jimrpa

That's shocking. I'll be down over Thanksgiving. I'll be sure to ask them what the heck's going on. I'm sure it must be something temporary. Swan and Dolphin have always been tightly integrated with other Disney Resorts. It would be kind of hard to just cut them off.

Edit: Just saw it reported in WDWNT. Well, I guess that means that guests will be walking over to Boardwalk or Yacht Club and catching busses there.

How incredibly stupid.

jimrpa

There aren't any other "non-Disney Hotels on Disney property." Swan and Dolphin are unique in that respect. The buildings are owned by the Tishman Group and there is a complicated 99 year lease Disney gave them. Sheraton, then Starwood, now Marriott manage the hotels. The Bonnet Creek area was never Disney property. I forget the full story, but I believe it was owned by someone who was a holdout from way back when Walt was buying property under the fictitious company names. Either the person wasn't selling, or somehow got wind of what was going on, and decided they wanted more than Walt would pay, so the little parcel just sat. Eventually, whoever developed the WA and Hilton bought the Bonnet Creek property and started developing it. It has nothing to do with Disney. It does have an entrance from internal Disney roads.

Horace

Actually, they're not that unique.

In addition to the WDW Swan, WDW Dolphin, and the new WDW Swan Reserve, there are quite a few other non-Disney hotels on Disney property.

There’s a luxury hotel within Walt Disney World between Disney Springs and Magic Kingdom Park within the “gates” of Walt Disney World:

— Four Seasons Resort Orlando at Walt Disney World Resort

There are six hotels officially on Disney property in the Disney Springs area. These are all officially within the “gates” of Walt Disney World:

— B Resort & Spa Disney Springs Resort Area
— DoubleTree Suites by Hilton Orlando
— Hilton Orlando Buena Vista Palace
— Hilton Orlando Lake Buena Vista
— Holiday Inn Resort Orlando Lake Buena Vista Hotel
— Wyndham Garden Lake Buena Vista

There are also three hotels in Marriott Village on the other side of I-4. The property is part of the 27,000+ acres acquired by Walt Disney before his death in 1966, but has never been branded as part of Walt Disney World:

— Courtyard Orlando Lake Buena Vista
— SpringHill Suites Orlando Lake Buena Vista
— Fairfield Inn & Suites Orlando Lake Buena Vista

On the west side of Walt Disney World, Disney is developing Flamingo Crossings. Despite being on Disney property, Flamingo Crossings is not officially within the “gates” of Walt Disney World. There are currently two hotels open, with four more under construction.

Open at Flamingo Crossings:

— Springhill Suites Orlando at Flamingo Crossings Town Center/Western Entrance
— Towneplace Suites Orlando at Flamingo Crossings Town Center/Western Entrance

Under construction at Flamingo Crossings:

— Residence Inn by Marriott
— Fairfield Inn by Marriott
— Homewood Suites by Hilton
— Home 2 Suites by Hilton

Yes, the hotels and the timeshare at the Bonnet Creek Resort are on property that was never Disney property, even though it’s only accessible through Disney property. The following article is too old to include the new JW Marriott, but it tells the story of the history of the Bonnet Creek Resort:

https://www.yesterland.com/bonnet.html

jimrpa

I totally forgot about the four seasons/golden oaks. I’ve never known what their transportation situation is (I assume they have private cars drive them to backstage entrances whenever they want for what they pay).

I did not know about flamingo crossings, or the land the Marriott village was on. I always thought the hotels on Hotel Plaza Blvd (I think that’s it’s name) in the Disney springs area were expressly not “Disney” in that Disney had no involvement in their development, theming, service offerings, etc, as they did with swan and dolphin. For example, I don’t think those hotels offer character dining (I could be mistaken).

