The luck of the Irish! ;)

"Smooth" Rye? If true to its heritage, born from the haze induced by half a jug of Monongahela Popskull, a whiskey raw enough to strip the lining from a turkey's Gizzard, Rye ought not to be too smooth, my quarrel with Texas distillery's "Yellow Rose", smoother than a slatternly tavern wench's tongue. Drinking rye ought to be like kissing the thigh of a "Dirty leg" girl who hasn't shaved her legs in a while, a bit abrasive.....

That's the reason that you put Vermouth in a Manhattan, to cut the hard edge off the Rye Whiskey. If it's smooth you're after, there's always that Canajun stuff, little more (if more at all) than water, grain neutral spirits and caramel.

Sorry I don't agree that good strong Rye has to take paint off a wall. Bulleit makes a good Rye whiskey. I was hoping the Van Winkle Family Reserve would have been better. Because the Van Winkle Bourbon I had was certainly better than Bulleit Bourbon.

Your both right. A rough nasty Rye makes a better Manhattan. Bulleit Rye is hard to beat for the price and far superior to their Bourbon. My favorite Rye remains Whistle Pig from Vermont of all places.

Just FYI your favorite Rye is actually from Canada, but bottled in Vermont...

But they seem to be moving onto sourcing some of their Rye from American sources...

I think it's good, but they jack the prices up...

Source

There are a couple routes young distilleries can go while waiting for their stocks to mature- bottling other products, which is the route that High West and Smooth Ambler went. Or, releasing stuff that is young and really not that great (Hudson Baby Bourbon). Or, messing with all sorts of gimmicks to try to accelerate the aging process (staves, pressure, small barrels).... In my mind whiskey is a product that needs the requisite time to mature...

FDW

Have you tried Breckenridge Distillery? Had it while in Denver and it's one of my farovirtes. I was surprised to read that it's only aged 2-3 years.

Finally had a Woodford Reserve this week, pretty damn good in fact ^

Oh dear... I've tried it.. they are really into marketing.. "the bourbon that beat pappy.." I'll tell you, it's not bad actually.. but at the price point I find it to be not that great ($55 a bottle where I am). They too are engaged in a bit of deception... their product is sourced as well...They are apparently producing but I'm not sure if any of their own product has ended up in the bottle yet... I guess I'm a bit of a purist... I like knowing where the product is made.. a lot of places are obtaining product from somewhere else. I find that that's ok, but I would rather places be upfront about it.. Breckenridges goal is to eventually get to 100% of their own product but for example Whistlepig isn't even distilling yet.... At least they put their unique spin by cutting it with Colarodo snow melt...

For me, Four Roses Single Barrel at $35 is a much superior product... At that price point, I'm buying Elijah Craig Barrel Proof....
FDW

There was some contempt for those who drink Woodford and Coke on a DL thread. Woodford sells for about $30 for 750 ml so this didn't seem too sacrilegious, however, am I committing a faux pas by ordering this? They go together quite well I think.

I've got 30 years experience working and owning bars. IME, it's a waste of $$ to mix anything high end with coke, but it's you're $$ & Woodford isn't too expensive. I've even served Louis XIII w/coke at $150/drink. Generally, I'll pour a shot w/the coke on the side and ask them to taste it before they dump it in. Personally, there's no way I could tell what Bourbon was in the coke.

A local restaurant features a Woodford manhattan and I like it. However, I've never ordered a manhattan anywhere else, made with anything else (except for my poor attempts at home). For $8, I think I'm getting a pretty good deal.

That said, I don't think the vermouth kills the flavor of the bourbon quite the same as a glass full of coca cola would.

I did their distillery tour a earlier this year, and they said their product is now all produced in Breckenridge. Taking a bottle over to Sweden for my father-in-law.

Their vodka (which is also quite tasty) is still sourced.

"A local restaurant features a Woodford manhattan and I like it. However, I've never ordered a manhattan anywhere else, made with anything else (except for my poor attempts at home). For $8, I think I'm getting a pretty good deal."
Yup, that's a good deal. The 'designer liquor' phenomenon jacks sales, but it doesn't make it taste any better. Woodford is a little lighter than most and I find it kinda mapley. I would cut back on the sweet vermouth a little in this case. IMO usually most bartenders don't use enough vermouth. It gives the drink it's balls. It's not a Martini.

I stand corrected; I realized that they started distilling in 2009 and so they do have appropriately aged stock to make their own product. I do understand, though, for the purposes of blending and consistency that they do from time to time use outside product

FDW

Faux pas? We all have our eccentricities, yours no worse than the guy in the UK who enjoyed rolling in slurry of aging cow manure......

The question is why? I suspect that we could line up a dozen "blind" Bourbons/Blends/"Sour Mashes" & Coke, all the way from the working man's friend, Old Crow, to some exotic bottling from a chic new distillery, and your reaction to tasting would be amazingly unpredictable. You had just as well buy "Ancient Age" as one of the premiums, if B&C is your tipple.

Even more unlikely to be meaningful beyond simply looking pretentious are those who order "name brand" Cognac and Coke. The once popular "Brandy & Ginger" was the sundowner of choice for those who traveled far and were exposed to the somewhat doubtful brandies bottled in strange places. Italian "Stock" is fine in "caffe' correto", and mixed with Coke or Ginger Ale provides a flavor not much different than using fine Cognac. For most who commit the travesty of Cognac & Coke, they wouldn't know the difference if the barman cozened them (which as once a long ago a barman, I'll promise you they will...).

