View Poll Results: What Do You Think About the Policy Change for Award Re-Deposits and Re-Issues?
I am in favor of it.
111
13.39%
I am opposed to it and intend to be loyal to a different airline frequent flier loyalty program.
413
49.82%
I am opposed to it but will remain loyal to the Delta SkyMiles frequent flier loyalty program.
198
23.88%
I am not affected by it, am neutral about it, do not know, have no opinion or do not care.
107
12.91%
Voters: 829. You may not vote on this poll
Updated: Award Redeposit and Reissue Rule Change
Aug 9, 2011, 10:54 am
#181
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: PHL
Programs: Chivas, Tequila, Good Beer
Posts: 615
I did not say it was neither good or bad for me, but just the contrary.
My life does not revolve around saving 10,000 skymiles on an award ticket or dreaming about collecting enough miles to fly on low awards to Europe. If "it" happens great, if it don't, then it don't. I sure make no fuss about it, my bills still need to get paid and my dog still loves me, so low award travel or cancelling at the last minute means no never mind. Cancelling an award ticket 72 hrs in advance is one of the 10,000 things that means nothing to me.
As a "faux DM" I value the program for its UG and Skypriority benefits where ridding up front is the real treat. The miles are the icing on the cake.
As posted before in this forum:
If one wants to fly first class, then buy a first class ticket.
If one wants to change their travel plans at the last minute, then buy a refundable fare.
Sorry... that's my humble opinion.
My life does not revolve around saving 10,000 skymiles on an award ticket or dreaming about collecting enough miles to fly on low awards to Europe. If "it" happens great, if it don't, then it don't. I sure make no fuss about it, my bills still need to get paid and my dog still loves me, so low award travel or cancelling at the last minute means no never mind. Cancelling an award ticket 72 hrs in advance is one of the 10,000 things that means nothing to me.
As a "faux DM" I value the program for its UG and Skypriority benefits where ridding up front is the real treat. The miles are the icing on the cake.
As posted before in this forum:
If one wants to fly first class, then buy a first class ticket.
If one wants to change their travel plans at the last minute, then buy a refundable fare.
Sorry... that's my humble opinion.
Aug 9, 2011, 10:54 am
#182
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Likely being followed...
Programs: DYKWIA Extraordinaire. TrollSlayer Mega Diamond. [insert esoteric sounding status level(s) here]
Posts: 5,240
Though I am disappointed to hear you are torturing yourself with ERJ's to IAH just so your better half can fly in a true premium cabin.
Aug 9, 2011, 10:55 am
#183
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: MSP
Programs: DL DM, Marriott Plat, National Exec Elite
Posts: 1,357
Alright if i read the speculation correctly. If you book a miles ticket and you are now under 72 you cannot cancel/make changes without some type of penalty?
Why not implement if you want to just reissue the same itinerary you can do that under 72 hrs but you cannot get those miles back without paying a fee under 72 hrs? So that helps with the low inventory issue and people holding onto them and canceling them at the gate? I honestly never thought about doing that as well.
If it is a problem delta must have been watching certain people do this. Put them on a strike list and warn them.
What i do not like if i fly an outbound award but my return is in 3 days so leave fri return sun, on saturday low opens for the same flight and i am F'ed or i want to upgrade the ticket to a FC award.
Why not implement if you want to just reissue the same itinerary you can do that under 72 hrs but you cannot get those miles back without paying a fee under 72 hrs? So that helps with the low inventory issue and people holding onto them and canceling them at the gate? I honestly never thought about doing that as well.
If it is a problem delta must have been watching certain people do this. Put them on a strike list and warn them.
What i do not like if i fly an outbound award but my return is in 3 days so leave fri return sun, on saturday low opens for the same flight and i am F'ed or i want to upgrade the ticket to a FC award.
Aug 9, 2011, 10:56 am
#184
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,621
I've been either buying P fares or not clearing upgrades on coach fares for the last few months, so this benefit of the past no longer worth anything to me. The only thing keeping me with SkyMiles was the ability to redeposit award tickets to low inventory, which I was usually able to do 1-3 days prior to departure.
With this rule change, there is no incentive for me to stick with SM anymore when I'll essentially get the exact same services from DL as a top-tier elite in other programs. I won't be able to shift all of my travel to AS/AF/KL, but Delta will naturally lose some of my business. I may as well earn miles that I can use if I'm no longer getting upgrades from coach.
It's pretty sad for DL that the only thing keeping me loyal is another airline's loyalty program, especially when one of those other programs is Flying Blue...
