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Example of CX restricting access based on Point of Sale

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Old May 16, 2007 | 1:21 pm
  #31  
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Originally Posted by JohnAx
But imho the first thing EF should do to assure customer confidence is generate (and maintain) a page of known issues with a prominent link. No customer should have to discover for himself e.g. that typing in an airline code can be fatal to a search.
At the top of every screen on EF is a prominent link called "FAQ/Help". This leads to a page with a number of guides, a technical issues section and, first and foremost, an FAQ link. In the FAQ section, we list issues by category. It is updated as issues become known to us that either need to be explained in more detailed, because more than one person is finding it to be a problem, or are known not to be repairable.

In the case you brought to our attention, it was fixed within hours of you notifying our customer care folks by email to them. This is why it is not on the FAQ list. Prior to your notification to us we knew that, in general, results could vary by how the search criteria were stated but it would be next to impossible to know exactly what the differences would be for all the possible combinations of airline, route, date, time of day, class, etc. that one could enter. And, as a stated before, even for a given set of of criteria the results may change as the airlines and GDS's change their own search and reporting algorithms without our knowledge. Perhaps this information is exactly what should have been stated in the FAQs. Perhaps it wasn't because we never had reason to believe our subscribers had an issue with understanding that this was the case.

We take great pride in maintaining the site and addressing every issue, bug, suggestion or whatever that is emailed to us. We look forward to your continued partcipation.

Thank you,
EFV

Last edited by ExpertFlyer Voice; May 16, 2007 at 1:46 pm
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Old May 16, 2007 | 1:46 pm
  #32  
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Originally Posted by ExpertFlyer Voice
In the case you brought to our attention, it was fixed within hours of you notifying our customer care folks by email to them.
Confirmed, looks like they were able to fix it when specifying CX as the airline:

CX 252
0 LHR
08/09/07 12:45 PM HKG
08/10/07 07:25 AM 74A
F0 A0 J9 C9 D9 I5 Y9 B9 H9 K9 M9 L9 V9 S9 N0 Q0 O0
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Old May 16, 2007 | 2:37 pm
  #33  
 
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Originally Posted by ExpertFlyer Voice
At the top of every screen on EF is a prominent link called "FAQ/Help". This leads to a page with a number of guides, a technical issues section and, first and foremost, an FAQ link. In the FAQ section, we list issues by category. It is updated as issues become known to us that either need to be explained in more detailed, because more than one person is finding it to be a problem, or are known not to be repairable.

In the case you brought to our attention, it was fixed within hours of you notifying our customer care folks by email to them. This is why it is not on the FAQ list. Prior to your notification to us we knew that, in general, results could vary by how the search criteria were stated but it would be next to impossible to know exactly what the differences would be for all the possible combinations of airline, route, date, time of day, class, etc. that one could enter. And, as a stated before, even for a given set of of criteria the results may change as the airlines and GDS's change their own search and reporting algorithms without our knowledge. Perhaps this information is exactly what should have been stated in the FAQs. Perhaps it wasn't because we never had reason to believe our subscribers had an issue with understanding that this was the case.

We take great pride in maintaining the site and addressing every issue, bug, suggestion or whatever that is emailed to us. We look forward to your continued partcipation.

Thank you,
EFV
Sorry for deviating from the OT, but is EF aware that AA seat maps are not viewable in EF 24 hours before a flight?
This issue is not listed in the FAQ/Technical issues.
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Old May 16, 2007 | 5:21 pm
  #34  
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Originally Posted by MiamiBeach
Sorry for deviating from the OT, but is EF aware that AA seat maps are not viewable in EF 24 hours before a flight?
This issue is not listed in the FAQ/Technical issues.
This was discussed in an FT thread several weeks ago. The problem is that one GDS we were using produced annoyingly incomplete maps, i.e. rows and seats missing, etc. The discussion on that FT thread and emails we received led us to switch to a different GDS that has accurate maps but has a bug that cuts off access to them at around 24 hours, sometime less. We have submitted to the GDS this bug report but we have no received no indication as to when, or if, it will be corrected.

