TSA Disrespect
Dec 4, 2004 | 5:17 am
#16
Join Date: Jul 2003
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Originally Posted by thesaints
Before 9/11 security at US airports was lower then in Europe. Do you remember unticketed people being able to go to the gate area ?
If it were really a security mechanism (it isn't), it would be trivial to defeat, as Spiff has pointed out five zillion times.
Dec 4, 2004 | 6:39 am
#17
Join Date: Dec 2003
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Posts: 3,522
Originally Posted by FLYaway3x
I don't know what has gotten into the minds of Americans post 9/11...
Let me give you a little situation. Pre 9/11 I was on a connecting flight in Germany. In between my LH flights I had to go through security. I buzzed in the metal detector and had the pat-down. Let me tell you it was tame in comparison to what people are accusing the TSA of. But the fact of the matter is that at the end of the day, I don't care how I was treated. The fact of the matter is that airport security is nothing new. Remember Lockerbie? I think we all want to prevent another one of those. If that means that I have a pat down that's fine. I have nothing to hide and it doesn't bother me!
Flash forward to the days after 9/11...
Americans were united and we promised that we would make a stand and not allow terrorism to infiltrate our airways again. People gave RESPECT to the TSA. There was no shouting or screaming at people who are doing an honest job making an honest living.
Flash forward to the days after Richard Reid...
People seem to forget that a major reason that your shoes are inspected is because someone tried to blow up a plane with his! For some reason it became a huge hassle to take off your shoes if you were asked to. If you don't want to, then charter a jet. I don't want someone jeopardizing my family's safety when we are on holiday because enough people complained about their "shoe hassle" that the policy was revoked. It's not a big deal! In fact, the TSA people are often a big fan of designer shoes from what I can see. I had a TSA employee ask me if my shoes were Ferragamos and she was right on the money!
Flash forward to today...
Once again the media has over hyped the travel season hassle of air travel. Yes, I know most of us travel for business and we have a family of 20 who flies maybe once per year in front of us at the security line. Yes, I know it can be frustrating. But come on people! If you are that inconvenienced and worried about missing your flight, just get to the airport earlier! We all have to work together. More people travel at this time of year, thus the lines are longer. BE PREPARED!
And as to the groping...
I was in JFK yesterday and was waiting to go through the metal detector. I saw a woman being patted down by another woman and screamed that she was being groped. COME ON! This woman had nothing to be proud of in the looks department and her personality also was pretty ugly when she said "Get your hands off me you low-wage TSA *****!" Look, people, let's get real here. Plenty of people are applying to work for th TSA. NONE of them want to risk their job being accused of sexual harassment. In fact, if I were a screener I would ask not to be assigned to that duty. I am amazed at the lack of respect that these FEDERAL EMPLOYEES get! If the FBI showed up at your house, I would bet that no one on this board would treat them with the disrespect that some of you give TSA employees! If you are going to be searched you have the right to ask for a member of the same sex to search you and you can be searched in a private area! I have never seen it denied!
This is a bigger problem overall. There is a serious lack of respect of authority post 9/11. I know we are all feeling venerable and afraid about terrorism; and some us dislike our administration. It is not an excuse to give the TSA a hard time though! As some of you like to refer to them with (un)clever acronyms, I say this; if you were treated as these people are treated on a day to day basis you would be grouchy also! For G-dsake people, haven't you ever heard the golden rule? IT IS APPROPRIATE FOR THIS TIME OF YEAR! "Do to others as you would have them do to you" If you need to find it it is in Luke 6:31.
In closing, I have a question for the TSA screeners on this board...
There is a lovely group of TSA staffers at a small airport I fly out of every once in a while. They are truly funny and nice human beings and are just lovely. I know you can't tip a federal employee, can I give them a gift like nice chocolates or a donation to a charity in their names (I know most of them)? Or is a simple thank-you sufficient for they great job and service they provide?
