2010 Elite Program Announcement
Jul 28, 2009, 3:04 pm
#46
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: EAU
Programs: UA 1K, CO Plat, NW Plat, Marriott Premiere Plat, SPG Plat, Priority Gold, Hilton Gold
Posts: 4,712
DL has effectively cancelled all multi-year and lifetime Worldclub memberships, as they have ended that lounge program and replaced it with one you can now get for free if you have a Reserve card or are DM. So if you are one of those two things, and have a lifetime (or multi-year) membership, it's like DL is stealing $350 from you every year.
If you don't, with the reductions in service DL is implementing in the SkyClub program to align it with something they hand out for free, it's like DL is stealing $200 from you every year.
A month or two ago, I was considering picking up a DL Reserve Amex, but since I had just bought a 3-year SkyClub membership that DL absolutely REFUSES to issue pro-rated refunds on, there was no value in it. Now I realize that DL just plain does not believe they should deliver any value for the long-term memberships we purchased.
I do appreciate the rollover miles though - looks like I won't make Diamond but will be around 100k MQM this year, so I should have a much easier time staying gold/plat next year while just buying the cheapest tickets I can. With my Flexperks points!
If you don't, with the reductions in service DL is implementing in the SkyClub program to align it with something they hand out for free, it's like DL is stealing $200 from you every year.
A month or two ago, I was considering picking up a DL Reserve Amex, but since I had just bought a 3-year SkyClub membership that DL absolutely REFUSES to issue pro-rated refunds on, there was no value in it. Now I realize that DL just plain does not believe they should deliver any value for the long-term memberships we purchased.
I do appreciate the rollover miles though - looks like I won't make Diamond but will be around 100k MQM this year, so I should have a much easier time staying gold/plat next year while just buying the cheapest tickets I can. With my Flexperks points!
Jul 28, 2009, 3:41 pm
#47
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Sarasota, FL
Programs: Northwest Platinum, Hilton Diamond, Intercontinental Royal Ambassador, National Executive Elite
Posts: 613
DL has effectively cancelled all multi-year and lifetime Worldclub memberships, as they have ended that lounge program and replaced it with one you can now get for free if you have a Reserve card or are DM. So if you are one of those two things, and have a lifetime (or multi-year) membership, it's like DL is stealing $350 from you every year.
If you don't, with the reductions in service DL is implementing in the SkyClub program to align it with something they hand out for free, it's like DL is stealing $200 from you every year.
A month or two ago, I was considering picking up a DL Reserve Amex, but since I had just bought a 3-year SkyClub membership that DL absolutely REFUSES to issue pro-rated refunds on, there was no value in it. Now I realize that DL just plain does not believe they should deliver any value for the long-term memberships we purchased.
I do appreciate the rollover miles though - looks like I won't make Diamond but will be around 100k MQM this year, so I should have a much easier time staying gold/plat next year while just buying the cheapest tickets I can. With my Flexperks points!
If you don't, with the reductions in service DL is implementing in the SkyClub program to align it with something they hand out for free, it's like DL is stealing $200 from you every year.
A month or two ago, I was considering picking up a DL Reserve Amex, but since I had just bought a 3-year SkyClub membership that DL absolutely REFUSES to issue pro-rated refunds on, there was no value in it. Now I realize that DL just plain does not believe they should deliver any value for the long-term memberships we purchased.
I do appreciate the rollover miles though - looks like I won't make Diamond but will be around 100k MQM this year, so I should have a much easier time staying gold/plat next year while just buying the cheapest tickets I can. With my Flexperks points!
Jul 28, 2009, 3:47 pm
#48
Join Date: Mar 2008
Programs: Delta DM
Posts: 49
I have been a lurker on hear for a while. Never posted, but felt I needed to voice my thoughts.
As a Plat for 5 years and will be Diamond now this year. The new program has its benefits, but the YBM Upgrades for international are useless for most of us. In these difficult times those higher priced tickets are out of reach for those of us that have to purchase our own tickets. Small business owners like myself need to be as fiscally wise as possible. There are much better ways to reward us Diamond international travelers. There is now reason you cannot make the upgrades cert good on any class of ticket.
Why do you think 80% of us did not use the PWU that we have. Not because we did not want to. Because we could not afford the price for that class of tickets.