Remember.... The reason folks in Georgia often mix locally (and illegally) distilled "corn squeezins" with ice tea is 'cuz the damnable popskull tastes so bad otherwise.

But man can repent and recover from sin. After all, it seems only yesterday that a popular drink in NYC was a "Manhattan" made with the mildest flavored of Canadian blends and "White" Vermouth.

An excellent post as always TMOliver. Nice that some people on Flyertalk still respect "to each their own". I'm only just starting to get back into bourbons the last few years after a bad experience with Wild Turkey on my 21st birthday, so it's very helpful getting advice from this thread.

I had a similar experience with JD on my 21st birthday, but feel that I'm not really missing out on much by having avoided it since! :D

I certainly agree, well, except maybe about the Manhattans. ;)

I have ordered Lagavoulin and soda on the rocks while sitting outside on a hot summer night and the saltiness in the whisky makes it a damn fine drink. When my friends questioned my drinking this whisky this way I told them to &$@* off, as I liked it that way.

I have also really liked Manhattans made with Bullet, Whistle Pig and Jefferson rye. I think the key to a good Manhattan is the quality of the rye, the ratio of rye to other ingredients, and the quality of the cherry. Last ones I had were last month in the bar at Les Halles, while waiting for a table and they were yummy, with Bullet rye.

Mine was with Lord Calvert Gin, so happily avoiding that that terrible spirit for the rest of my life.

But back to mixers, I had always heard that 100+ years ago men never mixed anything with their whiskey, but women needed to dilute it a bit and they were encouraged to add sweet mixers. Somewhere along the way, perhaps it was prohibition and bathtub gin, men too began to add mixers.

I used to add coke to bourbon, then I realized how much Coke I was drinking on a night out and then I switched to straight whiskey. And then I moved upscale and really appreciated the straight stuff.

LOL. In the spirit of the last two posts, I got bit by the Mad Dog on my 21st birthday and never went back either. :D

I was about that age when I fought tequila. Tequila won.

I couldn't even smell it for about 15 or 20 years without gagging. Eventually I had a student from Mexico bring a really nice bottle of an aged Anejo for the instructors in a course I was teaching. I tried it to be polite and it was a different beast. So now I really enjoy a good Anejo or Reposada. I can't drink the cheap stuff though.

Jägermeister on my 19th birthday. Never again.

(FT really needs a puke emoticon. :D)

Mrs BamaVol was old enough to know better, but peach schnapps is not allowed in the house even 35 years after the incident.

Just obtained a bottle of Elijah Craig 12 y/o barrel proof

It's pretty good. IIWY, I'd try to "obtain" an 18.

I like the barrel proof Elijah Craig. The 18 yo was my favorite expression; sadly they stopped bottling it about 2 years ago. I remember paying only $65 for two bottles in 2009...

FDW

I paid about $65 each a year or two ago when I heard they were stopping production. Have a couple bottles in my bunker...maybe some day they'll be valuable enough to trade for a bottle of Pappy 15. lol

Just found a bottle of 4 Roses Secretariat (signed by Jim Rutledge even) - anyone here have any experience with it?

No, but i'd love to. I have really enjoyed each of the 4 types of 4 Roses I've tried.

It's a product only released in states with a triple crown race (MD, NY, and KY). It's the traditional single barrel product (~$35-40) repackaged in a fancy collectible bottle (3500 bottles). Released in 2013 to commemorate the 40th anniversary of the Triple Crown.

I've passed on it a number of times. Primarily because if I'm spending that kind of $$$ I want one of their Limited edition products (which was insanely hard to find this year)

FDW

Has anyone tried Blantons....my new fav bourbon.

Yes, it is a nice one.

BamaVol Jr is currently touring Bourbon country. He texted me a picture yesterday of himself standing next to an old man that he says is the Wild Turkey master distiller. I'm not a fan and don't think BV Jr is either, but I'm not familiar with any of their non-Wild Turkey product. I told him to rub the guy's head for luck and move on. In the picture, he is holding a bottle with the number 10 and letters that look like they spell Russell's Reserve.

I see Mila Kunis is now doing commercials for Jim Beam Honey Bourbon. That was surprising.

I picked up a bottle of Jack Daniels Tennessee Honey at duty free at the start of a vacation a while back. It was wretched.

I'm thinking Crown Royal Maple would give it a run for the money. I would try neither, but have heard from others who have.

Crown Royal Maple? Not Bourbon, and I suppose better than Crown Royal in which the predominate flavor (to me, at least) is the caramel added to soften the otherwise mostly grain neutral spirits of the blend. Crown Royal in our time is a scam equivalent to what Chivas Regal was to drinkers 50 years ago, over-hyped, over-priced and over here.

"Jack Daniels Honey"? Just buy Southern Comfort to mix with your 7 UP like college girls used to prefer in my youth. Also works with a bit of lemon to assuage a sore throat.

Drinking while pregnant?! For shame! :mad:

:p :D

I was gifted a bottle of Jefferson's Reserve bourbon yesterday. Cracked it open at the end of the work day and had some with a co-worker. Pretty smooth.

http://www.totalwine.com/_static/web...36695750_3.jpg

Your craft whiskey was most likely made in Indiana.

Updated brand/producer list