redtailshark

This is another :-: best in class :-: SM feature that needs addressing if DL wants SM to be regarded as a competitive program.

DL's system is like gambling at a casino where the weighting of the wheel is arbitrarily determined by the management, and cannot ever be verified.

At least on OALs, who operate their programs with a higher measure of integrity, if your ug doesn't clear, you don't pay. With DL - you lose it all! And you can't even see the wheel while it spins (Z inventory allocation)!

Why play under these conditions, at this casino?

That doesn't even address the comparative ug costs, which are diabolically higher on DL than other airlines.

On CO, ALL fare classes are upgradeable with miles and $ co-pay. If you pay cheap, your co-pay is higher. But you can still do it. And if it doesn't work, your money isn't taken, you sit in coach on a cheap fare. What could be more reasonable, ethical and fair than that?

DL knows very well how OAL's operate. But once more, their Calculus of Inelasticity philosophy that drives the M-fare levels regards customers as idiots. They expect customers to voluntarily pay - in cases mentioned here - thousands of $ more than LUT - with no certainty, but no probability and no knowledge of the probability - of obtaining an UG.

It's utter baloney for DL to pretend that their model is better than OALs. It's much worse. People post here frequently about this problem.

Making excuses for their system is just that. Making excuses.

Here, with DL, it's always :-: best in class :-:
And lots of people now see it as such.

jharrington

I use expertflyer.com to check SWU upgrade availability. It's very good at helping to quickly identify availability. It even allows you to put a watch out for an available SWU-upgradeable seat and it sends an e-mail alert. I've been using it for about a year and love it. Just this week I was able to get my entire family (5 seats) BE to/from Heathrow using SWUs because of expertflyer.

avflyer

^

When I fares (actual BE seats) cost less than a restricted coach seat (that might permit you to upgraded using a PMU), you know the coach seat is priced too high.

mdb

Define Cheap. If an M fare and I fare are about the same there is no DL value - I would add that the LH hard product is way better than DL.

I think maybe you have had some bad luck - my German supplier gets upgraded as a SEN fairly often - not always when Y is full.

mdb

Did that too.

DP-340

You are probably among the relative few who can afford SWUs for family trips. IMHO, most PM/DMs cannot afford a TATL flight with their spouse/friend using PMUs. My wife would kill me if I paid M+ fares for the three of us!!!

hfly

Motytrah, I am sorry but in themany many experiences I have had due to IRROPS irrespective of whether I was on a M fare upgraded, an I fare or a Full J and everything in between I have always been kept in Biz, whether changed on Delta or FiM'd onto another carrier, I accept you may have had a bad experience, but that is not the norm in int'l operations.

mdb

I have to agree with this - Irrops with Delta have been quite good and I have never been moved to a different class of service. As a matter of fact an Air France agent in MUC one time try to "down grade" me due to irrops - one call to the elite line and all was fixed...

k2

Unfortunately the process inconsistencies and disinformation continue to impact the SWU upgrade process. Called today to 'force' a Z reticket on tonight's late DTW-AMS flight, the DM agent basically refused to help even after I specifically asked her to transfer me to int'l reticketing. She said the check-in agents would 'easily' take care of it... heh, I know better than that! The last time I left it to check-in I almost missed the flight.

So, I quickly ended that call, hit redial, and a simply superb agent took care of it; when the hold time for int'l re-issue got to be about 10minutes she took my number. When she called me back not only had she confirmed the re-issue, but she got me off the waitlist on the return flight. Now that's the way it should be every time!

doglover

It's amazing how badly DL trains their agents. And worse why do they tolerate so many agents with cannot do attitudes?

marcooo

Ask for a quote from the calling center, Delta said M fare is around 3500USD for SMF-SEA-PEK/HKG-SLC-SMF. Hang up and call my agent, 2980USD, all included:


SMF-SEA-PEK/HKG-NRT-SLC-SMF (mostly in A class and I class)

Flight Number Departs Arrives Cabin & Class

Delta 90611
Reservation: Confirmed Sacramento, CA (SMF)
Gate: N/A
Scheduled: 12:45pm
30 Jun 2010 Seattle, WA (SEA)
Gate: N/A
Scheduled: 2:33pm
30 Jun 2010 First (A)
Your Seating
23 Days Until Departure
Other Flights in this Reservation:
Close
Carrier
Flight Number Departs Arrives Cabin & Class

Delta 129
Reservation: Confirmed Seattle, WA (SEA)
Gate: N/A
Scheduled: 9:05pm
30 Jun 2010 Beijing, China (PEK)
Terminal 2
Gate: N/A
Scheduled: 11:40pm
1 Jul 2010 Business (I)
Your Seating
24 Days Until Departure

Delta 638
Reservation: Confirmed Hong Kong, Hong Kong (HKG)
Terminal 1
Gate: N/A
Scheduled: 8:05am
14 Oct 2010 Salt Lake City, UT (SLC)
Terminal 2
Gate: N/A
Scheduled: 11:30am
14 Oct 2010 Business (I)
Your Seating
129 Days Until Departure

Delta 47132
Reservation: Confirmed Salt Lake City, UT (SLC)
Terminal 2
Gate: N/A
Scheduled: 3:15pm
14 Oct 2010 Sacramento, CA (SMF)
Terminal A
Gate: N/A
Scheduled: 3:53pm
14 Oct 2010 Coach (Y)
Your Seating



I also use US Airways' miles to book a business class for the trip SFO-HKG-SFO, the cost is around 1100 USD due to 100% bonus+the 50% hotel transfer bonus

k2

The over-arching issue is DL's messed up system & process which, in my experience, has not improved one bit since DL transitioned SWUs to the electronic age. Of course training plays a big part too (in past encounters I've sensed the agents simply didn't know what to do). Yesterday was an unfortunate bad apple, in hindsight I wish I had asked to speak with a supervisor because that agent should not be where they are. I also wish I had given the 2nd agent one of my 'job well done' certs, perhaps it's not too late to find out who it was if I call back and have them look at the record.

motytrah

Yes, it happens quite frequently. DL will run a sale or match a fare on a competitor for the premium cabin. They do not adjust upgradable fares to match.

jimrpa

When did Delta begin using 5 digit flight numbers?

Another thing to consider are the restrictions on the various fares. For example, some I fares can be more restrictive than some M fares.

I fares can be a great deal if you can accept the restrictions.

DiverDave

On those dates, I'm getting $3092 on the M fare at delta.com, which claims to be refundable with a $250 change/cancel fee.

Cheapest I/F fare on those dates seems to be $5374. Same flights except couldn't bring up 611 as your last flight. 9061 was F, 129 was J, 638 was I, and 2179 was F.

Are you using your corporate agent? Maybe they have a good corporate discount on international business class fares.

David