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-   -   Miles/Points that Do and Don't Expire (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/milesbuzz/1706167-miles-points-do-dont-expire.html)

sdsearch Jan 2, 2017 11:11 am

Added Malaysia, Garuda Indosian, EVA Air, and Thai, thus completing all the Citi TYP transfer partners.

beltway Jan 2, 2017 3:30 pm

Wiki updated to
  • combine links to relevant FT threads with entries for individual programs (were previously in separate sections)
  • improve readability (bold text for carrier/hotel & program names; add bullet points; eliminate distracting formatting & excess verbiage)
  • update links (e.g., to HHonors T&C)
  • add links internal to the wiki (e.g., from KLM to AF)
I probably missed a few things here & there, but this should be a substantial improvement.

sdsearch Jan 3, 2017 9:32 am

Choice went from hard to soft but expiry period got cut in about half
 
I just realized Choice Privileges (hotel program) was out of date, so I updated it. The reason I kept a summary of how it used to be is because the expiration went from a longer hard one to a shorter soft one.

sdsearch May 20, 2017 8:06 pm

I updated the wiki to add a warning about Air Canada Aeroplan, that despite activity every 12 month resetting expiration, the plan for Air Canada to split from Aeroplan may have long-term implications that relate to expiration, even if they are not technically expiration.

sdsearch Sep 1, 2017 6:58 pm

In the wiki, I added Jet Airways JetPrivilege, and updated Turkish Airlines Miles & Smiles, since Citi TYP has added those two as transfer partners.

sdsearch Nov 13, 2017 8:34 am

I just added Avianca (AV) LifeMiles to the wiki, since it just joined Citi TYP as a redemption partner.

sdsearch Jan 18, 2018 7:21 pm

I updated the wiki for the changes coming to Avianca on April 15: Redeeming will no longer defer (reset) expiration, only earning will. Furthermore, expiration is shortening to 12 months (from 24) except for those with Avianca status or the Avianca credit card.

tangey Feb 28, 2018 3:15 am

Updated the IHG info to re-insert that Gold/Platinum/Spire members points never expire. That seems to have been lost in one of the previous updates.

Not sure I like the change of format, where a substantial number of entries have links to other FT threads/wiki that discuss the individual loyalty systems' expiration. The point of the wiki was to be a one stop definitive source of expiry info.....state the expiry...state how to extend it (if possible)...and point to the T&C of the relevant programme so as those interested can see the formal details. Pointing to other threads that may or may not have good/conflicting/anecdotal information, dilutes the authority of this wiki.

I guess that's the shortcoming of these wikis, a format that has been crowd-sourced and accepted over a few years, can be unilaterally changed.

mahasamatman Mar 1, 2018 10:05 am

Another thing missing from the Wiki is waivers. For example, a co-branded credit card of lifetime status may waive expiration for some programs.

MaxVO Mar 1, 2018 12:03 pm


Originally Posted by mahasamatman (Post 29473361)
Another thing missing from the Wiki is waivers. For example, a co-branded credit card of lifetime status may waive expiration for some programs.

Perhaps you could add what's missing. The current format works fine for me.

sdsearch Aug 17, 2018 8:22 pm

I just updated the wiki (for Flying Blue) as best I could figure out, after learning that Flying Blue has changed their expiration from 20 months to 24 months (2 years), and has added a couple more reset possibilities (current elite status that's high enough, not just lifetime status as before, and some -- but not sure which -- co-branded credit cards).

And that's it for things which reset all miles expiration, but just to make it complicated they added some things that reset the expiration of some miles but not others:

https://www.flyingblue.us/en/faq/cat...ll-about-miles (expand "How long are my miles valid?"):
All your Miles are valid for life as long as you take an eligible flight on Air France, KLM, Joon, HOP!, Aircalin, Kenya Airways, TAROM or other SkyTeam partners at least once every 2 years, or if you're an Elite or Elite Plus member, or if you make a purchase with an eligible co-branded credit card at least once every 2 years. These "Overall extending activities" extend the validity of all Miles 2 years from the date of the activity.

