Probably not.

You know the folks who are receiving the gift, and they know you.

Which means that they are likely to know the salient details about who you are/where you work/etc which a CSR could ask.

I've heard that one way airlines check is to simply as questions about the gifter to the gift recipient.

Another thing you can do to help make the gift appear even more real is to present the itinerary with a Hallmark card that says 'happy anniversary' or 'happy birthday' or 'thanks for being a great employee' and even include your business card. Just to be on the safe side.


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View from the Wing: A blog about Free Miles and Free Markets

I also say probably not because from what I've seen, the "intervention process" starts much earlier then the airport. The suspect tickets are red-flagged by people who specialize in such things-- they don't want to leave it to airport check-in folk to randomly harass users of award tickets, it's not something they are trained for.

Rather, I believe most of the activity happens when a mileage broker is "busted" (sometimes by credit card records or other indications) and the broker either rats out the people who sold him the tickets, or, the airline figures it out themselves by observing ebay auctions, internet ads...flyertalk(?) http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/eek.gif

I give out free tickets to my employees every year, and have never had a problem.

Linda

As I have posted several times when this subject comes up, although I don't know of anyone who has been prosecuted, it is a *criminal* offense in California.

What section of the Calif. Penal Code?

It is also a crime to do all sorts of other things that make no sense---and nobody is every charged or convicted for them.

I wonder how much the airlines paid to Gray Davis for that legislation.

4102003, just curious . . .

- is your posting here at the "suggestion" of AA?

- how many miles where you at risk of losing?

I have lost 35,000 to date (the 15,000 mile penalty has not yet been deducted.) My posting was not at the suggestion, either implicit or express, of the airline. During the second phone call, I did tell the security rep that I had posted my story on a board frequented by people who travel extensively. When she told me about the agreement eBay has with AA, I asked whether it would be okay to mention that information on the board to which I had posted and she said, "Yes."

I found out from a friend today just how true this story is. And, without going into too much detail, AA's monitoring of ebay allows them to make these kind of "seizures" without ever placing a bid or contacting the seller. Suffice to say that AA is taking a great deal of interest in all non-salable AA items being offered for sale on eBay. And-- not surprisingly-- in discussion of this particular incident, right here on FT (Hi guys!) Interesting.

I think one would have to be out of their mind to offer their miles or VIP's on eBay at this juncture. YM(or lack thereof after the sale) MV

4102003, I'm still interested in knowing why you think selling miles "hurts airline employees and other frequent fliers."

Comparing to speeding, I can see the harm to you if you are caught or to yourself or others if you cause an accident. And speeding is even potentially harmul in other ways -- such as potential psychological inflicted on other drivers, passengers, or pedestrians.

But I do not see the harm caused to "employees or other frequent fliers" by you selling your miles. Would you be willing to elaborate?

Maybe AA implanted a chip in his brain that forces him to say that constantly? http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif Give the guy a break-- he's has a tough month, it sounds like.

BTW, I'm about 90% sure I saw an article once where Randy was quoted as having said that the selling of award tickets does harm other frequent flyers due to the limited number of award seats available in the first place and some other factors.

No brain implant, but do recognize that the statement was made in my very first guilt-ridden post. Nevertheless, I still feel that way. I live in St. Louis. It seems that on almost every flight now, there is an announcement that an attendant is taking his or her last flight due to being laid-off. I won't get into how I feel with about the treatment of former TWA employees but it seems that the travel economy has hurt our former TWA employees more than others. As I have reflected on this experience, I do feel bad that by selling the ticket on eBay, I could have contributed to someone losing his or her job because the purchaser did not give the money to the airline. As for other frequent flyers, I could coceive the airlines determining that the only way to control sales would be to limit use by persons other than the FF account holder. That would hurt those people who give away miles to friends, family and employees. I realize these examples are dramatic overtstatements, but it is the way I now feel. I really don't have a stong opinion though either way. I just wanted to warn others. As for the other eBay auctions someone mentioned, last Friday, I sent agentle warning notes to 7 or 8 sellers on eBay of similar items (I did not warn buyers--that's not my place) telling them what happened to me (not at all being judgmental about whether doing it was right or wrong.) Not a single seller cancelled the auction. One thanked me and said he had received several messages similar to mine but then let the auction go to the end. Ironically, the email address from which he responded contained his full name. I sure hope for his sake, he doesn't go through with the sale. I do think the airline waited for me to take that final step of completing the transaction (kind of like how stores wait for a shoplifter to get past that last point of checking-out.) Anyway, I leave for vacation tomorrow (on AA) and remain grateful that I can still accumulate miles (at least I think so.)

[This message has been edited by 4102003 (edited 04-14-2003).]

Originally posted by sbrower: Originally posted by SPN Lifer: Originally posted by Tango: Originally posted by zvezda: Fortunately for the integrity of our legal system -- both from the view of supposedly unenforced laws and cynicism about the lobbying process -- insistent declamations that an urban myth constitiutes a criminal offense, no matter how often repeated or even posted on FlyerTalk, does not somehow enact that personal opinion into law!

There is no California criminal law prohibiting someone from bartering or selling his airline frequent flyer miles. If you will give me a citation to the section of the California Penal Code that putatively criminalizes such conduct, such as for theft of services, I will explain (as an attorney continuously involved with criminal law since beginning law school in 1985) how under the Rule of Lenity and applicable precedent, whatever statute you have in mind cannot be fairly read to apply to the bartering or selling of airline frequent flyer miles.

It is not simply a question of "soft" prosecutors or "merciful" airlines. Bartering or selling airline frequent flyer miles is NOT a criminal offense. I say again, "Bartering or selling airline frequent flyer miles is NOT a criminal offense."

That said, it is indeed a breach of contract to the extent it violates the Terms and Conditions to which you agreed upon joining the program, subjecting you to whatever remedies are provided in those T & C, including not merely forfeiture of all account mileage, but possibly paying full fare for certain tickets already used, attorneys fees, and consequential damages.

InsideFlyer has reported on a federal class action against Delta in the Southern District of New York based on the premise that such restrictions on individual sale create a monopoly for the airline to sell miles, in violation of antitrust laws.
http://www.insideflyer.com/articles/o2.php?key=59

I do not think the ultimate likelihood of success, including any appeal, is high, though I admit that antitrust was not my best subject at law school. On the other hand, Quiet Lion is very optimistic, though I have not heard any particular grounds for this view.

In any event, until or unless such lawsuits succeed, we are bound by the Terms and Conditions we agree to observe, including all civil contract consequences of our own breach through bartering or selling airline frequent flyer miles.

Originally posted by JonNYC:
Can you say "cookies" and "spyware"? If you nevertheless decide to live by the philosophy, "You rate what you can get away with," keep this in mind:

• Crush or delete your cookies!
• Use different e-mail and mailing addresses (without name or identifying characteristics) than what you give to the airlines.
• Don't deal with brokers.
• Don't deal with people you don't know and trust. Verify references if necessary and get addresses and phone numbers.
• If you're going to post prolifically to a bulletin board, disclosing all kinds of information about yourself, be aware that the bulletin board operator, when receiving a subpoena during a lawsuit filed against you by the airline, will be turning over copies of all your posts for the airline's lawyers to examine with a fine-toothed comb.

with this reasoning, if selling of award tickets does harm other frequent flyers, then we should also BAN giving awards to your relatives and friends, since it also hurt our chance of getting an award seat.

an award is meant to be used. Giving award away or selling it meant the same thing in terms of award capacity.