled. Note that you are one of a number of TSOs and STSOs who post here. Though, of course, disagreement with them is frequent, no one reacts to them as they react to you. You might want to think about that.
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Old Jul 9, 2009 | 12:28 pm
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Originally Posted by TSORon
Actually, I have. Not in this thread, but in the Who are we thread. Maybe not the detail you would like, but lifes a rock.
There are no details in that post other than you were trained to check ID's and provide perimeter security. Link If you can't be specific than you don't get to be a security expert.
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Old Jul 9, 2009 | 12:34 pm
  #84  
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Originally Posted by Bart
credibility \ˌkre-də-ˈbi-lə-tē\ noun

1 : the quality or power of inspiring belief an account lacking in credibility
2 : capacity for belief strains her reader's credibility
3 : only reserved for non-TSA FlyerTalk forum members (see also objectivity, neutrality and independent judgment)
Sorry, Bart. Nos. 1 and 2 are correct. 3 is not. Credibility doesn't mandate objectivity or neutrality. It only mandates accuracy and knowledge.

Think about this: FT has as its primary membership frequent fliers -- people who have to interact with TSA on a frequent basis. Most of the criticism of TSA comes from frequent fliers and those members of the media who are, themselves, frequent fliers. Most of the support for TSA comes from casual fliers -- those who fly once or twice a year, are terrified of becoming a 9/11 statistic, and are incapable of critically evaluating TSA's methods and procedures.

You see it from TSA's side. We see it from the frequent fliers' side. We are both "credible," with respect to our experience of the interaction. It does not mean that you are automatically wrong, but it also means that we are not, either.

I would add, as well, that with respect to constitutional jurisprudence, it is the rare non-lawyer who has any credibility and TSORon has proven the validity of this generalization.

Now, perhaps you can answer a question that I've put to TSORon, but he has simply evaded answering:

"How can TSA claim that commercial passenger planes are "secure" when each and every one of them in the U.S. has uninspected cargo and uninspected U.S. mail loaded into it?"
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Old Jul 9, 2009 | 12:39 pm
  #85  
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Last edited by Bart; Sep 18, 2009 at 10:21 am
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Old Jul 9, 2009 | 12:46 pm
  #86  
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Originally Posted by Bart
LOL. And I hope HVTSODean continues to be received favorably. But you (in general) are a fickle bunch. The moment HVTSODean dares to disagree with some of you on a topic considered sacred, he'll be thrown into the dungeon along with TSORon, tsadude, and the rest of us who speak our minds without apology.
I've noticed that myself. As long as he agree's with them they like him. When he dosent, well lets just say I have seen sharks in a feeding frenzy before.
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Old Jul 9, 2009 | 12:54 pm
  #87  
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Originally Posted by TSORon
I've noticed that myself. As long as he agree's with them they like him. When he dosent, well lets just say I have seen sharks in a feeding frenzy before.
Quite the contrary. He takes criticism well, and takes the time to read the posts and lets the criticism run off him like water.

Frankly, you and Bart take it personally. And that's the difference.
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Old Jul 9, 2009 | 1:28 pm
  #88  
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Originally Posted by TSORon
I've noticed that myself. As long as he agree's with them they like him. When he dosent, well lets just say I have seen sharks in a feeding frenzy before.
Really, share some examples. The difference is Dean is capable of answering direct questions, without going off topic, and he is even able to share a differing view without tangents or insults.

None of that you and Bart are capable of doing. Weak...

We all await your answers to the questions posted on the pages prior within this topic.

Ciao,
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Old Jul 9, 2009 | 1:33 pm
  #89  
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Originally Posted by TSORon
Concerning my military service, 14 years is close. The answer to the other question is: VSI/SSB. Look it up.

Perhaps calling yourself a "Security Expert" might be a bit of a stretch.


http://www.rand.org/pubs/monograph_r.../MR859.ch2.pdf

"The Air Force also had a sizable reduction
to accomplish: 177,000. It primarily offered VSI/SSB to midgrade
(E4 and E5) enlisted members in less-critical skills and more
than 9 years of service."

"In contrast, Air Force members
were presented with probabilities of being involuntarily separated if
they opted not to take the benefit."
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Old Jul 9, 2009 | 1:34 pm
  #90  
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Originally Posted by TSORon
Actually, I have. Not in this thread, but in the Who are we thread. Maybe not the detail you would like, but lifes a rock. Take a few moments and look it over. Ill have that plate of crow waiting for you when you get done.

As for challenges, bring one concerning the TSA that at my level I should know and I might take the time to address it.

Concerning my military service, 14 years is close. The answer to the other question is: VSI/SSB. Look it up. As for my education, well lets just say that I didnt waste my time like most of my fellow military service members, I took classes all the time. I suppose if I wanted to I could have gotten more than the one degree I did (I certainly have the hours), most of the classes I took were not for a degree but because I was interested in the subject.

PT brought the questions about the validity of his legalistic claims upon himself. He was asked to be very specific, and failed. He used a shotgun to swat a fly, and missed the swarm at his back. To bad for him. His choice, not mine.

And. As for the other various vapid concerns, I give them the weight they deserve.
Crow?

Do you mean this post from page 19:
Hmmm, well the name says most of it. I am a TSO at a large CAT I airport in the midwest, I have extensive experience in Aircraft Security (Mil, USAF Security Police, 81170, 13 years), and am here because several mentions of this site were made on the EOS blog site. Thought I'd stop in and see what all the huff was about. Yes, I'm the same TSORon as on the EOS blog. I really like working for the TSA, working with all the different people on the checkpoint is more fun than any human should have while standing. And despite how I may come off here and in the EOS blog, Ihave never had complaint made by a passenger, whereas my list of compliments (formal, written) is taller than I am. Go figure.

Anyway, just wanted to give those who have seen my EOS posts a bit more info. Besides, I enjoy posting to forums and elsewhere, so this should be another interesting experience.
You say nothing of education here; you talk of "experiance" but no formal education. Is there another post we missed? Please share.

Do you have an associates from the CCAF? Is that your degree? The auto degree you get for doing a job in the USAF? Tell us there is more than that...

Remember, you brought it up...

Ciao,
FH
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