Mar 15, 2020, 10:29 am
Last edit by: Maestro Ramen
FARE RULES:
I pulled down the DL fare rules (these are BUD-SEA but they all appeared nearly identical). I posted them on a share. We can easily grab the AF and KL variants if others need those.
Q: This is a fully flexible fare with free changes. Does that mean I can change the flight dates as I want without paying anything extra?
A: No. The airline simply doesn't charge a change fee. But depending on the fare rules, you will still need to pay the difference to the new price.
Q: But I read that some people could change their flights for free...?
A: The rules for this fare (linked to above) specify that historical pricing shall be used if either at least one flight from the ticket has been taken or the outbound remains the same. In other words, in order to be able to change your flights for free, you must have flown at least one flight from your booking. Otherwise, you can only change the inbound. The outbound has to remain the same or you will be charged the fare difference.
Q: Can I change the rest of the itinerary after flying the first segment without any other charges or additional fare differences?
A: Yes this is possible according to the fare rules where after completing the first segment, you can change the rest of the flights for free (with the condition that the same fare class is available- I-class - in this case. According to the fare rules, after flying the FIRST segment (in the case here BUD-XXX) the historical fare is used. Possible to use the first stopover at AMS or CDG (see post #830).
Q: But some people could change their outbound flights for free!
A: They got lucky. It was probably a bug on the website/in the app. When no flight from the ticket has been flown, the fare rules do not allow changing the outbound without repricing.
Q: Ok, ok, so I can only change the inbound for free. How do I do that?
A: You search for availability for alternative flights on ITA Matrix using "F ..I2FFHU" in the extension codes. You must search for round trip flights as this is a round trip fare. Then you ignore the outbound result (as long as you haven't flown at least one flight from your ticket) and just try to rebook your inbound on the website/app.
Q: I have found availability on ITA Matrix, but the app/website doesn't show me those flights!
A: Keep trying. Sometimes you may have to serach in a different way (split up the searches, e.g. HNL-LAX and LAX-BUD), sometimes you just have to repeat the search several times. But that's no guarantee the desired results will turn up (and without repricing).
Q: It doesn't work. Can I just call the airline to make the changes?
A: Please don't unless you need to. Calling can increase the risk for all of us that they'll change their mind and disallow all further changes, or simply cancel everyone's tickets. However, as this fare has now been running for months and has seen many calls made about it, it is reasonable to expect that calling will not cause issues at this stage. As best practice, avoid attracting attention on the low price paid, and avoid making additional demands or tempting your luck. Remember you get to fly a J ticket for the cost of a Y fare.
Q: How many times can I make changes?
A: In theory, as often as you like, but you can't make more than two changes online/in the app. After that, you'd have to call, which we are trying to avoid.
Q: I've changed my mind. Can I get a refund?
A: Yes, the fare was fully refundable. Just contact the airline or fill out a refund form online.
Q: Due to Coronavirus, I need to extend my travel plan beyond the original expiry date. What can I do?
A: For Delta tickets (starting with 006) you can travel at any point until December 2022. Changes to flights within a 10 month window can be done at any point on the app, following the rules above. If you want to fly later than 10 months from now, you can call Delta and ask them to "park" your ticket. You will receive a ticket number that ties to an eCredit which can be used later to buy tickets. As long as you keep the original itinerary, or if you have flown at least a segment, you will not be charged a fare difference. Bear in mind that the eCredit may only be refundable if your original flight was cancelled (which is very likely in those day and times). Note that only Delta in the US are able to do this so do not call the EU numbers (use Skype to save money on international calls). According to user feedback: iMessage agents seem to also be able to do this, but twitter agents not.
I pulled down the DL fare rules (these are BUD-SEA but they all appeared nearly identical). I posted them on a share. We can easily grab the AF and KL variants if others need those.
Q: This is a fully flexible fare with free changes. Does that mean I can change the flight dates as I want without paying anything extra?