I am proud to have been a NWFF for so many years, my next 2 years of international travel is going to increase drastically and I need to be involved with the best program possible, but it does not look like Delta is going to be the best choice.
Also, I am sure glad I paid for my 3 year World Club membership when they had the big push on to renew at the lower prices. Seeing now that it is included with Elite Status. I guess they did not think that most of their Platinum and soon to be Diamond members are already member of the club.
Concerned and disappointed.
As a Plat for 5 years and will be Diamond now this year. The new program has its benefits, but the YBM Upgrades for international are useless for most of us. In these difficult times those higher priced tickets are out of reach for those of us that have to purchase our own tickets. Small business owners like myself need to be as fiscally wise as possible. There are much better ways to reward us Diamond international travelers. There is now reason you cannot make the upgrades cert good on any class of ticket.
Why do you think 80% of us did not use the PWU that we have. Not because we did not want to. Because we could not afford the price for that class of tickets.
I am proud to have been a NWFF for so many years, my next 2 years of international travel is going to increase drastically and I need to be involved with the best program possible, but it does not look like Delta is going to be the best choice.
Also, I am sure glad I paid for my 3 year World Club membership when they had the big push on to renew at the lower prices. Seeing now that it is included with Elite Status. I guess they did not think that most of their Platinum and soon to be Diamond members are already member of the club.
Concerned and disappointed.
Jul 28, 2009, 3:49 pm
#49
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Seattle, WA
Programs: AS MVP
Posts: 224
IMHO the companion upgrade benefit is useless in the form that DL is offering it. NW offers upgarde to Platinum companions at the same time as Platinum (on the same reservation). In DL version of companion upgrades by the time 12 hours rolls around it will be next to impossible to upgrade even one person, let alone both the Elite and companion. Useless DL benefit
Jul 28, 2009, 3:53 pm
#50
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 2,384
Listing a benefit that someone already has costs incrementally zero.
Jul 28, 2009, 4:18 pm
#51
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: DFW
Programs: Marriott Life Titanium, Hilton Diamond, Delta and United Silver, IHG Plat
Posts: 2,890
For me - I've been a Plat on NW since 2005 since rolling over from being a plat on CO due to 50% EQM (in '05 I had to go to GEG a lot and CO doesn't fly there). I've made Plat for next year and Diamond is within reach but I find that this new program is actually a dis-incentive to reach for it. The extra benefits of being a Diamond are either largely useless (restricted SWUs) or ill-defined ('priority' at 5 days for EUA, 'VIP line') or questionable value add (free membership to the downgraded WCs). On the other had the program lets me roll over EQM and with the large difference between Plat and Diamond its almost like a guarantee for Gold if I stop short.
If Diamond was to be worth it, in my eyes it would need:
1. A real EUA upgrade - a 7 day window like US (I guess they are 'best in class' for top level EUA window.)
2. Real SWUs.
3. A companion upgrade comparable to what NW Plats used to get.
4. Upgrade guarantee like what NW Plats used to get.
I'm just not seeing the value add for 50K in EQM.
If Diamond was to be worth it, in my eyes it would need:
1. A real EUA upgrade - a 7 day window like US (I guess they are 'best in class' for top level EUA window.)
2. Real SWUs.
3. A companion upgrade comparable to what NW Plats used to get.
4. Upgrade guarantee like what NW Plats used to get.
I'm just not seeing the value add for 50K in EQM.
Jul 28, 2009, 4:41 pm
#52
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: SEA (previous locations: DTW, TLV, EWR, BOS)
Programs: AS: 75K; DL/NW: Plat; DL SC: Lifetime; Hyatt: Diamond; HH: Gold; SPG: Plat;
Posts: 3,383
Diamond is Rough
I too don't see any benefit in going for Diamond:
Lounge: Already have that with my Lifetime WC membership. Not looking forward to having more people using the lounge, or DL further reducing the food services in the SkyClubs (what, you don't think they'll improve the food there, now that they're giving access for free, do you?)
Y/B/M SWUs: Get Real. I pay for my own travel. If SWU's were redeemable for lower international fares, I would have gone for Diamond. Now, I'll just stick with my 105K.
Unlimited award redeposits: Don't get me started on this one. DL took this benefit away due to 'abuse,' but is bringing it back for Diamonds. How stupid do you think we are, Jeff??? Really?
