"Beats me!"

Anyone know? Perhaps the moderators will help out here as well.

Thanks!

I think the long timers have a pretty good idea, however, the newbies don't realy have the feel of how the entire board works.

I think we just have to be patient and deal/overlook messages that are posted in the wrong type of forum.

It does look like the moderators are now taking charge and moving topics that are placed in the wrong forum and moving them to the appropriate ones (note all the topics closed that pop up these days).

Thanks to the moderators!

[This message has been edited by chix (edited 07-22-2001).]

doc,

i think the threads now are too fragmented.
i have no objections "moving" them to the "appropriate" locations. but i would like to avoid checking every single forum.

i would suggest "multiple addressing". i.e. the same thread duplicating in both fora, such as omni is present in both mileage talk and general talk

To attempt to answer the question, lets divide it up a little:

1) Specific mileage earning opportunities will be moved into the respective FFP forum. There simply could be too many "hot" tips for the Buzz to handle.

2) Is it News or Buzz? That's more difficult to decide. If you think it's BuzzWorthy annoucement that affects a large segment of FF's then go with the Buzz.

3) No cross-posting between two forums, we'd like to keep the discussion consolidated into the minimal number of threads.

4) If you have a question where to post, feel free to email us to help sort it out. Otherwise if you post, you may find that it has been moved.

5) If we catch a post that is "posted wrong" and there aren't any or many responses, we may move it without keeping the orgional thread. That is, it will look as if the thread was started in the forum to which we moved it. On the other hand, as you can see by the other locked threads in the Buzz, we posted a message that it was moved before locking it. This is just to give you all more info as to what happened and to direct you to where you can continue the discussion on that particular thread.

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M1

This discussion has taken place before. I think that many of us felt that news of a specific airline's general promotions or bonuses WHICH CAN BE EARNED WITHOUT FLYING THAT AIRLINE ought to still be posted in Buzz. The rationale behind that is that many people would be interested in obtaining the bonus, even if they do not regularly fly the airline. Depending upon the size of the bonus, it could be worthwhile in and of itself (i.e., the NW 10,000 Fly Free Faster promotion, or the Delta/Amex 50,000 mile bonus for the new SkyMiles card) or just to beef up orphan miles in an account for an airline which you don't regularly use (i.e., the quick 500 miles on US Airways for a survey). I personally think all of these deserve some mention (or at least a cross-post mention) in Buzz. Otherwise, one is compelled to read ever one of the very many forums to find these things. The idea of Buzz is FF items of GENERAL interest--i.e., to many people, not just that airline's specific frequent flyers.

Other items, such as a double bonus on an airline's route between LAX and JFK valid until 12/31/2001 ought to be in that airline's specific forum.

I think we ought to be judicious about moving threads to the specific airline fora when they meet the criteria for general interest (or at least we ought to allow a cross-post).

By way of contrast, what do "Celebrity Sightings" (Travel OMNI?), Limo Service in NYC (Travel--NY?), or "Too Happy to be in 1st Class" (Travel OMNI?), the Vietnam Reunification Express (Travel--Asia?), Amazing Passengers (Travel OMNI?), or One Way Car Rental with No Charge (Travel--Airlines, Hotels, Car Rentals?)have to do with FF miles and Points? (They are just a few examples of threads with no relationship to points and miles in Buzz.) These ought to be elsewhere, IMO, not the 500 mile US Airways survey, for example.

Djlawman

[This message has been edited by Djlawman (edited 07-22-2001).]

Thanks for the quick response "M1."

I do think, however, and very strongly so btw, that we all need to be VERY judicious about moving threads to any fora, for whatever reason, period!

As I already noted, along with others:

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/Forum97/HTML/000478.html

Essentially, "OVERmoderation will likely prove to be FAR worse, IMHO, than no moderation!"

Let's please be as moderate as possible in our approach to moderation!

Thanks!

We agree, there currently is a tech issue to be worked out, as some of the above mentioned need to be transferred to that respective FlyerTalk UBB.

i second doc's comment.

this is like free market economy vs central planning.
if people choose to respond to a thread here, that mean they found it convenient to discuss it here for whatever reason. there is only a limited number of forum one would go to (perhaps 3-7, 3-5 for myself).
without moderator, we had already some self-'censorship' among the community by pointing out to fellow posters when the title too far from relevance. and we consciously repond to the relevant only. (as you can see in oneworld vs the oneworld airline fora)

i personally think thread migration by moderator should not be more than 2 per week
if the moderator found that he has to move more than 3, that probably means the reader's definition for that forum is different from his, and i believe we should adhere to the posters' decision.

[This message has been edited by pegasus8228 (edited 07-22-2001).]

Wow!

Just logged on now and noticed all those closed threads! Is FlyerTalk really turning into a facist state now?

I have never liked moderators, probably never will. The fact that there are now moderators - at least to me - makes FlyerTalk much less free and much less for the people, having people control my posts like this is not my idea of a good time...

I'm all for moving threads that don't belong in the Buzz (although moving the USAir survey and AAdvantage car quote threads seem misplaced when there were so many other examples that djlawman highlighted that need to be moved first).

But I have confidence that the moderators will get it right over time. Otherwise, what's to stop every Joe, Larry, Schmoe and Curly from posting anything they want in The Buzz?

