RealHJ

Could you not load up your reservation on koreanair.com and select seats there?

That used to work. Just need to get the KE PNR from DL to load it up there.

Xeno

On Wednesday, I did HKG-ICN-ATL-OKC in paid business fare.

I selected my KE seat on DL web and confirmed by calling KE. The assigned seat stuck, one which I must say I enjoyed. It is 2x2x2 but I did not lack for privacy, convenience, and certainly not comfort or creature features like the screen.

PurdueFlyer

Good to know, thanks. Doing EWR-ATL (DL), ATL-ICN (KE) next week. Short-ish layover in ATL. Meeting up with another colleague in ATL who is arriving on another domestic flight after me. Will probably head right to F Concourse to the KE gate now and get that squared away ...

flyingdoc747

wlau

I feel vindicated somewhat... so many people challenged my concerns and now as more people get exposed to the issues, everything I described 4 months ago remain valid... Seat selection on delta.com for KE-operated flights is NOT guaranteed. KE gate and customer service agent will bump a DL pax for a KE pax if you held a seat that was desired by the KE pax. This whole seat assignment keep getting changed is something I experienced during the month of May... I have never been so confused and irritated about where I am sitting because it gets re-assigned randomly with no notification.

I have flown with so many ST airlines during the course of my long travel history. I have NEVER seen a ST partner airline operates like the way KE does when it comes to seating a DL pax. On my return to the US, where I connect with other KE pax onto DL flights, I have seen plenty of KE elite gets upgraded into DL domestic F. DL did not reach an equitable agreement with KE, and DL pax are being shortchanged in this JV.

wlau

No, as I said many many times... DL sold ticket is not accessible on KE's website!! Just to erase any of your doubt, there is an error message popping up, telling your codeshare flight cannot be managed from the KE website and it refers you to the ticketing airline.

The key issue as many have pointed out - TIME WASTE. You end up spending so much time calling this and calling that, it's actually beyond ridiculous. I don't know about most of you, I am generally really busy days before taking off for a international business trip, I don't have this kind of time to spent on the phone and it's crazy that DL expect us to do that...

RealHJ

Oh, codeshare yes. You have to book KE flights under the KE flight number for things to work more normally. Codeshares, not just with KE but in general, are a recipe for trouble. That being said, even KE coded flights, if no KE ticket and no KE FF # on there, things don't really work that well, if at all, as of late.

That being said, I agree that the KE service levels in general have went way, way down (right after the nut-gate there has been no more reason for the KE staff to try to deliver the previously high level of service), catering is horrible (you will go hungry in J or Y), lounges, even at ICN, are disappointing to say the least (scaled back food; but then again the OZ lounges are equally bad and serve no edible food either), and basic functionality like seat selection for 006 ticket KE flights on koreanair.com also as I recall doesn't work anymore, as if you don't have a KE FF # on there I think KE has put a restriction that you can't select seats anymore. So you either put your KE FF # on there and don't get ST E+ recognition (which is not much anyway nowadays, not like it used to be), or you have your DL # on there (can't save it online anyway, have to do it at the airport) and can't select seats.
Years ago I used to be able to get KE seat assignments via KE online chat easily and quickly. Then it worked on the site directly. But last year or two, the few KE flights I've had, it hasn't really worked on koreanair.com, just dullta.com seat assignments sometimes stuck. (This has been always tickets in X or O - i.e. award tix. If I have to pay money, I'll fly another better airline like BX, where I'll pay several fold less and get better level of service, even if I have to pay like $5 for seat selection I'll gladly do so. Or even OZ sometimes, now that UA award tickets for short-haul are more reasonable priced..)

wlau

You are right! Everything you mentioned is spot on. I am glad you have the sensibility to call these issues out. There are many people here who are willing to ignore obvious issues. It may not politically incorrect for me to say, I actually understood why the nut-rage occurred - the quality is service is that bad and I can understand why a member of the founding family don't want their legacy to go down the toilet.

I have never been so hungry as when I flight with KE. Food is sparse and low in quality, both in the air and on the ground and I am a lite eater. IFE is very weak also. The only positive thing about KE is the seat pitch, which is equal to Delta Comfort+ but the padding is extremely hard...

DL is caught in a tough situation, it wants to cancel all of the Asia routes, so it has to depend on a partner but end up with one of the Asia's worst airlines. I can honestly say the only Asian airlines fall below KE are the big 3 in China.

audidudi

I booked a KE flight on DL.com in April from SFO>ICN>SFO in Business Class and was able to select my seat at booking for both flights. I had the same seat on my flights as were confirmed at booking. I have just booked another trip exactly the same way as in April with absolutely no difference at all in being able to select my seat, so I don't understand what problems both "wlau" and "realHJ" are talking about? Maybe they fly Economy Class where things are usually handled differently. As the saying goes..."You get what you paid for!"

RealHJ

With MU, CZ and CA the experience can vary greatly.

In J, CA has food aplenty, more choices than any other airline (where DL only gives you two choices, CA gives you 6 or more, and you can even choose each dish individually), and great in-flight service. On the ground, that's a totally different experience, with the stuffy airport at PEK and most of the food at the J and F lounges being many months past expiry date (want a liquor? just take some "apple juice" - chances are it expired in 2017; fresh food is OK, but good luck catching the kitchen staff who are supposed to make it yet hide away all the time).

In J and in Y, MU also has usually palatable and better quantity of food (again, better than DL - usually), good to great in flight product, but the risk of crew smoking is annoying. PVG transit is now better than it used to be, but always in China the extra-thorough security can be annoying (once you know what to expect and take out umbrella, USB charger, and all such things, though, it's fine).

