NLpio

Two weekends ago, I rented car in Dublin airport with Hertz (actually a franchise called Ryan's Investments). I had reserved with my Amex Platinum and was given a rate of €51 for three days (actually slightly more expensive that the competition but I wanted to earn some points). When I got there, I declined all insurance, as usual, but I hit a new charge that I've never seen before: A Supplementary Liability Waiver. They also insisted on a €5000 deposit and told me I was liable for the full value of the car. I called Amex at the desk and they assured me that I was covered for the value of the car up to €75000 (it was a Ford Fiesta so unless it was diamond encrusted there was no way it would top €15k).

I can't find this additional charge on their website, although they claimed it was there. Obviously, it's not the amount of money, but the principle of the bait/switch that annoyed me. In any case, I had three options at the time:

1. pay €17 per day for CDW/LDW;
2. pay €7 + tax per day for SLW, or
3. pay €65 for a no show fee.

I went with the cheapest option and I've disputed the extra charge (i.e. approx €24) with Amex (who are dealing with it) and I'm complaining to the EU car rental dispute organisation (ECRCS).

What I'm wondering:

• Will I end up on the DNR list with Hertz (not too worried as I'm angry with them and not planning to use them again)?
• Will there be any other consequences for the chargeback? Amex told me that I didn't need to submit any additional information but if Hertz disputed it, there might be a need in the future.
• Is there any way to complain to Hertz corporate regarding their franchise's actions? Should I complain somewhere else?
• Has anyone else had this experience? Is this a uniquely DUB problem?

Thanks for any advice!

AutoSlash

It would be very unlikely for you to end up on Hertz's DNR list because this is a franchise. It's essentially operated like a separate business from other corporate-owned Hertz entities.

Note that if you book at Hetrz.com this is disclosed in the terms and conditions at the time of booking:

Dave Noble

This is a charge that is in Hertz's terms for Ireland. From https://www.hertz.ie/rentacar/reservation/reviewmodifycancel/templates/rentalTerms.jsp?KEYWORD=CDW&EOAG=WATE61

Given that this is a documented charge, I cannot see much chance of a dispute having any success ; the security deposit is also a listed item

This doesn't seem unique to Hertz ; EUR5000 deposit and a EUR30 fee applies with Avis if choosing not to take CDW ( https://www.avis.ie/media/filer_publ...conditions.pdf )

Some checks online suggest that a fee is not uncommon

NLpio

Thanks for the replies - it looks like I missed it (I did search their TOC and didn't see it). I have found it now - under CDW Insurance and you scroll all of the way down - I didn't notice that there was more than one scroll. I don't understand why they don't have it in their detailed TOC either (https://images.hertz.com/pdfs/RT_FULL_IE_EN.pdf).

You live and learn. Thanks again for the education!

Flying12345

Hertz stung me for €70 on a 10 day reservation at Dublin last week. There is absolutely no mention of this on my confirmation email which I have pasted below. Given the length of the terms and conditions, and the numerous references to if you have no TP or CDW you have to give the €5k deposit, I struggle to see how it is legal from them to withhold this detail from me, and there is no link to the CDW terms that are referenced in the messages above. There is no possible way I could have rented the car for the quoted price and I don’t see how I could possibly have foreseen it, even reading the confirmation email and terms extensively as I did.

Am I missing something in the terms from the email? I can’t find any mention or reference to read terms and conditions that would allow me to see the SLW charge. The email appears self contained unless you are under 25.

Is it worth me disputing with Amex?



‘amount to be paid at time of rental €126.55’

• For renters under 25 years of age, check policy for exceptions
• Minimum Age 25 outside US - Exceptions may apply
• Gold Service Confirmed - Please provide flight details.
• THE MAXIMUM RENTAL AGE IS 75 YEARS
• Please check driving restrictions for touring Europe
• RATE MAY BE SUBJECT TO VERIFICATION OF ID
• Mobile Gold Alerts are available at this location.