You can also extend the validity of Miles earned with all other partners (airline partners not mentioned above, car rental partners, hotel partners, and experience partners) for 2 years by earning Miles with any of these other partners. These "Partial extending activities" with other partners will extend the validity of Miles earned with any of these other partners by 2 years from the date of the activity. Please note, "Partial extending activities" do not extend the validity of Miles earned from "Overall extending activities".


It's not clear to me, for example, which of the these two categories (if either) miles transferred from a credit card points program fall into.

TanyaHelenaP Feb 11, 2019 7:54 pm

I'm new here so not sure how exactly it works, but I didn't find Finnair here, which should belong to the ones that don't expire!

Mwenenzi Feb 11, 2019 8:04 pm


Originally Posted by TanyaHelenaP (Post 30767075)
I'm new here so not sure how exactly it works, but I didn't find Finnair here, which should belong to the ones that don't expire!

Nope.

From https://www.finnair.com/nl/gb/finnai...air-plus/rules

3.4
Points are valid for 18 months from the latest point activity date (earning or using points). Each activity will pass on the validity date for all the award points for 18 months. Unused award points will expire and get cancelled automatically if there is no point activity within an 18-month period. The expiration date can be found on the members Finnair Plus account on the Internet. Finnair is not obliged to remind members of points due to expire separately. Transferring points between accounts does not affect point expiry date.
No expiry if an eligible activity in 18 months is common to many ffp's
They will expire if you do not have activity

I will add to the wiki when I have a better internet connection

Repooc17 Sep 23, 2019 7:45 pm

I have updated in the Wiki here for Amtrak - from 3 years to 2 years. Per its updated T&C as of April 3, 2019, under "D. Point Expiration":


Subject to these Program Terms and Conditions, points earned under the Program will not expire as long as the Program continues and the Member’s Program account is active. “Active” means that the Member earns and/or redeems Program points using his or her Membership Number within a 24-month period.


https://www.amtrak.com/guestrewards/terms

The linked FT thread in the wiki had already been updated in its own wiki.

sdsearch Nov 16, 2019 8:18 am

Given the news at Doctor of Credit, which I also posted in the linked Etihad forum expiry thread, I updated the Wiki to show that Etihad has just changed from hard to soft expiration.

Mwenenzi Nov 16, 2019 10:01 am


Originally Posted by sdsearch (Post 31743212)
Given the news at Doctor of Credit, which I also posted in the linked Etihad forum expiry thread, I updated the Wiki to show that Etihad has just changed from hard to soft expiration.

EY forum thread here from a few days ago:-- https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/etih...-nov-19-a.html

FlyerTalker324193 Nov 17, 2019 12:08 am

Anybody care to add Shangri-La Golden Circle? I'm not allowed to edit the Wiki.

Shangri-La Golden Circle: End of the calendar year the points were earned plus 2 years hard expiry (item D. i. 8. in T&C).

sdsearch Nov 23, 2019 9:27 am


Originally Posted by 8mh (Post 31745337)
Anybody care to add Shangri-La Golden Circle? I'm not allowed to edit the Wiki.

Shangri-La Golden Circle: End of the calendar year the points were earned plus 2 years hard expiry (item D. i. 8. in T&C).

Thanks. I just added it.

I also noticed Southwest had not yet been moved to non-expiring, so I did so.

Mwenenzi Dec 9, 2019 10:34 pm

Cathay Pacific Asia Miles change for the better
https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/cath...18-months.html

sdsearch Jan 11, 2020 11:49 am

Changes the wiki to update two hotel programs: Hilton just changed from 12 to 15 months, and Accor has changed to a new program ALL with new T&C link and new 365 days (but still requires an eligible stay to reset).

MaxVO Sep 29, 2020 6:05 am

VS Flying Club Changes
 
Virgin Atlantic points (new name) will have no expiration effective 2020/09/24.
Detailed info in FAQ format at this link.

sdsearch Apr 18, 2021 12:09 pm

Updated to show that Hawaiian (HA) miles no longer expire.

gregt90 May 5, 2022 10:18 am

I believe Hilton changed to 24 months on January 1st. Following is from their page. I am trying to check all mine now and this forum is helpful.