Can't speak for CZ from personal experience.

I just would say that while transiting at ICN is still better than anywhere in China, KE (and OZ alongside it) has fallen so far as to be no better than the big 3 PRC airlines. In some aspects its better (on the ground service, in airport experience), in some aspects its worse (in flight service and experience).

GA, VN are in a totally different league, way above KE (and MU, CZ) for in-flight service (on the ground? KE still does better).

fliesdelta

When did this decline with KE start?

My daughter and I flew KE ICN-HKG last November, in a 747-8, and the cabin was impeccable, the in-flight service was good, and the food was very decent as well. I don't recall much about service on the ground, good or bad, so I guess it was fairly unremarkable.

We had a three-ish hour layover, so we tried a couple of lounges and were generally unimpressed by them (KE and one other through PP, can't remember which one, both had mediocre food and were pretty full).

RealHJ

Started right after the nut-gate scandal, when it appears KE management removed or loosened the QA oversight.

I mean KE is still fine, just not what it used to be. But for Y still a solid product. Just it used to be so much better.. (More noticeable for long-haul though, on short haul KE is closer to its former self.)

wlau

I think it started before then. KE has been in financial troubles for quite some times and the fall parallel the financial troubles. Cabin wise, I really can't say KE is better than DL or others, except seat pitch. I actually agree with what was said that KE has fallen to the level of the China Big 3. China Big 3 actually have newer planes, decent service - I think the negative experiences come from the fellow passengers, they seem so uncivilized, constantly screaming at each other across multiple rows, talking loudly even if next to each other, and I've seen someone spit...in a plane! Before the plane is even parked, everyone jumps up to get their luggage, then proceed to run you over, just to get ahead by 1 or 2 people worth in the line. They also show zero care for other people's property, late boarder comes in and shove and squeeze your carry-on aggressively, just so they can get their duty-free shopping bags in, and on top of your bags - FA refused to say or do anything about those behaviors. For my intra-China flights during work week where most of the pax are business travelers, I find them to be much more civilized... But on TPAC flight to/from the US, where most of the pax are vacationers or tourists, those terrible behaviors can really get under your skin...

RealHJ

Until recently, I would have agreed with this 100%: the PRC airlines have newer and better aircraft, decent through good service level, but the on-board experience leaves a lot to be desired (loud pax - e.g. using tablet w/o headphones on, pushing, not following seatbelt signs, risk of crew smoking (on MU, at least so used to be), etc.). However, may be it's just me, but the last year or two I've noticed a drastic improvement in the passenger behavior. Almost every flight via PRC last ~2 years I've been on, I've been positively impressed at how well-behaved the pax are. No one even gets up to get to the boarding area before their seat numbers are called (no gate crowding, quite different from how it is on DL). On board pax are quiet and well behaved and polite (e.g. last flight woman next to me offered me her food, as on CA they really overfeed you - I politely declined, as I was already overstuffed). To me it seems this started happening shortly after the social standing ranking implementation in China and the installation of cameras and microphones throughout the plane cabins, where all passengers are monitored (video and audio) and all is recorded, and of course there's always the easily recognized black track clothes clad security officer onboard. Ever since the announcement that everyone is recorded (audio and video) for the duration of the flight and the security officers aboard, and the social ranking with AI face recognition and all, the PRC pax behavior has improved drastically. So much so that Korean pax are now more pushy-shovey (heck, even sometimes KE FAs are literally pushing pax back to their seat when the seatbelt sign comes on) than the Chinese ones. I thought it's general overall improvement, but may be it's CA, as recently most of my flights via PRC have been on CA (as the leaving late night and arriving early both directions flight works well for connections and saving time, plus it's kind of cool to arrive one whole day earlier than having departed - and in the morning to boot, on the return flight PEK-HNL). Haven't been on a MU or CZ flight for a while...come to think of it, last MU flight last year still was kind of like a zoo, with duty-free bags blocking the aisle and pax getting up moment the plane hit the runway.. may be MU hadn't yet installed the cabin-wide video/audio recording and hadn't yet implemented the onboard security officers.

In short though, while the transit experience at the PRC airports leaves a lot to be desired, from long lines, very thorough security, insufficient (or no) AC in the airports, and questionable food quality at the lounges and overall, the on-board experience now as of late is actually really solid, IME. PRC pax know that if they do not behave, they may never fly (or even take a high-speed train) again; it clearly is working - very well.

Also, at least in PEK, every flight as of late has left the gate some 15-25 minutes ahead of schedule. 30 min before departure gate area all empty: all pax have boarded. I've learned to arrive a good 15-20 min earlier than the stated boarding time, as normally boarding has already finished by the printed boarding start time (T-30 min), and door closes at some T-25 to T-15 min when all have boarded. Again, a real improvement from how it used to be (but again, that is PEK T3E and may be an exception vs rule).

ssyoon

I had a similar experience finding flights to connect to Ho Chi Minh City via ICN.
I could not get Delta to find flights that connect at ICN/KE without a long or overnight connection.
At the end, I ended up booking directly on KE vs. Delta to get the shortest connecting trip.
I took KE Skypass miles vs. Delta Sky Miles. For me, it was a lot of Delta MQM/MQD to miss over 3 trips now to ICN and SGN but I did not want to spend 12+ hours in ICN waiting both ways and Skypass miles seem to be worth more than Delta SkyMiles. And now, I am a Morning Calm member, which does not mean much except for use of their lounge. It seems everyone is a Morning Calm member - do use Skyteam Elite Plus line using Delta DM card.