sxpsxpsxp

So this is a new one for me. Is this right?

I bought a set of refundable coach tickets. Then when I was looking at seats after I purchased it, I realized that only open seats were all the way in the back and I didn't want to sit that far back. So I looked at upgrading to C+ and the cost was only 5k miles per person, so I decided to do it. But when I went to actually do it, I got this big "seat upgrades are non-refundable" warning.

So if I cancel my flights and get my refundable tickets refunded, Delta gets to keep my 5k miles per person?

Seriously?

flyerCO

Not sure why shocked. Seat assignment fees have always been non-refundable for voluntary changes. Only if changing or refunding due to schedule change or cancelation/delayed flight do you get refund. Same on all airlines.

DeltaFFATL

You are correct. It can be a punitive purchase decision. It in essence makes your tickets non-changeable - unless you are willing to forfeit your cost ($/SM) for the upgrade. I think many, like myself, have learned about that inflexibility and are left with a bad taste. That said, it is as you noted, disclosed. With the elimination of change fees, redeposit fees, SDC fees and the T-72 rule, etc..., this does seem unnecessarily punitive and inflexible. I presume it has to do with how the upgrade is processed on the backend (IT limitations), but it would be nice to see this improved, as I am no longer as willing to purchase seat upgrades in advance.

flyerCO

I think more has to do with fact someone else might not have booked because the seat wasn't available.

Take for example if you select a seat in exit row for one segment. Next person goes to buy that flight might not since now no exit row. While the same could be said of the flight itself (Ie you bought last Y and now only F is available for sale, for example) people for the most part stick with the flights they book and only change if there's a schedule change.

It would also defeat the purpose of these fees if they could be refunded.

sxpsxpsxp

I guess it's been such a long time since I purchased those that I forgot or never bothered to look. I was just substantially taken aback about non-refundable fees on refundable tickets. This is definitely punitive. I know I'll be complaining if I end up cancelling this and can't get my 20k miles back.

xliioper

Depending on route, fare difference between refundable main and refundable C+ can often be $60 ($10 more than what you paid). By upfaring instead of purchasing online upgrade, the full amount would remain refundable.

Duke787

When you purchase ahead of time, DL is typically upgrading you from a refundable Y fare class to a non-refundable F fare class and giving you a relatively good deal (usually lower than a straight upfare to that fare class but non always) to go from your current fare class to Z.

If you want a refundable F fare, buy a refundable F fare. If it's a matter of work only paying for refundable Y, it's very easy to call and ask for an upfare and pay the difference out of pocket (have done this before many times).

People want cheap F upgrades offers -- well this is the tradeoff, they typically book you into the non-refundable Z bucket because those are the cheap F fare classes so when you cancel they'll refund you the underlying Y fare but not the F upgrade. Otherwise why would anyone buy a refundable F fare vs. just buying a refundable Y fare and paying an FCM to end up with a cheaper refundable F ticket?

ryw

Out of curiosity how does one upfare a ticket instead of purchasing an upgraded seat? Can that be done through the website or do you need to call in for that?

Duke787

If it's a corporate ticket you can just call in (and they'll usually waive the fee to takeover the ticket from AMEX GBT or whatever TA your company uses)

If it's a personal ticket you can do it online now because there are no change fees.

An upfare is just paying the difference between the cost of the Y ticket and the cost of the F ticket so you of course can just do it at booking too (WFBF). It's more useful for corporate tickets where company policy might dictate Y only but you end up with fairly expensive Y fare classes to the upfare to F is a minimal out of pocket expense for you as the actual traveler

cmd320

How far out is the flight?

Since you already have refundable tickets you could just keep them and wait right up until departure time of the flight to see if it incurs any kind of schedule change or delay which would allow you to get your seat fees refunded.

sxpsxpsxp

That's a good point. I didn't think of that. Thanks for the suggestion. If I do decide to cancel, I'll give this approach a try.

MSPeconomist

OP could also look at the cost of just booking C+ tickets now (and presumably refund the current tickets). The price difference might not be great, and pay-with-miles might be possible (if OP has a DL AmEx card).

Lomapaseo

Isn't it an issue of what pot your money goes in? One pot is against fare rules while the upgrade pot doesn't link to fare rule and thus stays by itself someplace else

FlyerDigits

We had to cancel and rebook a ticket for my son several months ago (we paid for his C+ seat after making the purchase) -- I called to ask about a refund for the seat fee and they granted it as a "one time courtesy".

NoleATL

We actually had to refund a ticket for which we bought the "non-refundable" upgrade and they refunded that as well without us having to ask.