Members who do not have eligible activity as defined in a. - d. below in any 24 consecutive month period may be removed from the Program and are subject to forfeiture of all accumulated Points. At the discretion of Hilton Honors, such Members may be permitted to remain in the Program and removed after five years of inactivity. To keep accumulated Hilton Honors Points, the Member must take one of the following actions within a 24 consecutive month period: (a) stay at a hotel within the Hilton Portfolio pursuant to the terms herein; (b) earn Hilton Honors Points through any third party source of Hilton Honors Point accumulation, including a Hilton co-branded credit card, pursuant to its terms; (c) purchase Hilton Honors Points; or, (d) donate Points through The Hilton Honors Giving Back Program.

allianceflyer9506 Mar 22, 2024 11:22 pm

I wonder if Korean Air Skypass miles do expire or not? If not then they should be added into the Don't expire category still have my 18k miles from December 2006-January 2007 JFK-ICN-MNL roundtrip all on Korean Air

Mwenenzi Mar 22, 2024 11:45 pm


Originally Posted by allianceflyer9506 (Post 36102629)
I wonder if Korean Air Skypass miles do expire or not? If not then they should be added into the Don't expire category still have my 18k miles from December 2006-January 2007 JFK-ICN-MNL roundtrip all on Korean Air

https://www.koreanair.com/total-sear...iration%20date

• SKYPASS miles are valid for 10 years.
- Miles are valid until December 31 of the 10th year following their accrual (based on KST).
- Flight miles and partner miles are valid for 10 years from the date of flight and the date of credit respectively.
- Miles earned on/before June 30, 2008 do not expire and are valid for the lifetime of the members.
- The mileage with the shortest remaining validity period is redeemed first. Lifetime mileage with no validity period is used after all mileage with a validity period has been used.
- Miles that are not used before the expiration date will not be carried over.
- Miles for purchasing award tickets or various items should be deducted before the expiration date (regardless of boarding date and use date).

sdsearch Jul 7, 2024 6:24 pm

I saw today at the end of this thread:

https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/alas...need-help.html

that Alaska Airline miles no longer expire, and it provided a link to the section of the terms that state that, so I updated the Wiki above to move Alaska Airlines to the Never Expire section with that link.

Mwenenzi Jul 7, 2024 6:34 pm


Originally Posted by sdsearch (Post 36359410)
I saw today at the end of this thread:
https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/alas...need-help.html

that Alaska Airline miles no longer expire, and it provided a link to the section of the terms that state that, so I updated the Wiki above to move Alaska Airlines to the Never Expire section with that link.

Would not fully agree with that. AS ffp needs activity to keep alive. Many other ffp's have the same activity rule, with a time limit. Often 18, 24 or 36 months.
For this thread "do not expire" means do not expire even when no activity. Like with UA

https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/36348691-post15.html

Account and mileage expiration
Mileage Plan miles do not have an expiration date and may remain in an active account indefinitely, provided that the Mileage Plan program has not been terminated pursuant to these conditions of membership. Activity in an account includes redeeming a Mileage Plan award or accruing mileage in the Alaska Airlines Mileage Plan program.

sdsearch Jul 14, 2024 6:32 pm


Originally Posted by Mwenenzi (Post 36359434)
Would not fully agree with that. AS ffp needs activity to keep alive. Many other ffp's have the same activity rule, with a time limit. Often 18, 24 or 36 months.
For this thread "do not expire" means do not expire even when no activity. Like with UA

https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/36348691-post15.html

Just about every program that has no miles/points expiration has some policy for needing to keep the account alive. That's not unique to Alaska.

And the second quote you included says: "Mileage Plan miles do not have an expiration date and may remain in an active account indefinitely".

So, Alaska no longer needs activity to keep the miles alive, just some unspecified amount of activity to keep the account alive.

And btw, not only the airlines and hotels listed under Never Expire have this kind of no-expiration policy. Some programs, like Marriott for example, have a no-expiration policy just for members with certain level(s) of elite status. But again, you need occasional account activity, it's just not specified how often that has to be, to keep that account alive. But it's certainly activity that's less often than the expiration period for those people who don't qualify for the no-expiration policy.


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