Insurance Requirements and Pre-authorisation of Credit
If you do not take Collision Damage Waiver (CDW) & Theft Protection (TP) we will require a copy of your insurance policy and/or documentation from your credit card company stating clearly that coverage is provided in Ireland.
Credit Cards/Debit Cards
Hertz accepts American Express, MasterCard, Carte Blanche, Visa, Diners Club, Discover, JCB, China Union Pay and some debit cards. We may place an authorized hold on your credit/debit card to cover the estimated rental charges plus up to USD 200.00 for any additional charges that may be incurred. These funds will not be available for your use. A valid driver’s license and credit card must be presented. Debit cards issued under VISA, MasterCard and Discover logo which draw funds directly from the cardholder's account may be used at the outset of a rental to qualify when the following requirements are met; Hertz Airport locations will require proof of return airline flight to coincide with the rental and two valid forms of identification. Hertz Off Airport locations, if the renter is at least 25 years old, two valid forms of identification and one of the following: (a) provide a Corporate Discount Plan number or (b) proof of a return trip travel ticket to coincide with the rental (airline or cruise). There are exceptions; Debit cards are not accepted at the outset of a rental to qualify in Off Airport locations in the areas of New York Metropolitan Tri-State, Hartford, CT, Philadelphia, PA, Boston, MA, Manchester, NH, Detroit, MI, Baltimore, MD and Atlanta, GA. Other policy exceptions: Debit Card can be used if it is already in your Hertz Gold Plus Rewards profile or if the rental is a Replacement rental. Debit cards are not accepted on Dream Cars and Shelby GT-H rentals. Debit cards are accepted for payment at the end of your rental. In most cases a credit check will be performed for debit card customers to determine credit worthiness at the time of rental. If Hertz cannot secure credit approval and/or proper identification credentials are not supplied, Hertz will decline your rental.
Young Drivers
On most rentals the minimum age is 25 without an additional Age Differential Charge, and 20 with an additional Age Differential Charge.

See Qualifications and Requirements for more details.


Need Additional Protection?
Please inquire at the counter for details on Loss Damage Waiver (LDW), Liability Insurance Supplement (LIS), Personal Accident Insurance/Personal Effects Coverage (PAI/PEC). Rate is guaranteed. Taxes, fees and extras, if not included in the Rate, are subject to change. Note: There may be discrepancies between charge detail amounts and totals. Total amounts are correct.
Rental Terms and Conditions
'Total' does not include any additional items you may select at the location or any costs arising from the rental (such as damage, fuel or road traffic charges). For renters under the age of 25, additional charges may apply, and are payable at the location.
US Dream Car Rental Requirements

Hertz Dream Cars® provides a selection of ultra-high end vehicles available for customers. Call for details at 888.296.9124.

Special rules apply for the rental of a Dream Cars®

• Renter and any additional drivers must be at least 25 years old
• ID requirements:
  • Valid Driver’s License
  • Credit card (debit cards not accepted at time of rental)
  • Proof of auto insurance or secondary Government issued ID
• If identification is not accepted, Hertz may offer an alternative vehicle model.

*Driver’s identification will be photocopied, sealed, secured and shredded when the Dream Cars vehicle is returned. Rental hours: 6:00am – 12am.


DESTINATION SPECIFIC TERMS


Insurance requirements and Pre-authorisation of credit

• At the time of rental, credit or charge cards must have available credit, and acceptable debit/check cards must have available funds, sufficient to pay the estimated amount of the rental charges plus an amount determined by Hertz to cover any incidental charges.
• Please note that we will block an amount on your credit/debit card equal to either (i) for a non-prepaid rental, the anticipated cost of the rental, or (ii) for a prepaid rental, anticipated costs of the rental which are additional to the amount already paid.
• In addition, if you do not take Collision Damage Waiver (CDW) & Theft Protection (TP) we will take a pre-authorisation of €5,000 on your credit card to protect us in case the vehicle is damaged during the rental, and apply an administration fee of €30, which passes on the costs we incur from our bank when we reserve credit on your card. We will require a copy of your insurance policy and/or documentation from your credit card company stating clearly that coverage is provided in Ireland.
• A standard Debit/Credit Card fee of €5 will be applied on all charges paid at the rental counter as stated on the rental record. This fee can be waived on return of the vehicle by using an alternative form of payment.
• More details can be found Forms of Payment.

Approximate rental charges are based on available information at the time of reservation. Additional fees or surcharges may be applied at time of rental. A Frequent Flyer Surcharge of up to $1.50 per day may apply when renters choose to take miles or credits from a U.S. and Canadian Frequent Flyer program. Any change to the reservation may impact the rental charges.The rental rates may be higher if you make any change to your rental; including a change to extend the rental, the drop-off location or return the vehicle prior to the scheduled return date. Additional fees or surcharges may be applied at time of rental.

