Jan 14, 2019, 1:21 am
Last edit by: margarita girl
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The St. Regis Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia [Master Thread]
Jun 18, 2016, 9:27 pm
#61
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 1
the environment that St Regis KL is operating in will dictate its pricing.
have read thru all the inputs from numerous contributors, i feel i need to chime in my 2 bits on this particular property as one who knows the hospitality sector in asia extremely well, with no less than 30 years of experience dealing with various facets of it.
the malaysian hospitality sector is priced very competitively with the rest of the hotels in the region because it has to, otherwise, there is not much it can sell itself. it does not have real attractions to bring tourists into the country, esp in a city like kl - other than the normal run of the mill "attractions" - high rises, shopping etc. the attractions for people visiting msia is in the other peripherals of kl - in places like penang, malacca, borneo, east coast of msia etc. people from spore do visit kl on their shopping trips and they r the ones that will be one of the primary targets of 5 star hotels in kl.
the main competitor in the region, city-wise is bangkok and to a certain extend, jakarta. bangkok has much better value offerings than kl, much better service based culture and much more western friendly offerings and its staffed by locals. thus it has come to pricing where msian hotels will have to compete on.
if u look carefully at the 5 star hotels in kl, there is a undeniable trend of hiring foreigners to work at the hotels - and i do not mean highly qualified and professional foreign employees. these r untrained or semi trained people from places like burma, bangladesh, india and nepal. they r the ones usually manning the back room operations - housekeeping, general hotel upkeep, waitressing - the nitty gritty part of making a hotel spick and span. areas where the guests will feel the service, the offering and the value proposition..
even management has been outsourced with hirees from india appearing over the past 5 years or so. grand hyatt for example has a whole slew of non malaysians (indians) in their management team. only the most senior personnel there has much international experience, the rest are pretty junior.
the reason why all this is happening is due to the very stark fact that locals do not and will not want to take up these jobs as they think its beyond them to work in such establishments and their thought of it paying low wages. and those that takes it up, most of them do not have the aptitude to do well and be professional at it.
ask any gm of any 5 star hotels in msia off the record and they will tell u that.
thus, with all these lack of training and not the most brightest of the lot of foreign workers taking up most of the jobs in the hospitality sector in msia, what can one expect from the level of service? service at msian hotels are nowhere close or even comparable to bangkok. to compete, pricing is critical for msia. foreign workers will not provide top level services.
and even the locals that staffed places that has more local employees r not the most professional and many r hired because of the national policy that requires hotels to hire a certain amount of malays in the company.
st regis kl thinks it can price itself as the top of the heap player in terms of pricing with a first market international cosmopolitan hotel pricing level. they r just kidding themselves. the reality of the market will show them they will not be able to do it. unless they and the owner of the building is willing to take losses year in and year out with 30 to 50% occupancy levels.
us$260 for a entry level room in msia in 2016 is laughable at best. coupled with the low level of service and professionalism, its a joke thats not even funny. kl is not spore, not hk, not tokyo, not sydney, not osaka - they have to know where they stand in the totem pole in terms of spending power.
how many foreign travelers to msia would want to stay at a us$260/nite hotel when its located in a spot with little to no attractions, in a highly congested area when they can stay at a prime location (grand hyatt, mandarin oriental, shangrila) for us$170 or less?
maybe the corporate traveler with a biz expense account that has biz dealings with the occupants of the buildings next to the st regis. even then, its minimal as there's the hilton and le meridien close by.
thus st regis is shooting for the moon, but sooner or later, they will have to land on terra firma, after not getting the yields that the so call "billionaire" owner wants.
speaking about this "billionaire" owner - there's another "billionaire" owner just down the road - yeoh tiong lay of the ytl group that owns the majestic hotel, another hotel with huge aspirations and now has to deal with reality.
no owner of any biz is willing to lose money in the long run - the argument that chua ma yu (who owns the st regis building) will let the earnings garnered from selling apartments in the same building to support the losses from st regis is just preposterous. and for the information of those thats not in the know, the apts r not selling like hotcakes and there's tons of availability due to the local economic slowdown and lack of funding for speculation.
all in all, st regis kl is gonna have a tough time keeping its rates at a minimum of us$260/nite for its basic rooms. they most likely will be able to price it around 10 to 20% higher than the grand hyatt kl at best. might even be at parity to grand hyatt kl after a while.
teething problems are expected at all hotel openings, but its a guaranteed event in the msian hospitality sector as its woefully lacking in capable personnels in running a 5 star hotels.
and if chua ma yu is not worried in losing money, he wouldn't be pushing starwood to open the hotel in such an rushed manner, when less than 30% of the rooms r ready for sale, coupled with all the unfinished work, inside and outside of the building itself.
given a choice, starwood would not and should not have commenced operations at this stage of the building's completeness.
