Originally Posted by coinboy66 (Post 20154034)

So many people, myself included, are confused about how Delta is going from a progressive, well respected organization to a money hungry operationally-fumbling slob like UA or AA. It really is a step in the wrong direction, and we've all seen it in the picture above, the ads that play on takeoff, and the ever-sliding quality of service.

There is another group of people calling us all idiots because they assume Delta has done tons and tons of data analysis to guarantee that this will be a beneficial program change. You are so wrong, it's hilarious.

The people at Delta who are doing data analysis are no better off than predicting the outcome of this change than you and I. In fact, there's a lot more of us, and we as a group have come up with way more things that Delta never even considered with this program change. The market research and data analysis that Delta has done at best will provide an ounce of clarity in a swirling mass of uncertainty about market prediction.

For example, I doubt Delta even considered the amount of hard feelings that have taken place in this thread. Even if you think its ridiculous to feel that way about an airline, the fact is, we will do whatever we want with our money and how we feel (right or wrong) will have a very real impact on Delta's bottom line.

To those positivists who claim that "these are the rules, period, so stop complaining": I bet you'd stop whistling a happy tune if suddenly the rules would preclude YOU from your status. You feel that you've earned your benefits fairly and through a lot of spending and you'd have a right to feel upset. I feel I've earned mine fairly as well, and I have a right to feel upset.

Originally Posted by AA_EXP09 (Post 20154775)

Walt-And for those who book via corporate TAs?
Businesses are going to pay more (either more in service fees or more via airfares that yield higher commissions) so that TAs can say 'You will earn x MQD this itin'?
Not to mention DL IT can't even manage DL.dumb, much less putting info on GDS systems.
(Plus, a GDS won't profile you or BS you by giving higher fares than what is the absolute lowest.)

Originally Posted by coinboy66 (Post 20154704)

I guess I'm confused...if the number one important function of a company is to post a return to shareholder investment, then what was the problem with Ford's decision? I was using it as an extreme example to hopefully make people realize that there is more to doing business than turning a profit.

Originally Posted by waltinsocal (Post 20154005)

Yes, I have read all 146 or so pages of this thread and have taken some time to digest the posts. Here are my general observations:

(1) DL obviously has the right to do as it wishes with its program, and did give adequate advance notice to those who wish to plan accordingly.

(2) It would really be helpful if DL would start posting the exact "Delta" FFP dollar value (the ticket value minus taxes, fees, etc.) of the tickets we purchase now to help us decide our future or lack of it with DL when 1/1/2014 arrives.

(3) I personally don't expect other carriers to emulate DL's new model for the time being. I think they will let DL be the guinea pig and see what the exact economic effect of the new plan has on DL earnings.

(4) No one here knows to what extent the "herd will be thinned". No one here has empirical data of what exact percentage will be "thinned". Is it possible that some flyers from other carriers will decide that they like the DL program and change to DL, thereby not really thinning the herd as much as some here wish it could be. I have no idea and no one else here does either.

(5) The SkyClubs situation may be the same way. No one knows to what degree, if any, they will not be as crowded as many are right now.

(6) Will UGs be more frequent than they are now, especially for HVCs? Possibly...but I personally don't expect the situation to get much better flying in or out of ATL or LAX.

(7) For west coast flyers like myself, should I choose to do so, switching to AS is an easy move. I can be matched to MVP Gold, have Boardroom access, and for that matter will keep my SkyClub membership as well. I can still fly DL as needed, and credit my miles to AS. I can still cherry pick inexpensive DL fares to make a couple of MRs at the end of the year if need be and once again credit those MQMs to AS. In all fairness, DL does have a couple of benefits I would miss, but to me they are not major ones and I could live without them.

(8) Ah yes, the debate over the "M" fare reduction. Some say M fares will go down. What qualifies as "down"? $25 a ticket....$50 a ticket...it is pure speculation that the M fare will go down. What if it doesn't? The reduction of the MQMs awarded for that fare is unhelpful, to say the least.