A: No. The airline simply doesn't charge a change fee. But depending on the fare rules, you will still need to pay the difference to the new price.
Q: But I read that some people could change their flights for free...?
A: The rules for this fare (linked to above) specify that historical pricing shall be used if either at least one flight from the ticket has been taken or the outbound remains the same. In other words, in order to be able to change your flights for free, you must have flown at least one flight from your booking. Otherwise, you can only change the inbound. The outbound has to remain the same or you will be charged the fare difference.
Q: Can I change the rest of the itinerary after flying the first segment without any other charges or additional fare differences?
A: Yes this is possible according to the fare rules where after completing the first segment, you can change the rest of the flights for free (with the condition that the same fare class is available- I-class - in this case. According to the fare rules, after flying the FIRST segment (in the case here BUD-XXX) the historical fare is used. Possible to use the first stopover at AMS or CDG (see post #830).
Q: But some people could change their outbound flights for free!
A: They got lucky. It was probably a bug on the website/in the app. When no flight from the ticket has been flown, the fare rules do not allow changing the outbound without repricing.
Q: Ok, ok, so I can only change the inbound for free. How do I do that?
A: You search for availability for alternative flights on ITA Matrix using "F ..I2FFHU" in the extension codes. You must search for round trip flights as this is a round trip fare. Then you ignore the outbound result (as long as you haven't flown at least one flight from your ticket) and just try to rebook your inbound on the website/app.
Q: I have found availability on ITA Matrix, but the app/website doesn't show me those flights!
A: Keep trying. Sometimes you may have to serach in a different way (split up the searches, e.g. HNL-LAX and LAX-BUD), sometimes you just have to repeat the search several times. But that's no guarantee the desired results will turn up (and without repricing).
Q: It doesn't work. Can I just call the airline to make the changes?
A: Please don't unless you need to. Calling can increase the risk for all of us that they'll change their mind and disallow all further changes, or simply cancel everyone's tickets. However, as this fare has now been running for months and has seen many calls made about it, it is reasonable to expect that calling will not cause issues at this stage. As best practice, avoid attracting attention on the low price paid, and avoid making additional demands or tempting your luck. Remember you get to fly a J ticket for the cost of a Y fare.
Q: How many times can I make changes?
A: In theory, as often as you like, but you can't make more than two changes online/in the app. After that, you'd have to call, which we are trying to avoid.
Q: I've changed my mind. Can I get a refund?
A: Yes, the fare was fully refundable. Just contact the airline or fill out a refund form online.
Q: Due to Coronavirus, I need to extend my travel plan beyond the original expiry date. What can I do?
A: For Delta tickets (starting with 006) you can travel at any point until December 2022. Changes to flights within a 10 month window can be done at any point on the app, following the rules above. If you want to fly later than 10 months from now, you can call Delta and ask them to "park" your ticket. You will receive a ticket number that ties to an eCredit which can be used later to buy tickets. As long as you keep the original itinerary, or if you have flown at least a segment, you will not be charged a fare difference. Bear in mind that the eCredit may only be refundable if your original flight was cancelled (which is very likely in those day and times). Note that only Delta in the US are able to do this so do not call the EU numbers (use Skype to save money on international calls). According to user feedback: iMessage agents seem to also be able to do this, but twitter agents not.
{prem fare gone}: AF/KL/DL/VS: BUD-US from $750 R/T
Mar 18, 2020, 5:05 am
#481
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: DXB
Programs: Marriott Titanium Elite, Hyatt Globalist, Hilton Diamond, BA Silver, A3 Gold, Sixt Diamond
Posts: 2,812
To all others who never fly SkyTeam (like me), especially Europeans, why don’t you just credit the flights to VS?
They have cheap longhaul premium awards on ANA and they also have cheap shorthaul awards on KL/AF now (similar to BA).