That's my rant! If you want to flame me, fine! I think this is a topic that should be discussed in a season where we should reflect and treat each other with respect!
Let me give you a little situation. Pre 9/11 I was on a connecting flight in Germany. In between my LH flights I had to go through security. I buzzed in the metal detector and had the pat-down. Let me tell you it was tame in comparison to what people are accusing the TSA of. But the fact of the matter is that at the end of the day, I don't care how I was treated. The fact of the matter is that airport security is nothing new. Remember Lockerbie? I think we all want to prevent another one of those. If that means that I have a pat down that's fine. I have nothing to hide and it doesn't bother me!
Flash forward to the days after 9/11...
Americans were united and we promised that we would make a stand and not allow terrorism to infiltrate our airways again. People gave RESPECT to the TSA. There was no shouting or screaming at people who are doing an honest job making an honest living.
Flash forward to the days after Richard Reid...
People seem to forget that a major reason that your shoes are inspected is because someone tried to blow up a plane with his! For some reason it became a huge hassle to take off your shoes if you were asked to. If you don't want to, then charter a jet. I don't want someone jeopardizing my family's safety when we are on holiday because enough people complained about their "shoe hassle" that the policy was revoked. It's not a big deal! In fact, the TSA people are often a big fan of designer shoes from what I can see. I had a TSA employee ask me if my shoes were Ferragamos and she was right on the money!
Flash forward to today...
Once again the media has over hyped the travel season hassle of air travel. Yes, I know most of us travel for business and we have a family of 20 who flies maybe once per year in front of us at the security line. Yes, I know it can be frustrating. But come on people! If you are that inconvenienced and worried about missing your flight, just get to the airport earlier! We all have to work together. More people travel at this time of year, thus the lines are longer. BE PREPARED!
And as to the groping...
I was in JFK yesterday and was waiting to go through the metal detector. I saw a woman being patted down by another woman and screamed that she was being groped. COME ON! This woman had nothing to be proud of in the looks department and her personality also was pretty ugly when she said "Get your hands off me you low-wage TSA *****!" Look, people, let's get real here. Plenty of people are applying to work for th TSA. NONE of them want to risk their job being accused of sexual harassment. In fact, if I were a screener I would ask not to be assigned to that duty. I am amazed at the lack of respect that these FEDERAL EMPLOYEES get! If the FBI showed up at your house, I would bet that no one on this board would treat them with the disrespect that some of you give TSA employees! If you are going to be searched you have the right to ask for a member of the same sex to search you and you can be searched in a private area! I have never seen it denied!
This is a bigger problem overall. There is a serious lack of respect of authority post 9/11. I know we are all feeling venerable and afraid about terrorism; and some us dislike our administration. It is not an excuse to give the TSA a hard time though! As some of you like to refer to them with (un)clever acronyms, I say this; if you were treated as these people are treated on a day to day basis you would be grouchy also! For G-dsake people, haven't you ever heard the golden rule? IT IS APPROPRIATE FOR THIS TIME OF YEAR! "Do to others as you would have them do to you" If you need to find it it is in Luke 6:31.
In closing, I have a question for the TSA screeners on this board...
There is a lovely group of TSA staffers at a small airport I fly out of every once in a while. They are truly funny and nice human beings and are just lovely. I know you can't tip a federal employee, can I give them a gift like nice chocolates or a donation to a charity in their names (I know most of them)? Or is a simple thank-you sufficient for they great job and service they provide?
That's my rant! If you want to flame me, fine! I think this is a topic that should be discussed in a season where we should reflect and treat each other with respect!
Now matter how you frame it, the TSA only wants to prevent another 9-11. Why else would they allow all pax to be screened, but there is a lot of cargo on every flight that has never been screened. I guess it is OK if the cargo can damage us, just as long as the a/c isn't used as a weapon to destroy something else.
Dec 4, 2004 | 7:08 am
#18
Join Date: Apr 2003
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Posts: 5,735
Originally Posted by grouse
It just illustrates how people will believe that more restrictive = higher security, which is not necessarily true.