We did not place this issue in the FAQs because a significant revision of the site to be released within a couple of hours from now ( ), will have a hybrid of both, among other improvements. On the same day of departure we pull maps from the incomplete GDS display so at least something will be available. We will, in addition, add to the Technical Issues section the fact that AA maps on the same day of departure may not be complete in the depiction of the requested cabin.

Last edited by ExpertFlyer Voice; May 16, 2007 at 6:57 pm
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Old May 22, 2007 | 11:07 am
  #35  
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I have another example of arilines in Oneworld restricting access as well.

I am trying to book BA 278 on the 22 Aug in D Class. CX told me D is 0 and because of the stupid BA policy no HL1 allowed in sub classes anymore:

According to EF:
BA 278
0 LAX
08/22/07 3:35 PM LHR
08/23/07 9:45 AM 744

F9 A8 J9 C9 D8 I0 W9 T9 Y9 B9 H9 K9 M9 R9 V9 N9 E0 L5 S0 Q0

I recall it use to be so much easier to book these DONE4.
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Old May 22, 2007 | 12:10 pm
  #36  
 
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Originally Posted by Dave Marsh
...and because of the stupid BA policy no HL1 allowed...
What does HL1 mean?
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Old May 22, 2007 | 12:12 pm
  #37  
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Originally Posted by Viajero
What does HL1 mean?
Waitlist.
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Old May 22, 2007 | 12:15 pm
  #38  
 
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Originally Posted by QF009
Waitlist.
Thanks. Is BA also saying D0 then?
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Old May 22, 2007 | 12:24 pm
  #39  
 
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Also, did you try the other BA flights the same day, just as a test? I understand you might want a particular flight, but sometimes checking the situation of other flights that day helps to clear up why EF says D9 and the airline D0.
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Old May 22, 2007 | 3:07 pm
  #40  
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Originally Posted by Viajero
Also, did you try the other BA flights the same day, just as a test? I understand you might want a particular flight, but sometimes checking the situation of other flights that day helps to clear up why EF says D9 and the airline D0.
I got HK1 on the the 5pm flight however I want the earlier one so that I can use the arrivals lounge and the MB spa properly.

I try to call QF and they refuse to look at availability to me because the booking has not been ticketed and CX will have to handle it. I think this also acts as an inventory control as well. Looks like CX does not get the full share of the inventory allocation.

I think the reliability of EF will be out of sync now given these inventory controls from the airlines.
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Old May 22, 2007 | 3:56 pm
  #41  
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Lightbulb

Originally Posted by Dave Marsh
According to EF:
BA 278
0 LAX
08/22/07 3:35 PM LHR
08/23/07 9:45 AM 744

F9 A8 J9 C9 D8 I0 W9 T9 Y9 B9 H9 K9 M9 R9 V9 N9 E0 L5 S0 Q0
It appears that there has just been an opening in the D class using a JP-based POS (it was showing D0 this morning) -- if you call now, you may be able to get it:

[KVS Availability Tool 2.8.2/Platinum - Galileo: ETR/JP]
Code:
LAX  Los Angeles Int'l CA US [KLAX]
LHR  London Heathrow UK [EGLL]
WED  22 Aug 2007

Carrier   Flight From Depart    To   Arrive    A/C  St   Availability
--------- ------ ---- --------- ---- --------- ---- ---- ------------ 
BA        278    LAX  15:35     LHR  09:45 +1  744  0    D1
BA        282    LAX  17:50     LHR  12:00 +1  744  0    D9
BA        268    LAX  21:20     LHR  15:30 +1  744  0    D9
US-based POSs still show D9:

[KVS Availability Tool 2.8.2/Platinum - Apollo: ITN/US-ARL]
Code:
LAX  Los Angeles Int'l CA US [KLAX]
LHR  London Heathrow UK [EGLL]
WED  22 Aug 2007