With Delta, you only hear people complaining that they can never use their miles. And if you don’t live in the US, what is Delta status good for? Sure, you would get some status benefits flying KL/AF, but I thought that’s what you don’t do?
To me, VS is the only program that would make sense.
They have cheap longhaul premium awards on ANA and they also have cheap shorthaul awards on KL/AF now (similar to BA).
With Delta, you only hear people complaining that they can never use their miles. And if you don’t live in the US, what is Delta status good for? Sure, you would get some status benefits flying KL/AF, but I thought that’s what you don’t do?
To me, VS is the only program that would make sense.
Mar 18, 2020, 5:12 am
#482
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: ZRH
Programs: LX-SEN, KL-Gold, BA-Gold, LA-Comodoro
Posts: 94
To all others who never fly SkyTeam (like me), especially Europeans, why don’t you just credit the flights to VS?
They have cheap longhaul premium awards on ANA and they also have cheap shorthaul awards on KL/AF now (similar to BA).
With Delta, you only hear people complaining that they can never use their miles. And if you don’t live in the US, what is Delta status good for? Sure, you would get some status benefits flying KL/AF, but I thought that’s what you don’t do?
To me, VS is the only program that would make sense.
They have cheap longhaul premium awards on ANA and they also have cheap shorthaul awards on KL/AF now (similar to BA).
With Delta, you only hear people complaining that they can never use their miles. And if you don’t live in the US, what is Delta status good for? Sure, you would get some status benefits flying KL/AF, but I thought that’s what you don’t do?
To me, VS is the only program that would make sense.
Mar 18, 2020, 5:20 am
#483
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: Stockholm, Sweden.
Programs: BA, JAL
Posts: 689
Good point, but I am not sure how the earnings would work there with Codeshare flights, as it is stated e.g. for Delta: "As a Flying Club member you can earn on all Delta operated and marketed services". So what would happen to the examples above? AFxxxx op. by DL etc.etc.
Others can correct me.
Mar 18, 2020, 5:36 am
#484
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: AMS
Programs: BAEC Silver, Flying Blue Gold, TK M&S Nobody
Posts: 2,487
To all others who never fly SkyTeam (like me), especially Europeans, why don’t you just credit the flights to VS?
They have cheap longhaul premium awards on ANA and they also have cheap shorthaul awards on KL/AF now (similar to BA).
With Delta, you only hear people complaining that they can never use their miles. And if you don’t live in the US, what is Delta status good for? Sure, you would get some status benefits flying KL/AF, but I thought that’s what you don’t do?
To me, VS is the only program that would make sense.
They have cheap longhaul premium awards on ANA and they also have cheap shorthaul awards on KL/AF now (similar to BA).
With Delta, you only hear people complaining that they can never use their miles. And if you don’t live in the US, what is Delta status good for? Sure, you would get some status benefits flying KL/AF, but I thought that’s what you don’t do?
To me, VS is the only program that would make sense.
Mar 18, 2020, 5:44 am
#485
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: DXB
Programs: Marriott Titanium Elite, Hyatt Globalist, Hilton Diamond, BA Silver, A3 Gold, Sixt Diamond
Posts: 2,812
As far as I’ve read on the VS website, neither the marketing or ticketing should affect the earnings. It’s solely based on the operating carrier, and you earn points for both AF, KL and DL operated flights.
Im actually regretting I credited some flights earlier this year to FlyingBlue, which are points I find very hard to use.
Im actually regretting I credited some flights earlier this year to FlyingBlue, which are points I find very hard to use.
Mar 18, 2020, 7:33 am
#486
Join Date: Mar 2018
Programs: DL DM, FB Gold
Posts: 296
Mar 18, 2020, 7:46 am
#487
Join Date: Aug 2018
Posts: 28
Isn't this a proof that this fare fully works and we do not have to be afraid of cancelling the tickets by the carrier? of course unless something extraordinary happens in relation to Covid, etc. It would be interesting to know if you are able to change the booking after flying the first leg.