The new program is highly disappointing, to say the least
Lounge: Already have that with my Lifetime WC membership. Not looking forward to having more people using the lounge, or DL further reducing the food services in the SkyClubs (what, you don't think they'll improve the food there, now that they're giving access for free, do you?)
Y/B/M SWUs: Get Real. I pay for my own travel. If SWU's were redeemable for lower international fares, I would have gone for Diamond. Now, I'll just stick with my 105K.
Unlimited award redeposits: Don't get me started on this one. DL took this benefit away due to 'abuse,' but is bringing it back for Diamonds. How stupid do you think we are, Jeff??? Really?
The new program is highly disappointing, to say the least
Jul 28, 2009, 4:44 pm
#53
Suspended
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 22,778
That's why I did not renew our WC membership (mine and spouse) when it came up for renewal in 2008. Since we were all plats and all of our travel had ben international since 2006, buying WCmember ship was useless to us.
Jul 28, 2009, 4:57 pm
#54
Suspended
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 22,778
Totally agree. The only thing I was looking forward to are the SWU's applicable to any fare, like we did with NW 2008 EEP program. I would have been happy with just 2. I will not be using any of the current PMUs or the new SWU's, as long as they are applicable to a minimum of M fare. Never. With this economy our employers make sure we purchase the cheapest economy fare, so I will never be able to use those certificates.
SWU's redeemable on cheaper fares is the only benefit I am really looking for, and DL does not offer it. I am switching to AA starting 2010, DL blew it completely.
SWU's redeemable on cheaper fares is the only benefit I am really looking for, and DL does not offer it. I am switching to AA starting 2010, DL blew it completely.
I must admit that the PK465s and phantom upgrades spoiled us. I have seen Golds expecting usable SWUs.
That sounds a bit unreasonable.How usable are SWUs issued by AA and UA? I remeber reading on this forum that their SWUs can only be used on higher fares too.
Last edited by Yaatri; Jul 29, 2009 at 6:24 am
Jul 28, 2009, 5:03 pm
#55
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: PDX
Programs: AS MVP, HH Diamond
Posts: 2,564
I'll disagree and say the rollover EQMs are worth less than appear on first blush.
This is massive elitedom inflation, and as a Gold the only incentive to me is to either a. reach Gold again or b. shoot for plat. With all the devaluations and the new Diamond status, Plat ain't what it used to be. A few fee exemptions (but not the biggie: unlimited award changes) is about it. Hardly an incentive. As for requal'ing for Gold, I would figure that on average, the average Gold makes Gold again. The average silver, silver. The average 100k flyer, reaches 100k again. It's intertia. So if I fly 55k EQMs every year, having the 5k bump over to the next year doesn't really help me, as I'll still fly on average 55k EQMs. How exactly does that help me? There's some overall inflation which devalues everyone's benefit, but in terms of core benefits that we used to have, and priority order of upgrades, there's minimal net gain.
My best hope is for a UA bankruptcy or liquidation, with a CO takeover of assets. Otherwise my choices are very grim indeed.
This is massive elitedom inflation, and as a Gold the only incentive to me is to either a. reach Gold again or b. shoot for plat. With all the devaluations and the new Diamond status, Plat ain't what it used to be. A few fee exemptions (but not the biggie: unlimited award changes) is about it. Hardly an incentive. As for requal'ing for Gold, I would figure that on average, the average Gold makes Gold again. The average silver, silver. The average 100k flyer, reaches 100k again. It's intertia. So if I fly 55k EQMs every year, having the 5k bump over to the next year doesn't really help me, as I'll still fly on average 55k EQMs. How exactly does that help me? There's some overall inflation which devalues everyone's benefit, but in terms of core benefits that we used to have, and priority order of upgrades, there's minimal net gain.
My best hope is for a UA bankruptcy or liquidation, with a CO takeover of assets. Otherwise my choices are very grim indeed.
Jul 28, 2009, 5:06 pm
#56
Suspended
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 22,778
Jeff,
How about you let us use 2 upgrades instead of 1 to upgrade a deeply discounted international fare instead of a high priced international fare? We'd burn through our upgrades faster (you win) while we still get a few upgrades (we win.)
