Does a Million Mile Filer Exisit
Sep 15, 2003 | 1:01 pm
#61
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: SJC
Programs: AA 2MM PLT, HH Gold, Marriott Silver
Posts: 619
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by ozstamps:
Anyone care to do the math on what 70 Concorde RT's would COST.
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Anyone care to do the math on what 70 Concorde RT's would COST.
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Sep 16, 2003 | 12:28 am
#62
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: NZ/AUS
Posts: 698
Yes I have flown the 100k in the 2 week period, thats all my holidays were and I spent every one of those days on a flight. especially when you do the same route over and over and over,
divaof travel
The trip is to fly the turnaround, eg ground time is minimal, think of my location also to yourse and how many miles a 1 way AKL-Europe Flight clocks up
Dave
[This message has been edited by MRSTARALLIANCE (edited 09-16-2003).]
[This message has been edited by MRSTARALLIANCE (edited 09-16-2003).]
divaof travel
The trip is to fly the turnaround, eg ground time is minimal, think of my location also to yourse and how many miles a 1 way AKL-Europe Flight clocks up
Dave
[This message has been edited by MRSTARALLIANCE (edited 09-16-2003).]
[This message has been edited by MRSTARALLIANCE (edited 09-16-2003).]
Sep 16, 2003 | 1:53 am
#63
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: California
Programs: AA EXP 5 Mil, UA Global Services, BA Gold, DL Diamond, SPG Plat75, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 1,231
I am surprised that this thread has not died down and resurfaced again. As I already confessed that this is a topic that those I know who flew about 1 M miles a year would never care to respond to. Based on rational logic, I should not be posting here myself - but many of us here enjoy the community and the pleasure of sharing "dark secrets" :-)
divaof travel, I am surprised that having been educated as a scientist you seem so dogmatic. YOu originally asserted the negative based on your own assumptions and reasoning - valid assumptions for majority of the travellers but not for ALL travellers. Rather than re-examine your assertions you dogmatically question those who argued or asserted to the contrary. Remember that for you to be wrong there simply has to be a single instance where your assumptions are invalid whereas for you to be right (no flyer with 1+ M flown miles) every single assumption has to be right.
If you are going to argue based on assumptions then you have to be willing to be countered by alternate assumptions. If you expect "confirmed facts" then be prepared to post some statement by all major airlines that they do NOT have a record of flyers with the habits discussed. There is no onus on one side to prove anything - the onus lies on each side of an argument. If you do not trust the facts relayed by an FTer that is still YOUR opinion - the negative does not become a fact.
I already gave you specific instances that I know where your assumptions were not right (flyers that use airtime for sleep, eat, etc. and do spend majority of work week flying as opposed to in an office or a meeting). These are NOT CEOs but at the same time are senior execs with specific role where "touch" and "pumping hand" is highly valued. They live in parts of world half way or so from the main areas of work and have decided to "sacrifice" a few years of their life for the sake of their career. They realize this is crazy, they did this before the current economic conditions (business rules were very different) and planes were just seen as homes and offices.
To understand the mindset, the following "thought experiment" may help:
- Are there people who fly 1+ million miles on private jets? (The answer that I "know" is a YES). Do they use their planes as homes and offices?
- Are there many who could use private jets more cost effectively but use commercial airlines instead? (this is the tricky question which is answered in the negative by MOST but not ALL - I already know specific instances myself).
- Is it mathematically possible to fly 1+ M miles a year on commercial airlines? (YES, YES, YES - as long as you do not assume it is an 8 hr day flying).
I am truly sorry that I could not increase your comfort level in questioning your assumptions by posting specific names and actual itineraries. Not only am I or others not going to submit notarized "proof" we are likely not even going to reveal sufficient specifics to pinpoint the flyers. I am already afraid that the lurkers at some airlines may already know the people I referenced earlier - I'd be terribly embarassed if my friends or colleagues discovered that I "outed" them.
Please note that if you asserted that no single human being could generate tens of billions of dollars in new value within a year or that there are no self-made billionaires worth tens of billions of dollars you would be factually right upto a time point (was it 1990s) and no one would be willing to post the details. However, a few specific exceptions did occur. I accept statements of their (BG, WB, etc.) networth. Moreover, I have no clue as to the Sultan of Brunei or the underworld (and Forbes/Fortune seem to struggle as well).