With this rule change, there is no incentive for me to stick with SM anymore when I'll essentially get the exact same services from DL as a top-tier elite in other programs. I won't be able to shift all of my travel to AS/AF/KL, but Delta will naturally lose some of my business. I may as well earn miles that I can use if I'm no longer getting upgrades from coach.
It's pretty sad for DL that the only thing keeping me loyal is another airline's loyalty program, especially when one of those other programs is Flying Blue...
Aug 9, 2011, 10:57 am
#185
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Likely being followed...
Programs: DYKWIA Extraordinaire. TrollSlayer Mega Diamond. [insert esoteric sounding status level(s) here]
Posts: 5,240
If you actually buy a ticket 60 days in advance, you have the option of canceling it within 24 hours and getting a full refund. After that, while you can retain the value of the ticket there is a $150 change fee for any changes. So, it sounds like people are complaining about not being able to do something with a free (yes, I know there is a cost in terms of earning the miles but work with me) ticket that you cannot do with a paid ticket.
Maybe this isn't apples to apples, but it sure seems like the complaints are very biased to we want our cake and we want to eat it too.
Maybe this isn't apples to apples, but it sure seems like the complaints are very biased to we want our cake and we want to eat it too.
What people want is flexibility... DL doesn't release award seats often until the last minute...
Aug 9, 2011, 10:58 am
#186
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: SEA
Programs: Delta PM 1MM™, Alaska MVPG75K, Marriott LTTE, United SE, Hertz PC, National EE
Posts: 453
Aug 9, 2011, 11:01 am
#187
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Washington, DC
Programs: UA 1K 1MM, AA, DL
Posts: 7,419
I still think 72hrs is way too long - CO only blocked upgrade waitlists 24hrs before departure when they had an issue with fake bookings, and we eventually got them to drop even that restriction.
I would approach it with multiple solutions:
1) outside of 72 hours, open changes/cancellations
2) 48-72 hours, can change redemption class, routing and/or dates, not origin/destination. Cancelable with redeposit with legitimate emergency
3) 24-48 hours, can change redemption class or routing, not dates or origin/destination. Cancelable with redeposit with legitimate emergency
4) inside 24 hours, can change redemption class only. Flights can change using SDC (if available today for award tickets). Cancelable with redeposit with legitimate emergency
I would approach it with multiple solutions:
1) outside of 72 hours, open changes/cancellations
2) 48-72 hours, can change redemption class, routing and/or dates, not origin/destination. Cancelable with redeposit with legitimate emergency
3) 24-48 hours, can change redemption class or routing, not dates or origin/destination. Cancelable with redeposit with legitimate emergency
4) inside 24 hours, can change redemption class only. Flights can change using SDC (if available today for award tickets). Cancelable with redeposit with legitimate emergency
Aug 9, 2011, 11:01 am
#188
Suspended
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Bay Area
Programs: DL SM, UA MP.
Posts: 12,729
Michelle - I think you'll find that Delta created this by holding onto those low level inventories instead of releasing them a reasonable time out. It seems that on AA, UA/CO + US that elites CAN book LOW LEVEL awards. You don't seem to allow that unless the booking is done less than 72 hours out.
If you want to do this, then offer a REFUND when low level award travel opens up within 72 hours and a person had secured a seat with a high or mid level award. Either that or open up more low level award seats to your elites than you currently do. It's almost impossible to find an int'l low level award 60 days out.
We get that mother Delta was being taken advantage of, unfortunately because of your stubborness of releasing those low level seats you created the mess.
.
If you want to do this, then offer a REFUND when low level award travel opens up within 72 hours and a person had secured a seat with a high or mid level award. Either that or open up more low level award seats to your elites than you currently do. It's almost impossible to find an int'l low level award 60 days out.
We get that mother Delta was being taken advantage of, unfortunately because of your stubborness of releasing those low level seats you created the mess.
.
That's the crux of the problem right there. 72-hours may be enough for short trips but not intercontinental ones.
If I don't know that I'm going to have a flight for a TATL trip, how can I plan accommodations, car rentals, etc?
Award availability problem is telling people to take their business elsewhere.
Aug 9, 2011, 11:02 am
#189
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Minnetonka, MN, USA
Programs: DL Diamond 2MM, AA ExPlt
Posts: 938
I'd love to know how many award seats are booked at a week out and then cancelled.
I suspect many of the seats are either inventory added at the last minute or routes where there are alot of seats relative to the demand.
I suspect many of the seats are either inventory added at the last minute or routes where there are alot of seats relative to the demand.