Dec 4, 2004 | 7:39 am
#19
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Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 1,441
I'm sure that the TSA is the laughing stock of those who would perpetuate terror attacks on us.
They are smart, they hate us and they will get us again. It certainly would not be difficult for a suicide bomber, or 2 or 3, to walk into a crowded terminal in the northern part of our country during the holiday season wearing a bomb under a heavy winter rcoat. What use will all the "security" screening have been then?
We'll be stripping at the curb. Or have to be pre-certified to fly. And guess what, they will still get us again.
And BTW, does anybody else feel a revulsion at the letters: SSSS?
I'm not Jewish, but I do find those letters offensive.
They are smart, they hate us and they will get us again. It certainly would not be difficult for a suicide bomber, or 2 or 3, to walk into a crowded terminal in the northern part of our country during the holiday season wearing a bomb under a heavy winter rcoat. What use will all the "security" screening have been then?
We'll be stripping at the curb. Or have to be pre-certified to fly. And guess what, they will still get us again.
And BTW, does anybody else feel a revulsion at the letters: SSSS?
I'm not Jewish, but I do find those letters offensive.
Dec 4, 2004 | 9:41 am
#20
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i think that's a LITTLE sensitive.... "SS" would chill me, but "SSSS" is just the sound a sneaky snake makes.
Dec 4, 2004 | 9:55 am
#21
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Originally Posted by thesaints
Before 9/11 security at US airports was lower then in Europe... I think box cutters wouldn't have been allowed on board in Europe to begin with...
Dec 4, 2004 | 9:55 am
#22
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Do you feel the same way about the Secret Service (SS), the Social Security Administration (SSA) or a privately-owned ship, such as the SS United States?
Dec 4, 2004 | 10:49 am
#23
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: USA
Posts: 1,017
Originally Posted by FLYaway3x
I am amazed at the lack of respect that these FEDERAL EMPLOYEES get! There is a serious lack of respect of authority post 9/11. I know we are all feeling venerable and afraid about terrorism; and some us dislike our administration.
I found another great quote that pretty much sums up my attitude toward the TSA. Just think of the TSA as the men and the passengers as the women in this little analogy:
"A man's women folk, whatever their outward show of respect for his merit and authority, always regard him secretly as an ..., and with something akin to pity. His most gaudy sayings and doings seldom deceive them; they see the actual man within, and know him for a shallow and pathetic fellow. In this fact, perhaps, lies one of the best proofs of feminine intelligence, or, as the common phrase makes it, feminine intuition."
Outwardly respecting the TSA is my way of mocking this worthless institution.
Dec 4, 2004 | 11:00 am
#24
Join Date: Jul 2003
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Originally Posted by FLYaway3x
...There is a serious lack of respect of authority post 9/11...
Let me preface this by saying that, as a lifelong libertarian, I was wary of authority long before that awful day. I have no real problem with the need for or existence of the TSA (or an equivalent agency), although I do believe some of their policies are wrong-headed and ineffective, but that's a separate topic.
From various posts it is clear that different FTers have had widely varying experiences at the sharp end of the TSA. And it's certainly possible that individual attitudes have colored those experiences. Speaking only for myself, it's about a 50-50 mix between civil, respectful screeners who correctly apply the policies and those who seem convinced that they have been given carte blanche to indulge their own belligerent, megalomaniacal behavior. Unless and until the latter are rooted out, fired, retrained or otherwise eliminated then the TSA as a whole is not deserving of my respect.
Dec 4, 2004 | 11:11 am
#25
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Do you feel the same way about the Secret Service (SS), the Social Security Administration (SSA) or a privately-owned ship, such as the SS United States?
Dec 4, 2004 | 11:49 am
#26
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Originally Posted by FLYaway3x
There is a serious lack of respect of authority post 9/11...
There is a serious lack of respect of authority post 9/11...