the malaysian hospitality sector is priced very competitively with the rest of the hotels in the region because it has to, otherwise, there is not much it can sell itself. it does not have real attractions to bring tourists into the country, esp in a city like kl - other than the normal run of the mill "attractions" - high rises, shopping etc. the attractions for people visiting msia is in the other peripherals of kl - in places like penang, malacca, borneo, east coast of msia etc. people from spore do visit kl on their shopping trips and they r the ones that will be one of the primary targets of 5 star hotels in kl.
the main competitor in the region, city-wise is bangkok and to a certain extend, jakarta. bangkok has much better value offerings than kl, much better service based culture and much more western friendly offerings and its staffed by locals. thus it has come to pricing where msian hotels will have to compete on.
if u look carefully at the 5 star hotels in kl, there is a undeniable trend of hiring foreigners to work at the hotels - and i do not mean highly qualified and professional foreign employees. these r untrained or semi trained people from places like burma, bangladesh, india and nepal. they r the ones usually manning the back room operations - housekeeping, general hotel upkeep, waitressing - the nitty gritty part of making a hotel spick and span. areas where the guests will feel the service, the offering and the value proposition..
even management has been outsourced with hirees from india appearing over the past 5 years or so. grand hyatt for example has a whole slew of non malaysians (indians) in their management team. only the most senior personnel there has much international experience, the rest are pretty junior.
the reason why all this is happening is due to the very stark fact that locals do not and will not want to take up these jobs as they think its beyond them to work in such establishments and their thought of it paying low wages. and those that takes it up, most of them do not have the aptitude to do well and be professional at it.
ask any gm of any 5 star hotels in msia off the record and they will tell u that.
thus, with all these lack of training and not the most brightest of the lot of foreign workers taking up most of the jobs in the hospitality sector in msia, what can one expect from the level of service? service at msian hotels are nowhere close or even comparable to bangkok. to compete, pricing is critical for msia. foreign workers will not provide top level services.
and even the locals that staffed places that has more local employees r not the most professional and many r hired because of the national policy that requires hotels to hire a certain amount of malays in the company.
st regis kl thinks it can price itself as the top of the heap player in terms of pricing with a first market international cosmopolitan hotel pricing level. they r just kidding themselves. the reality of the market will show them they will not be able to do it. unless they and the owner of the building is willing to take losses year in and year out with 30 to 50% occupancy levels.
us$260 for a entry level room in msia in 2016 is laughable at best. coupled with the low level of service and professionalism, its a joke thats not even funny. kl is not spore, not hk, not tokyo, not sydney, not osaka - they have to know where they stand in the totem pole in terms of spending power.
how many foreign travelers to msia would want to stay at a us$260/nite hotel when its located in a spot with little to no attractions, in a highly congested area when they can stay at a prime location (grand hyatt, mandarin oriental, shangrila) for us$170 or less?
maybe the corporate traveler with a biz expense account that has biz dealings with the occupants of the buildings next to the st regis. even then, its minimal as there's the hilton and le meridien close by.
thus st regis is shooting for the moon, but sooner or later, they will have to land on terra firma, after not getting the yields that the so call "billionaire" owner wants.
speaking about this "billionaire" owner - there's another "billionaire" owner just down the road - yeoh tiong lay of the ytl group that owns the majestic hotel, another hotel with huge aspirations and now has to deal with reality.
no owner of any biz is willing to lose money in the long run - the argument that chua ma yu (who owns the st regis building) will let the earnings garnered from selling apartments in the same building to support the losses from st regis is just preposterous. and for the information of those thats not in the know, the apts r not selling like hotcakes and there's tons of availability due to the local economic slowdown and lack of funding for speculation.
all in all, st regis kl is gonna have a tough time keeping its rates at a minimum of us$260/nite for its basic rooms. they most likely will be able to price it around 10 to 20% higher than the grand hyatt kl at best. might even be at parity to grand hyatt kl after a while.
teething problems are expected at all hotel openings, but its a guaranteed event in the msian hospitality sector as its woefully lacking in capable personnels in running a 5 star hotels.
and if chua ma yu is not worried in losing money, he wouldn't be pushing starwood to open the hotel in such an rushed manner, when less than 30% of the rooms r ready for sale, coupled with all the unfinished work, inside and outside of the building itself.
given a choice, starwood would not and should not have commenced operations at this stage of the building's completeness.
Jun 19, 2016, 9:56 am
#62
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: LUX
Programs: LH SEN, BA Silver, HH SILVER, Bonvoy PLAT, A/club PLAT, Hyatt Diamond
Posts: 838
Great comments ^
Jun 19, 2016, 9:45 pm
#63
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Bangkok
Programs: Marriott Bonvoy Titanium, BAEC Silver, TK Miles & Smiles Elite
Posts: 2,210
The idea that a Malaysian Chinese property owner will put up with the losses associated with rampant under-occupancy for prestige is indeed laughable. He is more likely to go round turning off lights in empty floors to save on the electricity bill.