How is moving a thread censorship?

I think the new Moderators are doing just fine. Off course, this thread is now off-topic for MilesBuzz and needs to be moved!

[This message has been edited by opus17 (edited 07-22-2001).]

I would agree with those who are concerned about too much movement into specific airline forums. I am one who almost never reads USAir, for example, but I do have some miles there and was very happy to get the 500 miles from the survey. I never would have seen in if it hadn't been posted in the BUZZ. There simply is not enough time for most of us to check every single forum, and yet we would miss out on important mileage/point earning possibilities.

Another example was the recent set of 50K promotions for Hilton. I rarely stay in Hiltons and my HHonors account was doing little or nothing. I wasn't reading the Hilton forum at all. But because someone initially posted the promos in the BUZZ, I got interested, went to the Hilton forum, and participated in those promos.

I agree about the distinction about flight-specific mile offers vs. mile offers that don't require flying. I just filled out the USAirways survey mentioned before, and I would never have seen that because I don't fly US anymore, but have some orphan miles that could use some friends.

The other distinction is that I think it is ok for a 1-post crossreference to something truly fantastic, like the Hilton 50k promotions. I was able to make a vacation happen because of that promo, but since again I hadn't stayed in Hiltons more than once a year, I would not have found it otherwise. But on these posts I agree that the moderator should close the thread after the cross-referencing post.

Well, what if I were to write here, "I have just heared that United Airlines are giving 300.000 miles to everyone taking 10 shuttle-flights in a weekned. Signup with the secret code..."

Then it might suddenly still be buzz.

The problem is that it is all a question of opinion. With moderators only ONE opinion counts: the moderator's. The effect being of course that the future fate of FT will be shaped by a few moderators rather than the people who live here.

It seems to me that for many the definition of what should be in a particular forum can be summarized as "If it interests me, then it should be in the forum, otherwise it belongs somewhere else." My perception is that the forums were broken up because those in this camp were much more vocal than those of us in the "I'll just ignore threads that don't interest me" camp.

(It appears obvious to me that the request for info on a hotel in Dublin was made in "The Buzz" because that's where the action is, and where it's likely to get the best response. Who's going to go to the FlyerTalk Travel forum except someone who's going to ask a question? And then what do you have? A bunch of people asking each other unrelated questions, occaisionally having an answer for one another.

If I don't need the advice, it's not likely I'm going to go there, and probably very few else will either. [I'm certainly not going to hunt through forum after forum, in the slim chance that I might have something to offer, especially if I don't currently have a question. On the other hand, if I see a question in passing as I'm perusing The Buzz, I'll happily jump in if I feel I can assist.] So the forum dies a slow and painful death. And so do the rest of the highly specialized forums, until we're all back at The Buzz, arguing about what belongs and what doesn't.)

The problem for me, as with many others, is that I'm not about to check 60 different forums just because there might be something of interest. What is happening is that each forum is effectively being diluted. And now with "competition" from such boards moremiles.org, that dilution is becoming ever worse. (I'm reminded of a Monty Python skit that begins "And now the news for parrots.")

If I want to see everything or interest (and don't we all) more forums simply makes it harder to find. I thought the previous FlyerTalk structure was close to ideal. Now I have to check two different BBSs, one with 4 major forums, and untold specialty forums.

Frankly, I like the idea of the Buzz being a free for all. The only thing I would request would be better Subject lines. While I'm glad I checked the "Amazing Passengers" thread, I didn't know if it referred to Bill Clinton and Ken Starr having a cordial discussion in seats 1A and 1B or a guy who's been on David Letterman's Stupid Human Tricks 4 times. If it was entitled "Amazing Passengers - Random Acts of Kindness" I could most likely determine immediately if it was of interest to me.

Likewise on the vast array of threads entitled something like "Need advice." My initial reaction to such titles is "get a lawyer" and then to ignore them. If the thread said "How can I escalate a lost baggage claim" I might have something to offer. In short, if you're asking for help, make it easy for us to offer it. Don't offer riddles and 20 questions.

I think we could all take a lesson from Doc's Subject titles. And go easier on the on the specialization.
____________________________________________

While I'm on about it, how 'bout a "Free-for-all" forum, where anything goes and and the forum's description reads "Enter at your own risk." I venture to say that in short order it will out pace all others.

Allow for threads to be posted in the "specific" thread as well as Free-for-all, or if possible, simply have the thread pointer appear in both forums. It would be similar to "Today's Topics" except that you wouldn't miss posts from say 21:00 until 23:59, and if you were gone for a few days you could still get a summary of everything that happened in the last 72 hours or 5 days or 90 minutes or ...

Just thinking aloud. I could be wrong, and often am. But I feel pretty certain about this one. FlyerTalk's astounding success happened because of the huge wealth of valuable information in one place. If we keep making forums more and more specialized then pretty soon we'll be just like the rest of the internet, with a zillion disparate and isolated tidbits of information spread over a wide and unwieldy horizon. The only way to find a substantial cache of useful information will be to do a google search. Especially since the FT search will only allow you to search one forum at a time.

[This message has been edited by Ken hAAmer (edited 07-22-2001).]