Not everyone is a high fare international traveler -- some of us travel on our own dime and don't have the deep pockets to purchase into YBM. And we're the ones that are paying attention, loudest and most loyal.
Nat
How about you let us use 2 upgrades instead of 1 to upgrade a deeply discounted international fare instead of a high priced international fare? We'd burn through our upgrades faster (you win) while we still get a few upgrades (we win.)
Not everyone is a high fare international traveler -- some of us travel on our own dime and don't have the deep pockets to purchase into YBM. And we're the ones that are paying attention, loudest and most loyal.
Nat
Well, I don't think this program is all that bad, that the first few replies should be slams. The SWUs aren't too exciting, to put it mildly, but I really like the bit about the ability to roll over EQMs -- I always have some odd amount left over.
I like this dude's idea:
How about you let us use 2 upgrades instead of 1 to upgrade a deeply discounted international fare instead of a high priced international fare? We'd burn through our upgrades faster (you win) while we still get a few upgrades (we win.)
I would also like to know what happened to priority baggage handling for first class/elites. It was hit or miss on Northwest, but having it sometimes was better than having it no times, as seems to be the case now with Delta.
I like this dude's idea:
How about you let us use 2 upgrades instead of 1 to upgrade a deeply discounted international fare instead of a high priced international fare? We'd burn through our upgrades faster (you win) while we still get a few upgrades (we win.)
I would also like to know what happened to priority baggage handling for first class/elites. It was hit or miss on Northwest, but having it sometimes was better than having it no times, as seems to be the case now with Delta.
As far as using two SWUs in stead of one, you are not suggesting this be allowed for GMs also? As it is there will be an inflation of elites this year.
Jul 28, 2009, 5:39 pm
#57
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: BOS/EAP
Programs: UA 1K, MR LTT, HH Dia, Amex Plat
Posts: 32,358
Companion upgrade is available for all skymiles elites.
http://www.delta.com/skymiles/about_...es_program.jsp
http://www.delta.com/skymiles/about_...es_program.jsp
SWUs
bascially you get the old PE benis but you have to fly 125k instead of 75k
Does DL really think this is going to do it?
Yeah, tons of benis, 95% of them useless junk.
Not sure what to do ... will be @ 103k by the end of the year ....
Jul 28, 2009, 5:58 pm
#58
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: MN
Programs: Lots of programs, dirt on all of them!
Posts: 11,938
Same with 125% bonus miles.
Same (for DL PM's) who used to get free lounge access as PM until about 2 years ago.
DM? Taking most of the 'best in class' taken-away features of platinum of both airlines and now asking you to pony up 50K more MQM for the same benefit!
Jul 28, 2009, 6:01 pm
#59
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Minnetonka, MN, USA
Programs: DL Diamond 2MM, AA ExPlt
Posts: 941
Well, i am a long time NW PE....
I realize this is a business, I do understand this, but I must say I am disappointed. SWE limited to M fares internationaly are worthless (i want to use them for personal travel -- now i'll book M instead of business when traveling on business).
Seems like the old NW benefits were as good (or better) for real FF.
Things got taken away and now reborn as DM.
Rollover is nice, but it really just swells the ranks (as does EQM for other things)...
And the integration I think has really hurt loyal flyers.... system integration issues really are not our fault. I had hoped that given that, they would pull something really exciting out of the hat.
I realize this is a business, I do understand this, but I must say I am disappointed. SWE limited to M fares internationaly are worthless (i want to use them for personal travel -- now i'll book M instead of business when traveling on business).
Seems like the old NW benefits were as good (or better) for real FF.
Things got taken away and now reborn as DM.
Rollover is nice, but it really just swells the ranks (as does EQM for other things)...
And the integration I think has really hurt loyal flyers.... system integration issues really are not our fault. I had hoped that given that, they would pull something really exciting out of the hat.
Jul 28, 2009, 6:28 pm
#60
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Cincinnati, OH
Programs: NW-PE, Blue Star SeaSmiles
Posts: 6,789
Welcome to FlyerTalk Scotty66!
Sorry it took yet another bad Delta day to prompt you to post. DL had the chance to distance itself from the other carriers and failed miserably. The subtractions far exceed the paltry pluses.
Sorry it took yet another bad Delta day to prompt you to post. DL had the chance to distance itself from the other carriers and failed miserably. The subtractions far exceed the paltry pluses.