Dec 5, 2004 | 11:13 pm
#27
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Posts: n/a
Originally Posted by whirledtraveler
I have a simple rule. I choose to respect only those who do not treat me as a criminal. So, sorry, my respect does not extend in any way, shape, or form to TSA folks.
someone who mutters obscenities under their breath and someone who is confused about the "process" would probably be treated differently.
unless it was a reaction to the same precedures that we've all gone through, which goes to the default above reaction...
Last edited by robodeer; Dec 5, 2004 at 11:16 pm
Dec 6, 2004 | 9:15 am
#28
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Originally Posted by FLYaway3x
Let me give you a little situation. Pre 9/11 I was on a connecting flight in Germany. In between my LH flights I had to go through security. I buzzed in the metal detector and had the pat-down. Let me tell you it was tame in comparison to what people are accusing the TSA of.
And just because something is worse somewhere else doesn't make it OK. There's genocide in the Sudan and 50,000 people have died. That doesn't mean it's OK for the US to randomly kill 49,999 people.
The fact of the matter is that airport security is nothing new. Remember Lockerbie? I think we all want to prevent another one of those. If that means that I have a pat down that's fine. I have nothing to hide and it doesn't bother me!
Even a body cavity search wouldn't have prevented Lockerbie. In fact, since we don't screen air cargo, 100 planes could easily be blown up in the US today.
Americans were united and we promised that we would make a stand and not allow terrorism to infiltrate our airways again. People gave RESPECT to the TSA. There was no shouting or screaming at people who are doing an honest job making an honest living.
People seem to forget that a major reason that your shoes are inspected is because someone tried to blow up a plane with his! For some reason it became a huge hassle to take off your shoes if you were asked to.
If you don't want to, then charter a jet.
I was in JFK yesterday and was waiting to go through the metal detector. I saw a woman being patted down by another woman and screamed that she was being groped. COME ON! This woman had nothing to be proud of in the looks department
I am amazed at the lack of respect that these FEDERAL EMPLOYEES get!
If the FBI showed up at your house, I would bet that no one on this board would treat them with the disrespect that some of you give TSA employees!
If you are going to be searched you have the right to ask for a member of the same sex to search you and you can be searched in a private area! I have never seen it denied!
This is a bigger problem overall. There is a serious lack of respect of authority post 9/11.
We don't live in a dictatorship or a monarchy where we are required to respect authority. We live in a country that is supposed to uphold our rights and freedom.
It is not an excuse to give the TSA a hard time though!
"Do to others as you would have them do to you" If you need to find it it is in Luke 6:31.
Originally Posted by BearX220
I totally disagree. I think there is a serious love affair with authority post 9/11, and a serious lack of passion for the personal rights and individual liberties that are bedrock American values.
Dec 6, 2004 | 10:28 am
#29
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someone who mutters obscenities under their breath and someone who is confused about the "process" would probably be treated differently.
Dec 6, 2004 | 11:00 am
#30
Join Date: Sep 2004
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nice post!
Originally Posted by FLYaway3x
In closing, I have a question for the TSA screeners on this board...
There is a lovely group of TSA staffers at a small airport I fly out of every once in a while. They are truly funny and nice human beings and are just lovely. I know you can't tip a federal employee, can I give them a gift like nice chocolates or a donation to a charity in their names (I know most of them)? Or is a simple thank-you sufficient for they great job and service they provide?
That's my rant! If you want to flame me, fine! I think this is a topic that should be discussed in a season where we should reflect and treat each other with respect!
There is a lovely group of TSA staffers at a small airport I fly out of every once in a while. They are truly funny and nice human beings and are just lovely. I know you can't tip a federal employee, can I give them a gift like nice chocolates or a donation to a charity in their names (I know most of them)? Or is a simple thank-you sufficient for they great job and service they provide?
That's my rant! If you want to flame me, fine! I think this is a topic that should be discussed in a season where we should reflect and treat each other with respect!