Aug 9, 2011, 11:02 am
#190
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Huntsville, AL
Programs: DL DM 1.929MM, Hilton Lifetime Diamond, IHG Platinum, Avis CHM, Marriott Titanium (lifetime gold)
Posts: 7,860
Get it right, dude.
:-: :-: :-: BEST IN CLASS :-: :-: :-:
I don't remember seeing a list of specific changes. Did I miss it?
Apparently Delta must have all of the really bad customers, since AA, UA, and US don't have to keep making these draconian rule changes.
David
:-: :-: :-: BEST IN CLASS :-: :-: :-:
Apparently Delta must have all of the really bad customers, since AA, UA, and US don't have to keep making these draconian rule changes.
David
Aug 9, 2011, 11:02 am
#191
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Slightly to the left of center
Posts: 3,475
Fishy DL wouldn't think of running this analysis initially to find 1M+ unused award seats T-72.
I had initially supported DL on the change, but this 72 hour rule stinks.
Michelle claims, "This change will make those seats available to other members and ultimately increase award availability" - and while true, allows them to make it available at a higher award level. Big win for Delta. Huge loss for their customers.
Basically, DL offers low end award seats in advance when they forecast low loads. But, if they are wrong, then at T-73 when someone redeposits their miles, they will make it available at a higher award level.
I have no Delta status, my allegiance lies elsewhere except when mandated by corporate travel. But I will certainly voice my .02 at our next business meeting. Delta is no longer a good fit for our biz.
I had initially supported DL on the change, but this 72 hour rule stinks.
Michelle claims, "This change will make those seats available to other members and ultimately increase award availability" - and while true, allows them to make it available at a higher award level. Big win for Delta. Huge loss for their customers.
Basically, DL offers low end award seats in advance when they forecast low loads. But, if they are wrong, then at T-73 when someone redeposits their miles, they will make it available at a higher award level.
I have no Delta status, my allegiance lies elsewhere except when mandated by corporate travel. But I will certainly voice my .02 at our next business meeting. Delta is no longer a good fit for our biz.
Aug 9, 2011, 11:03 am
#192
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: MSP/DEN/GVA
Programs: DL PM, FB PM, Gamer/Trickster.
Posts: 189
And DL, if you're really concerned about people booking a FC award ticket and a coach award ticket, then canceling the FC award ticket to ensure an upgrade, just disallow that.
Aug 9, 2011, 11:03 am
#193
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Huntsville, AL
Programs: DL DM 1.929MM, Hilton Lifetime Diamond, IHG Platinum, Avis CHM, Marriott Titanium (lifetime gold)
Posts: 7,860
No mile redeposit for no-shows was fine with me, even though many didn't agree.
But this new policy is absurd. Often low level awards become available within 72 hours of departure. In fact just two months ago the morning of departure I was able to change a ticket to a more favorable routing because an award seat opened up. Basically a change of any kind within 72 hours is absolutely not possible.
But this new policy is absurd. Often low level awards become available within 72 hours of departure. In fact just two months ago the morning of departure I was able to change a ticket to a more favorable routing because an award seat opened up. Basically a change of any kind within 72 hours is absolutely not possible.
David
Aug 9, 2011, 11:03 am
#194
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: MSP
Programs: DL DM, Marriott Plat, National Exec Elite
Posts: 1,357
100% for this if they do what you said below.
[QUOTE=Vuelos;16888412]So I think we all could agree, this change is fine... If they allowed for a reprice if low became available OR if they allowed for a routing change (same Origin, Destination and Dates) as long as it is permitted within the fare rules.
Correct?
/QUOTE]
I am good for this with what i typed in BOLD.
Allow for a small wording change, you can reissue the same ticket within 72 hrs if you wish to get a lower mileage award or higher i guess
or Upgrade your ticket to FC etc. As long as you are on the same original and return flights
the reissue with original routing still could play games on inventory award, so i like keeping it as the same flights as your original ticket.
Correct?
/QUOTE]
I am good for this with what i typed in BOLD.
Allow for a small wording change, you can reissue the same ticket within 72 hrs if you wish to get a lower mileage award or higher i guess
or Upgrade your ticket to FC etc. As long as you are on the same original and return flights the reissue with original routing still could play games on inventory award, so i like keeping it as the same flights as your original ticket.
Aug 9, 2011, 11:04 am
#195
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Likely being followed...
Programs: DYKWIA Extraordinaire. TrollSlayer Mega Diamond. [insert esoteric sounding status level(s) here]
Posts: 5,240
Or Rev Mgmt has been tightening screws as the NW CRM system has begun to allow them to better track trends and activities of their 'best' customers @:-)