Your assessment of rates and what drives them and the nature of the service industry in KL is also entirely correct.
You are almost-certainly correct that the owner forced Anne Scott to open when the hotel wasn't ready so he could get the cash flowing.
Given the location at KL Sentral, and the imminent (in hotel terms - I know it's a while away) arrival of a Four Seasons in a significantly better location at KLCC I predict the rates here will plummet.
Jun 20, 2016, 10:54 pm
#66
Join Date: Mar 2012
Programs: Marriott & SPG Plat, HH Diamond, Accor Plat, ex-Fairmont Plat, ex-Swissotel Eleva
Posts: 710
Thanks for your valuable insights, I agree with your viewpoints generally. One of the important point is, St Regis KL is not likely to be able to find talents to staff the entire hotel and make their service levels belonging to another planet. Early feedback has shown that the service is not dissimilar to other 5 star hotels in KL. It is hard to justify this sort of premium they are expecting.
I think a few hardcore St Regis supporters here are optimistic that by just having that St Regis brand, people will pay any price to stay there, but i think the majority will find the pricing way over the top.
The general consensus here which should be a good feedback to both SPG and St Regis KL alike; I think St Regis KL could be more realistic in their pricing. Cat 6 and over 1000 MYR nightly does look like a huge ask.
But I guess red ink needs to be spilled first before we see adjustments.
Jun 21, 2016, 5:53 am
#68
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Seat 2A
Programs: AA EXP LT GLD 1MM, BA GLD, NH/UA*G, Hyatt Dia, Marr Tit LT PLT, IHG Spire,HH Dia, MGM NOIR,Hertz PC
Posts: 10,571
This is the room they gave you for 1100 MYR ++ ???
Not sure why someone would wanna stay there unless they need a representative hotel in this area to conduct business at.
I stick to my earlier assessment that the hotel is at least 500 MYR overpriced and can't see them gaining any ground in the long run unless the rates go down and they slowly start to build up a customer base. Many if not most 5* hotel guests going to KL are frequent visitors and it's hard to siphon off loyal guests from other hotels.
Not sure why someone would wanna stay there unless they need a representative hotel in this area to conduct business at.
I stick to my earlier assessment that the hotel is at least 500 MYR overpriced and can't see them gaining any ground in the long run unless the rates go down and they slowly start to build up a customer base. Many if not most 5* hotel guests going to KL are frequent visitors and it's hard to siphon off loyal guests from other hotels.
Jun 21, 2016, 6:50 pm
#69
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 573
Just now have confirmation for LM KL Central with price 58EUR for stop over I don't need anything more.
Jun 22, 2016, 5:02 am
#71
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 573
I am in heaven, heaven ... or maybe not ??
But GM Anne Scott see this in different way :
' ...new reasons for you to visit The St. Regis again – including the upcoming opening of Crystal Rooftop Bar, the Swimming pool and our 1000sqm state-of-the-art Iridium Spa. In the event that you would reconsider trying our hotel,...'
' ...new reasons for you to visit The St. Regis again – including the upcoming opening of Crystal Rooftop Bar, the Swimming pool and our 1000sqm state-of-the-art Iridium Spa. In the event that you would reconsider trying our hotel,...'
Jul 1, 2016, 11:13 pm
#73
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: LUX
Programs: LH SEN, BA Silver, HH SILVER, Bonvoy PLAT, A/club PLAT, Hyatt Diamond
Posts: 838
No answer.
Mails was resent on May 17th.
Still no answer
I gave up and booked two rooms at the Hyatt
Jul 10, 2016, 10:01 pm
#75
Original Poster
Join Date: Jan 2014
Programs: AA Exec Plat; SPG Gold; Hyatt Diamond; Hilton Diamond; IHG Plat Ambassador
Posts: 79
MO recently released their 2015 performance:
https://photos.mandarinoriental.com/...nnualOperating
MO KL is clearly the weakest amongst them - 2nd lowest occupancy at 48% (BKK is 47%, but it went up from 41; while KL dropped from 63); lowest average room rate ($173) and RevPAR ($83).
I would be surprised if Hyatt KL has a slightly better occupancy rate but similar average room rates and RevPAR.
Lets see how long StR KL can last with their prices
https://photos.mandarinoriental.com/...nnualOperating
MO KL is clearly the weakest amongst them - 2nd lowest occupancy at 48% (BKK is 47%, but it went up from 41; while KL dropped from 63); lowest average room rate ($173) and RevPAR ($83).
I would be surprised if Hyatt KL has a slightly better occupancy rate but similar average room rates and RevPAR.
Lets see how long StR KL can last with their prices