Horace

Before COVID-19, the six hotels at Disney Springs (on Hotel Plaza Blvd.) all offered FastPass+ at 60 days and Extra Magic Hours. The two Hiltons and the Wyndham each offered Disney character breakfasts. Each of the six is an "Official Walt Disney World® Hotel," but specific benefits varied by hotel. It comes down to how much a non-Disney hotel is willing to pay to Disney and what transportation the hotel is willing to provide.

https://disneyspringshotels.com/disney-advantage/

A seventh hotel at Disney Springs is the former TraveLodge / Viscount / Best Western. It was being enlarged and redeveloped as a Drury property. I assume it will open some time in 2021 with Disney benefits similar to the other six Disney Springs hotels.

https://www.druryhotels.com/about/pr...ort-area-hotel

jimrpa

So, to clarify things a bit, I thought it might make sense to go to the source - Disney. Here are the list of hotels Disney considers "Disney Resort Hotels". On the "Places to Stay" tab, they are listed as "Other Select Deluxe Hotels", but they're on the same "Disney Resort Hotels" page as the Grand Floridian and Pop Century. Clearly Disney is placing Swan and Dolphin in a different category than the Residence Inn across I-4
Now, here's something of interest to Marriott people - the JW is NOT listed in the Bonnet Creek area hotels - only the two Hilton properties. That tells me the JW isn't a "good neighbor" of Disney's

writerguyfl

I used to work at the Disney Reservations Center (DRC) at Walt Disney World. Horace did a very good job of explaining many of the different types of accommodations. It's all a bit complicated, mostly due to the fact that there's a mixture of long-term land leases, short-term marketing agreements, and somewhat arbitrary lines that define what's inside/outside Disney property.

One of the reasons why it's hard to understand the differences between the various lodging tiers is that they are not particularly logical. For example, while the Disney Springs Hotels are on Disney property, they are also adjacent Interstate 4. That fact definitely breaks the illusion of being in the "bubble" of Disney World.

In contrast, the original Bonnet Creek Resorts (not including the JW Marriott Bonnet Creek) are not on Disney property but feel like they are due to their location and landscaping.

cfabar1

When can I start booking this property? Having always been a fan of the Swan and Dolphin, I am very excited to see this new iteration of Disney Resort through Marriott take place!

writerguyfl

Everything I've read just says Summer 2021. For example, that's what this article from 2.5 weeks ago says.

First look at the progress of new Walt Disney World Swan Reserve (clickorlando.com)

Given the lack of demand...particularly lack of demand for business meetings/conventions, which is the reason why this hotel is being built...I can't imagine they are rushing to open.

Frankly, I wouldn't be surprised to see the opening date pushed into next fall or later. Hiring a staff to service a mostly-empty hotel wouldn't be smart. Until the meetings market returns and/or theme park visitor demand returns to normal, this new hotel will likely stay closed.

cfabar1

That’s unfortunate. I guess I will stay at the Dolphin or the Swan instead then.

Nuhusky

The reserve now has a website

https://swandolphin.com/swanreserve/

first look pictures inside including rooms
https://chipandco.com/photos-first-l...AK8Dv-tI5Fi2j8

cfabar1

We are getting closer! Very exciting...

Hoping with the addition of the third hotel they may move to allowing pets at one of these properties. You can bring dogs to select Disney hotels. Time to add this to the Swan/Dolphin/Cove properties.

Nuhusky

They did update site to now say summer 2021, I do think that could push to 2022 if the industry does not rebound.

im torn on the animal in rooms though and I have dogs. I do think the reserve rooms like nicer with higher end fixtures vs either swan or dolphin.

Horace

Official Marriott.com website for Walt Disney World Swan Reserve, Autograph Collection: https://www.marriott.com/hotels/trav...ph-collection/

Until any new hotel actually opens, there's always a chance of the date slipping.

That being said, I don't see why WDW Swan Reserve would be postponed to 2022. The parks are open. There's pent-up demand from families who have postponed their 2020 vacations. COVID-19 vaccinations have started, with the expectation that things should be much better in the second half of 2021 (though probably not completely the same as "pre-COVID"). And, presumably, the Swan-Dolphin sales department is selling convention space for the second half of 2021 with the Swan Reserve being one of the selling features.

Nuhusky

Site now says July 2021 opening. We shall see if date holds but perhaps safe to say hotel will open this year

also a cat 6 property, same as both swan, JW and dolphin hotels.