(9) And to those of you who do stay, what exact promises has DL made to you to get you to stay? DL is now insisting on a given spend for each Medallion level. Has DL promised to fix the abominable Award Calendar? Has DL promised to raise cain with the Skyteam partners who regularly put us through heck when we try to properly gain access to their lounges overseas? Has DL promised you more UGs?
Has DL promised to crack down on whatever problems there are at the gate with inappropriate upgrades? And what about the P ticket buyup to first? And the reduced MQMs awarded for flying on certain partner airlines in certain cases? I am sure many of you can add to my list. Like I said above, it just depends on what you can live with and what you can live without.

Finally, given the oftentimes heavy, and oftentimes justifiable criticism of DL IT, what are the odds that all of the programming will be in place to insure that this new system rolls out smoothly and properly? Most of us here are busy, and simply don't have the time to track our spending like we will need to starting 1/1/2014. Especially since for the first time we will have to be concerned how much of the price of our tickets does not count toward our total spend at the end of 2014.

The proof as to the effect of this change will most likely not become apparent until the end of 2014 in my opinion. DL will be closely tracking revenue post-change, and I am certain DL will also be gathering data on who changed FFPs post-change. I anticipiate there will be many bumps in the road when this thing is rolled out, and my personal choice, although I am now still undecided, might be just to do the AS FFP thing until the dust settles here and we see the real effect of this. And in all fairness, AS has always treated me well as a DL Gold. If the dust settles and DL rescinds some of the changes, I can use my one DL status match and return if I choose to leave. We will see. Thanks.

Originally Posted by coinboy66 (Post 20154704)

I guess I'm confused...if the number one important function of a company is to post a return to shareholder investment, then what was the problem with Ford's decision? I was using it as an extreme example to hopefully make people realize that there is more to doing business than turning a profit.

Originally Posted by CJKatl (Post 20154970)

--- A normal person would have posted something like, "I am very sorry, but didn't mean to offend."

Again, a simple apology, without trying to justify, would be the way to go in the future.

Originally Posted by Teamstone (Post 20155621)

A secondary point, is I don't think anyone is trying to make the point of profit at all cost. I think most of FT, and the world share the belief that companies must have morals.

A company should not kill someone intentially
A company should not bribe someone
A company should not steal
A company should not intentionally break the law
A company should not intentionally destroy the earth (either in one fell swoop or a bit at a time)

Even based on this belief, the purpose of a for profit company is to reward shareholders for risking their money to finance the organization.

Originally Posted by hazelrah (Post 20155694)

What would you say about a company that gives you a price quote, and when you agree and go to purchase they say, "I'm sorry that price quote I gave you is not valid"?

Originally Posted by sethb (Post 20155816)

Depends on how often it happens. Stuff sells out.

If it happens, and I ask again and get the same quote and the same "just sold out", then I'm annoyed.

Originally Posted by hazelrah (Post 20155864)

OK, let's go with that. Let's say you contact the company one day and they quote you a given price. You contact them the next day in the morning and they quote you the same price. Your contact them in the afternoon and they quote you the same price, you contact them again in the evening and they quote you the same price. Then when you say OK and go to purchase they say "Ehhh, the price I quoted you is not valid". What would you say about this company?

Originally Posted by sethb (Post 20160224)

That's not it; maybe they had one, and it sold out just before the one time I said OK.

My example was: I call them Monday, they quote a price, I say "OK", they say "Oops, just sold out." I call them back, they quote the same price again, I say "OK", they say "Oops, just sold out". That annoys me. (Note the Yes/No/Yes/No pattern. Yes/Yes/Yes/No could be legitimate.)

Originally Posted by CJKatl (Post 20074948)

SM is not a program to reward loyalty. It is a program to maximize revenue for DL.

...

Originally Posted by Cloudship (Post 20161227)

They will be loosing customers