LHR/MEL/Europe FF

hi all

just a quick note to let you know that freeduty is now taking the liberty of doing dynamic currency conversions - no questions asked, and no opportunity to opt out.

I travel to HKG frequently (at least once a month) and this is the first time I have seen it and was caught out.

Only noticed it on my cc statement - and when I checked the cc receipt sure enought there were the magic 'I have been given the options... etc etc etc'

Of course I hadn't, and the conversion (to AUD) was nicely hidden well below the HKD amount.

Shame on you freeduty hk

Calls to the supervisor at the airport only yielded a 'please email us' (although possibly due to the language barrier).

My bank on the other hand is happy to assist with a full charge back in the event they don't help me.

Guy Betsy

Just above where you sign, there are 2 little boxes you should be aware of.... one is the rate in HKD, and the other is another box in your home currency. always remember to tick the one on the left in HKD.

I think when converted, the HKD rate is better than what the converted rate is !

christep

Going off at a tangent, I'm curious what it is that you buy at HK airport that is cheaper than simply buying it in town? In my experience everything at the airport is more expensive, often significantly more so.

(I guess tobacco might be an exception - I've never looked at that)

LHR/MEL/Europe FF

indeed it was tobacco!

Guy betsy - I looked at the receipt again - no check boxes... (which is the same as it is in China - they rely that you were verbally offered a choice).

I am used to saying in China 'please bill in rmb' - now will have to do the same in HK.

just very sneaky the way they have introduced this and I expected better of HK airport.

Steve M

That will likely get you very strange looks indeed!

LHR/MEL/Europe FF

percysmith

Woah non-compliant DCC in HK?

HK DCC (and banking generally) runs differently from China.

Can you post a image of the HK Duty Free card slip pls, like http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/china...on-21.html#307 ? I wanna figure out which HK bank is HK Duty Free's acquirer.

Whilst in China there's no-one who gives a damn if (acquirer) banks run amok, in HK it's pretty easy to screw both the merchant (HK Tourism Board) and the bank (HK Monetary Authority (our Reserve Bank) and HK Consumer Council). Companies maltreating tourists does get in the news.

So let's try and identify the HK bank involved and screw it. As well as HK Duty Free no doubt.


Incidentally, which Australian card issuer have you got? I used to live in Syd (and my brother's still there), interested to konw which bank is so happy to give out refunds?

LHR/MEL/Europe FF

I am with 28 Degrees Mastercard (issued by GE Capital).

I have emailed the vendor to see what steps they are proposing to rectify.

I will also work on scanning the receipt. Will need to track it down and remove cc details. Will post when I can.

percysmith

Theft! Robbery! In my home town, not accross the border!

A couples of mates come over from Syd for Queen's Birthday holiday and we were shopping in Wanchai Computer Centre. I'll name the shop involved - MAGIC MEDIA located in Shop 108 Wanchai Computer Centre http://www.hkgolden.com/trade/detail...DIA&shoptype=S

We weren't even supposed to be looking for games. But my mates were taking advantage of the HK$8/AUD exchange rate and spending way beyond what's sensible.

They selected a copy of Shogun Total War 2 each and tried to pay. One of my mates took out a NAB Qantas Amex - I shook my head but told him he could try, I reckon he'll be slapped with a surcharge and will offer to pay cash instead (I had the HKD cash to stake him).

The shopkeeper looked at it and asked for a Visa in English - I guess he figured out this was a foreign card and he was a visitor. No surcharge or anything else was mentioned. My mate took out the NAB Qantas Visa that came with the Amex and the shopkeeper used the EMV chip.

It's a dot-matrix slip printer and cos it's HK I know how long it should take to print a normal slip. I didn't even need to see the slip before I was waving my arms and yelling with a boom voice that verbage was being printed. If my other mate wasn't in the way I would've snatched the slip, forked over cash and demanded a reversal. As if to slap me down (my mates have heard me drone on about DCC repeatedly when we were in PRC) my mate signed the slip and handed it back to the GRINNING, cheeky shopkeeper.