Mar 18, 2020, 7:52 am
#488
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: DXB
Programs: Marriott Titanium Elite, Hyatt Globalist, Hilton Diamond, BA Silver, A3 Gold, Sixt Diamond
Posts: 2,812
You must be new to this. No, this isn’t proof of anything.
IF they want to cancel the tickets, it can take them anywhere from 2 days to 6 weeks. And that is during normal times. I guess that in these Co-Vid times, they probably have other things on their minds.
Of course, as long as the tickets aren’t cancelled, they remain valid and everyone can fly.
IF they want to cancel the tickets, it can take them anywhere from 2 days to 6 weeks. And that is during normal times. I guess that in these Co-Vid times, they probably have other things on their minds.
Of course, as long as the tickets aren’t cancelled, they remain valid and everyone can fly.
Mar 18, 2020, 8:04 am
#489
Join Date: Mar 2018
Programs: DL DM, FB Gold
Posts: 296
Isn't this a proof that this fare fully works and we do not have to be afraid of cancelling the tickets by the carrier? of course unless something extraordinary happens in relation to Covid, etc. It would be interesting to know if you are able to change the booking after flying the first leg.
Mar 18, 2020, 8:07 am
#490
Join Date: Aug 2018
Posts: 28
You must be new to this. No, this isn’t proof of anything.
IF they want to cancel the tickets, it can take them anywhere from 2 days to 6 weeks. And that is during normal times. I guess that in these Co-Vid times, they probably have other things on their minds.
Of course, as long as the tickets aren’t cancelled, they remain valid and everyone can fly.
IF they want to cancel the tickets, it can take them anywhere from 2 days to 6 weeks. And that is during normal times. I guess that in these Co-Vid times, they probably have other things on their minds.
Of course, as long as the tickets aren’t cancelled, they remain valid and everyone can fly.
Mar 18, 2020, 8:08 am
#491
Join Date: Mar 2018
Programs: DL DM, FB Gold
Posts: 296
What is the arrangement for the carrier reimbursing out-of-pocket expenses made in reliance upon the ticket? Has anyone actually ever received this reimbursement from an airline? If yes what exactly can you get covered:
- Hotel/rental car booking at your destination
- Airport Hotel the night before travel (e. g. for 6:30am BUD departures)
- Feeder flights to/from the point of departure
...
- Hotel/rental car booking at your destination
- Airport Hotel the night before travel (e. g. for 6:30am BUD departures)
- Feeder flights to/from the point of departure
...
Mar 18, 2020, 8:10 am
#492
Join Date: Mar 2018
Programs: DL DM, FB Gold
Posts: 296
Mar 18, 2020, 8:34 am
#493
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: Stockholm, Sweden.
Programs: BA, JAL
Posts: 689
I've only heard this happen once or twice and tens of thousands of these tickets are flown each year. Typically this has only happened when someone has gone rogue and basically left either on the same day or the day after they have bought this ticket.
Mar 18, 2020, 8:42 am
#494
Join Date: Mar 2018
Programs: DL DM, FB Gold
Posts: 296
I left the next day after buying it. But in case the airline cancels the ticket after it has been partly used I assume you would still receive a full refund? And I guess the airline is not responsible for transporting you back but you could try recovering the cost of a replacement return flight under the DoT provisions for reimbursement of out-of-pocket expenses?
Mar 18, 2020, 8:43 am
#495
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: DXB
Programs: Marriott Titanium Elite, Hyatt Globalist, Hilton Diamond, BA Silver, A3 Gold, Sixt Diamond
Posts: 2,812
This is rare - usually once you have flown, they will let you fly back, too. That’s why some people try to fly such cheap tickets as soon as possible after booking. But yes, it does happen, sometimes they will leave you stranded somewhere, claiming you had abused a “loophole” which rendered your ticket void. And if they cancel the tickets, it can take months to get the money back. So there’s always some risk involved.