Let me add some caveats to my earlier posts - The examples I mentioned may or may not have made all the trips on paid tix (they could have been an ocassional award or complementary flt). As a general rule the tix were company purchased and revenue miles. Secondly, I cannot assert that the exact flt miles were 1M but they are in the ball park.
divaof travel, I am surprised that having been educated as a scientist you seem so dogmatic. YOu originally asserted the negative based on your own assumptions and reasoning - valid assumptions for majority of the travellers but not for ALL travellers. Rather than re-examine your assertions you dogmatically question those who argued or asserted to the contrary. Remember that for you to be wrong there simply has to be a single instance where your assumptions are invalid whereas for you to be right (no flyer with 1+ M flown miles) every single assumption has to be right.
If you are going to argue based on assumptions then you have to be willing to be countered by alternate assumptions. If you expect "confirmed facts" then be prepared to post some statement by all major airlines that they do NOT have a record of flyers with the habits discussed. There is no onus on one side to prove anything - the onus lies on each side of an argument. If you do not trust the facts relayed by an FTer that is still YOUR opinion - the negative does not become a fact.
I already gave you specific instances that I know where your assumptions were not right (flyers that use airtime for sleep, eat, etc. and do spend majority of work week flying as opposed to in an office or a meeting). These are NOT CEOs but at the same time are senior execs with specific role where "touch" and "pumping hand" is highly valued. They live in parts of world half way or so from the main areas of work and have decided to "sacrifice" a few years of their life for the sake of their career. They realize this is crazy, they did this before the current economic conditions (business rules were very different) and planes were just seen as homes and offices.
To understand the mindset, the following "thought experiment" may help:
- Are there people who fly 1+ million miles on private jets? (The answer that I "know" is a YES). Do they use their planes as homes and offices?
- Are there many who could use private jets more cost effectively but use commercial airlines instead? (this is the tricky question which is answered in the negative by MOST but not ALL - I already know specific instances myself).
- Is it mathematically possible to fly 1+ M miles a year on commercial airlines? (YES, YES, YES - as long as you do not assume it is an 8 hr day flying).
I am truly sorry that I could not increase your comfort level in questioning your assumptions by posting specific names and actual itineraries. Not only am I or others not going to submit notarized "proof" we are likely not even going to reveal sufficient specifics to pinpoint the flyers. I am already afraid that the lurkers at some airlines may already know the people I referenced earlier - I'd be terribly embarassed if my friends or colleagues discovered that I "outed" them.
Please note that if you asserted that no single human being could generate tens of billions of dollars in new value within a year or that there are no self-made billionaires worth tens of billions of dollars you would be factually right upto a time point (was it 1990s) and no one would be willing to post the details. However, a few specific exceptions did occur. I accept statements of their (BG, WB, etc.) networth. Moreover, I have no clue as to the Sultan of Brunei or the underworld (and Forbes/Fortune seem to struggle as well).
Let me add some caveats to my earlier posts - The examples I mentioned may or may not have made all the trips on paid tix (they could have been an ocassional award or complementary flt). As a general rule the tix were company purchased and revenue miles. Secondly, I cannot assert that the exact flt miles were 1M but they are in the ball park.
Sep 17, 2003 | 11:02 pm
#64
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 14
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by enjoystravel:
I know friends who have flown Million miles a year - yes base miles. Senior exec of operations with far flung global locations flew practically everyday and always returned home to the family for the weekend.
I also know of others who used to commute weekly from Australia to the US and did US business travel (transcon) as well.
All of them always paid economy and always flew First/Business (complimetary upgrades by the airlines). Crew and airlines knew them well, recognized them with top tier published and unpublished status (Delta, Qantas, United if I recall correctly).
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I know friends who have flown Million miles a year - yes base miles. Senior exec of operations with far flung global locations flew practically everyday and always returned home to the family for the weekend.
I also know of others who used to commute weekly from Australia to the US and did US business travel (transcon) as well.
All of them always paid economy and always flew First/Business (complimetary upgrades by the airlines). Crew and airlines knew them well, recognized them with top tier published and unpublished status (Delta, Qantas, United if I recall correctly).
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Sep 18, 2003 | 1:34 am
#65
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 1,326
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Yes I have flown the 100k in the 2 week period, thats all my holidays were and I spent every one of those days on a flight. especially when you do the same route over and over and over</font>