I only got to see the slip for a slip of a second. It's a standard no-brand Artone slip with verbage looking suspiciously like BoC China's. I believe I couldn't figure out which bank even if I had taken a copy of the slip - only my mate can through NAB.

The Magic Media shopkeeper did not ask for any DCC input nor did I see him key in anything other than the amount. I wasn't close enough to see the screen.

The paying mate wouldn't let me see the slip cos he thinks I'm too obsessed about credit cards than what is healthy for me. But from the other mate I learnt he paid AUD88.72 for a HKD700 purchase.

On Saturday morning (after a hell of a night in LKF), he got cash from Pedder Street Citibank using his Australian Citibank card for $8.06 (AUD$0.1241/HKD). The Magic Media DCC rate is $7.90 (AUD$0.1276/HKD) - a 2.15% scalp.

Yes, $15 is nothing. It's just here in HK - HKSAR -AS BAD AS CHINA!!!

And in Magic Media's case, I have a very strong suspicion that the shopkeeper is in cahoots with the bank. I expected to be stuck with a surcharge (which might be 2-3%) from the shopkeeper which I would've thought legitimate even though I wouldn't have paid it - but instead he's recovering his interchange costs underhandedly.

LHR/MEL/Europe FF

just an update on this.

contacted hk freeduty and they offered to void the charge and recharge me, but only if I sent them my credit card details by email. they kept insisting (using traveled rates available at the airport) that the new charge would actually work out more! (we eventually resolved that issue).

they did however admit liability, and spoke with the assistant who supposedly confirmed she did not offer the choice of currency.

my bank agreed to do a chargeback, however I said to free duty that this would then leave them out of pocket, and I would not pursue the claim. I also mentioned that I would check with my friends and colleagues to monitor the use of dcc at hkia, and if this becomes the norm (without offering an option) that I would notify the authorities.

I think they have taken this on board, and the seemed genuine about it.

percysmith

After today's experience at Magic Media (above), I'm starting to suspect you didn't have a choice (if you found the Duty Free HK slip please post it up).

But besides pursuing Duty Free HK (which you rightly did) or charging back the transaction (which Wizard would've underservedly absorbed), you could've pursued Duty Free HK's bank with HK Monetary Authority - you just need Wizard to identify the acquirer and start the complaints process with the HKMA http://www.info.gov.hk/hkma/eng/consumer/cust_b.htm . This hurts the bank stealing your money, without unnecessarily hurting your issuer (Wizard). The HKMA doesn't always take the consumers side but does cause banks some pain.

My mate refused to even reverse his transaction so he won't go down the HKMA path.

nacho

Wow, you actually went through all this for HKD 15? I hope everyone is like you including Mr. Nacho. We usually use cash or EPS when we are in HK, so we don't have the DCC issue there. We did get robbed by Ross Dress for Less in the US using our Danish credit card. I wasn't given a choice of currency (I always check the screen before signing anything) and then robbed by DCC (it was 3%) vs our bank 1%. Mr. Nacho refused to do charge back or contact Ross for it

Avis France did the automatic DCC to us too, we got a copy of our rental contract that we deliberately refused the DCC, and they still billed us the wrong currency and no refund was given (fortunately they double refunded us the wrong charge so it covered the DCC so we don't have to initate a charge back).

There are more and more places that offer DCC - not just in HKG but anywhere, sometimes you get to choose and sometimes you don't.

LHR/MEL/Europe FF

It's the principle - in my case it was even less. But the currency conversion was 5 per cent against me... if more merchants think they can get away with this it will start to add up.

percysmith

If you had a HK Visa card, we get 4X miles from our banks (namely Fubon Bank (HK)) for non-DCC foreign currency transactions. The DCC merchants are robbing our miles - I think we care don't we?

nacho

I totally agree with you, I would fight if it was solely me. Yes, if everyone turn down the DCC option when they pay or fight with their banks or merchants after they paid with DCC without choice, then I think this scam will probably be over sometimes. Unfortunately time cost can be high for people like Mr. Nacho - he'd rather let them take his money because he can earn it faster back by going to work