I think we may actually agree on something.

This cannot be emphasized enough.

Who are you kidding? Jeff came from Rev. Mgmt. He's one of Uncle Leo's beancounters through & through.

I've long maintained that Leo was a product of Delta every bit as much as he influenced Delta. Until there's some wholesale cleaning throughout the executive ranks, these cycles of bad decision making & customer alienation will continue.

That said, Jeff does have some good points -- he's very personable, and he's shown himself to be very adept at resolving customer issues when they're brought to his attention. He'd make a great fixer/ombudsman, just get him the heck out of SkyMiles!

We do have to remember that. In a FT interview a few months back COInsider specifically discussed SWUs and noted the negative loyalty effect that an overly restrictive instrument creates. He clearly learned that lesson and CO management backed him up.

IMO this bodes well for CO going forward. There has been some uncertainty about how things will change when Kellner leaves at year end and Smisek takes full control. There will be some changes -- the free hockey puck meals in Y are sure to go -- but today's announcement shows that Smisek values his best customers.

In regards to what sparked this thread, DL is the worst and nowhere close to being the middle of the pack until and unless DL management has a change of heart and starts shedding its customer-unfriendly disposition.

In some aspects, yes; in other aspects, no. For most customers who earn the overwhelming majority of their miles from flight activity and want to use the miles on award tickets, I find that DL is the worst amongst the US majors in terms of delivering award tickets at the most marketed "standard" mileage pricing levels.

This is "[f]rom someone who has been top tier in more than three different programs over the past 6 years and has settled on recognizing DL as the worst deal amongst the US majors."

In that case you'd be mistaken. I do often look at award redemption availability to/from LHR. I was looking at it today for travel later this month. I had no issue -- but then I am an AA EXP and AA seems to be willing to do for me what DL is not willing to do for me as a DL Platinum.

You are correct. Not speaking of the Jeff of Enron infamy but speaking of the Jeff of SkyMiles infamy:

Leo Mullins was indeed running DL when this infamous beancounter was brought into DL.

Sopt on. The entire B terminal is one of the worst airport experiences out there, worse IMHO than the RJ ride that follows (assuming no impromptu layovers in RST).

I would tend to agree with all of this. I left CO for NW because for my level of flying (200+/yr) there was no incentive to stay after 75k, whereas with NW there was (EEP, SWUs). CO's product was superior to NW, but the extra benefits made the trade worth while. Upgrades on CO are, like anywhere else, dependent on route/date/time. Forget EWR-LAX on a Friday afternoon. The new "invite" level will likely solve some of this problem.

I have been looking to go to AA (due to SWU and companion upgrade issues), but this has me looking back to CO (though the new AA CR7s with F cabins vs. ERJs may be enough to make me stick with AA). Will I sit in the back more than I do now? Probably. Is it worth it to spend time with my wife (who has to deal with me flying 200+/year) in J on international? You betcha (happy wife=happy life).

Will DL lose customers to CO/UA over this? I'm sure they will. Does DL think the revenue hit is greater than the cost (though I struggle with that, if the seat will likely go out empty there really is no "cost" to filling it with a low bucket SWU flier, but there is an increase in goodwill/likelyhood of future business) of letting a low bucket SWU fly in J? who knows. Same question for business lost to AA.

As many have stated, there is no way I could work for DL and tell people (with a straight face, anyway) that Skymiles is the "best in class." If the people in ATL keep doing this, this will be evidence that DL and reality parted company a few miles back and are now traveling away from each other at speeds that would cause most objects to leave Earth orbit.

I did not realize that... thought that he'd come from marketing et al..

I can agree with that.

Why do you say that? Based on what matrix would you rate that? I've clearly spelled out what I consider my rationale. Then again an SWU is only a SMALL part of the picture.

If you've done that much travel and find DL provides you with little to know value, why do you continue to patronize?

Ah I guess that is the difference you get, availability wise, as an EXP. As a lowly general member, getting seats on AA is tough. Especially when you have to find saver as part of a Oneworld Award (fantastic value however).

Stupid question: What's and LUT customer? I'm new to this site. Obviously....!

It's the largest part of the picture. Just go look at the actual thread on FT where this got started. ;)


No use in crediting that many flights to DL since the first half of 2008 in order to still be DL Platinum. The writing was on the wall since at least the first half of 2008. ;)

Unless something extraordinary happens or DL management has a serious change of heart, don't expect me to be DL Platinum or Diamond next year -- I may not even be DL Gold or Silver after February 28, 2010. ;)

For general members of the "new" DL SkyMiles program, getting award seats on DL is no walk in the park -- at best, it's more like a walk through limbo and, at worst, it's more like a visit to Hades. In other words, for general members of the "loyalty" programs, DL is even worse than AA in terms of "standard" award availability -- the kind of award pricing that is most commonly marketed by the airline and its affiliate(s) trying to bait in customers.

L-U-T aka "sLUT" fares are Delta's three cheapest fare classes. Delta has a long history of trying to roll back the benefits of elites purchasing these fares.

L, U, and T are deeply discounted economy fares. Those are the bread-and-butter customers who fill up the plane but do not create high revenues.

Someone who buys tickets in the lowest 3 of Delta's fare classes (L, U and T). So somebody not buying last minute, refundable, or BE tickets, etc.

LUT customers are the overwhelming majority of DL's customers -- these are the customers who buy economy class fares of the L, U, and T fare basis and booking inventory variety.