Important Notifications

• For renters under 25 years of age, check policy for exceptions
• Minimum Age 25 outside US - Exceptions may apply
• Gold Service Confirmed - Please provide flight details.
• THE MAXIMUM RENTAL AGE IS 75 YEARS
• Please check driving restrictions for touring Europe
• RATE MAY BE SUBJECT TO VERIFICATION OF ID
• Mobile Gold Alerts are available at this location.

Insurance Requirements and Pre-authorisation of Credit
If you do not take Collision Damage Waiver (CDW) & Theft Protection (TP) we will require a copy of your insurance policy and/or documentation from your credit card company stating clearly that coverage is provided in Ireland.
Credit Cards/Debit Cards
Hertz accepts American Express, MasterCard, Carte Blanche, Visa, Diners Club, Discover, JCB, China Union Pay and some debit cards. We may place an authorized hold on your credit/debit card to cover the estimated rental charges plus up to USD 200.00 for any additional charges that may be incurred. These funds will not be available for your use. A valid driver’s license and credit card must be presented. Debit cards issued under VISA, MasterCard and Discover logo which draw funds directly from the cardholder's account may be used at the outset of a rental to qualify when the following requirements are met; Hertz Airport locations will require proof of return airline flight to coincide with the rental and two valid forms of identification. Hertz Off Airport locations, if the renter is at least 25 years old, two valid forms of identification and one of the following: (a) provide a Corporate Discount Plan number or (b) proof of a return trip travel ticket to coincide with the rental (airline or cruise). There are exceptions; Debit cards are not accepted at the outset of a rental to qualify in Off Airport locations in the areas of New York Metropolitan Tri-State, Hartford, CT, Philadelphia, PA, Boston, MA, Manchester, NH, Detroit, MI, Baltimore, MD and Atlanta, GA. Other policy exceptions: Debit Card can be used if it is already in your Hertz Gold Plus Rewards profile or if the rental is a Replacement rental. Debit cards are not accepted on Dream Cars and Shelby GT-H rentals. Debit cards are accepted for payment at the end of your rental. In most cases a credit check will be performed for debit card customers to determine credit worthiness at the time of rental. If Hertz cannot secure credit approval and/or proper identification credentials are not supplied, Hertz will decline your rental.
Young Drivers
On most rentals the minimum age is 25 without an additional Age Differential Charge, and 20 with an additional Age Differential Charge.

See Qualifications and Requirements for more details.


Need Additional Protection?
Please inquire at the counter for details on Loss Damage Waiver (LDW), Liability Insurance Supplement (LIS), Personal Accident Insurance/Personal Effects Coverage (PAI/PEC).

AutoSlash

Just because it doesn't show this in your confirmation email, doesn't mean that the term/condition/charge doesn't exist. While we agree that it would be both nice and fair to have displayed this information in your confirmation email, as per our previous post above, it is displayed when booking online:

See here --> https://www.hertz.ie/rentacar/reserv...D=CDW&EOAG=DUB

As such, we doubt you'd have much luck with a credit card dispute with Amex.

Flying12345

Thank you for the fast response. I really am astonished something so clearly intentionally hidden from the customer is legal.

garykung

Just for the record - the AMEX rep was incorrect. AMEX insurance, regardless what kind, does not cover rental in Ireland. Many credit cards don't do that as well.

AutoSlash

And even if it did, no credit card ever covers liability insurance. Is this a total scam by rental companies in Ireland (and Mexico)? Yes, it is. Then why do they do it? Because they can.

Flying12345

You have a link to that? I rent a lot in Ireland (though normally on deals with CDW inc hence this is the first time I’ve had the SLW issue) so would be very useful to know if I’ve accidentally been driving uninsured. My Amex policy link below, I see no mention of Ireland exclusion for car rental. I’ve always assumed that if I pay on this card I can decline any insurance anywhere in the world as long as the car is worth less than 50k and be covered, am I mistaken?


https://icm.aexp-static.com/Internet...-insurance.pdf

Flying12345

what exactly is liability insurance and what other countries do they do this SLW trick in, is it just Ireland and Mexico?

AutoSlash

Amex changed their policy in 2017 and they now include CDW/LDW when renting in Ireland based on our research.

Liability insurance, also called 3rd party liability, is basically a policy that limits your financial responsibility for damage you do to other's property (vehicle or otherwise) or injuries you cause to other individuals.

It's most prevalent in Mexico and Ireland, but you can get hit with it elsewhere. We've seen it in Costa Rica and South Africa just to name a couple. You have to read the terms and conditions of the rental carefully when renting in a country other than your own where you are familiar with the policies.