Carrier   Flight From Depart    To   Arrive    A/C  St   Availability
--------- ------ ---- --------- ---- --------- ---- ---- -------------------------------------------------- 
BA        278    LAX  15:35     LHR  09:45 +1  744  0    F9 A8 J9 C9 D9 I1 Y9 B9 H9 K9 M9 R9 V9 N9 E0 L5 S0 Q0  0  0
BA        282    LAX  17:50     LHR  12:00 +1  744  0    F9 A9 J9 C9 D9 I9 Y9 B9 H9 K9 M9 R9 V9 N0 E0 L0 S0 Q0  0  0
BA        268    LAX  21:20     LHR  15:30 +1  744  0    F9 A9 J9 C9 D9 I9 Y9 B9 H9 K9 M9 R9 V9 N9 E0 L9 S5 Q0  0  0
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Old May 22, 2007 | 4:22 pm
  #42  
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Originally Posted by KVS
It appears that there has just been an opening in the D class using a JP-based POS (it was showing D0 this morning) -- if you call now, you may be able to get it:

[KVS Availability Tool 2.8.2/Platinum - Galileo: ETR/JP]
Code:
LAX  Los Angeles Int'l CA US [KLAX]
LHR  London Heathrow UK [EGLL]
WED  22 Aug 2007

Carrier   Flight From Depart    To   Arrive    A/C  St   Availability
--------- ------ ---- --------- ---- --------- ---- ---- ------------ 
BA        278    LAX  15:35     LHR  09:45 +1  744  0    D1
BA        282    LAX  17:50     LHR  12:00 +1  744  0    D9
BA        268    LAX  21:20     LHR  15:30 +1  744  0    D9
US-based POSs still show D9:

[KVS Availability Tool 2.8.2/Platinum - Apollo: ITN/US-ARL]
Code:
LAX  Los Angeles Int'l CA US [KLAX]
LHR  London Heathrow UK [EGLL]
WED  22 Aug 2007

Carrier   Flight From Depart    To   Arrive    A/C  St   Availability
--------- ------ ---- --------- ---- --------- ---- ---- -------------------------------------------------- 
BA        278    LAX  15:35     LHR  09:45 +1  744  0    F9 A8 J9 C9 D9 I1 Y9 B9 H9 K9 M9 R9 V9 N9 E0 L5 S0 Q0  0  0
BA        282    LAX  17:50     LHR  12:00 +1  744  0    F9 A9 J9 C9 D9 I9 Y9 B9 H9 K9 M9 R9 V9 N0 E0 L0 S0 Q0  0  0
BA        268    LAX  21:20     LHR  15:30 +1  744  0    F9 A9 J9 C9 D9 I9 Y9 B9 H9 K9 M9 R9 V9 N9 E0 L9 S5 Q0  0  0


Thanks, however I actually needed 2 seats anyway. But I might change the dates later.
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Old May 22, 2007 | 5:34 pm
  #43  
 
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Originally Posted by Dave Marsh
...I think the reliability of EF will be out of sync now given these inventory controls from the airlines.
It looks that way. To have EF show D9 when others (CX and KVS, for starters) say D0 is not just an out of sync issue, it's a major problem for us all.
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Old May 22, 2007 | 6:07 pm
  #44  
 
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Please help me understand this alleged POS stuff. This booking Dave Marsh is trying to make, the way I read it is turning up to be like like this:

If one calls a CX office, anywhere in the world, and asks CX to book this, they will say D0 and reject it, right? and if one calls an AA office, anywhere in the world, they are going to say D9 and book it, right? ... so, if the answer is yes to both, what's PoS got to do with it?
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Old May 22, 2007 | 6:34 pm
  #45  
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Arrow Pos

Originally Posted by Viajero
Please help me understand this alleged POS stuff. This booking Dave Marsh is trying to make, the way I read it is turning up to be like like this:

If one calls a CX office, anywhere in the world, and asks CX to book this, they will say D0 and reject it, right? and if one calls an AA office, anywhere in the world, they are going to say D9 and book it, right? ... so, if the answer is yes to both, what's PoS got to do with it?
Not quite...

BA's Res system receives requests for D-class availability for flight BA 278 on 22 Aug 2007. It knows that, for example, request #1 comes from a CX office in HK, #2 from BA office in UK, #3 from BA office in US, #4 from AA office in US.

It can then answer, say, D0 to #1, D3 to #2, D5 to #3, and D9 to #4.

The key POS criteria is, typically, the country (or region), but a number of other criteria can be involved.

There is more info on this topic in the [Interpreting The Results: Factors that can affect availability] section of the KVS Tool FAQ.
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