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DCC: Dynamic Currency Conversion (2017-2025)

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DCC: Dynamic Currency Conversion (2017-2025)

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Old Oct 2, 2023 | 4:19 pm
  #1081  
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Originally Posted by abaheti
Love learning new stuff -- so by using an Amex abroad when possible I could avoid this issue? That wasn't my understanding. Interestingly, Amex doesn't say this in their education link on DCC https://www.americanexpress.com/en-u...hen-traveling/
Yes, using Amex will avoid DCC. It's the same with Discover (but with more limited international acceptance, of course). JCB and UnionPay also do not have DCC. There is interoperability with Discover in theory but not in practice with JCB and UnionPay.

I read the article, and it's a good article. However, notice that it was a freelance author on behalf of American Express. If I were Amex, I would have reminded the author that American Express cards do not feature DCC (and list that as an advantage of using American Express where accepted internationally).
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Old Oct 14, 2023 | 7:04 am
  #1082  
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Noted briefly in the Wiki, but my mother came to Europe for a visit and when she used her US Visa card to make an ATM withdrawal at one of our major banks (the FX fees get refunded on her card), there was a tricky prompt showing the USD amount that was actually an attempt to get the user to accept DCC. It was when I saw the 14% markup noted that I hit 'decline' and the transaction went thru in EUR.

So DCC clearly extends to ATMs as well; not just merchant purchases.
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Old Oct 14, 2023 | 8:25 am
  #1083  
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Originally Posted by mlin32
DCC clearly extends to ATMs as well; not just merchant purchases.
The good thing about ATMs is that the prompts are always under the user's control, and we've never heard of a report of forced DCC with an ATM. The 14% rate sounds awful though!
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Old Oct 14, 2023 | 10:52 am
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Originally Posted by Majuki
The good thing about ATMs is that the prompts are always under the user's control, and we've never heard of a report of forced DCC with an ATM. The 14% rate sounds awful though!
They can really make it confusing though. We needed some cash urgently once and we kept thinking the transaction would cancel entirely if we said no, and did cancel out twice. We found another ATM. Same thing. Finally we ended up getting the money and hit with a big fee. The next time on same trip we were able to navigate it better and hit "no" or "cancel" at the right times and avoided DCC. We are reasonably sophisticated travelers but just didn't figure it out the first time. Our fault in the end, yes, and lesson learned, but still frustrating, and one of the reasons this DCC stuff agitates me so much.
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Old Oct 14, 2023 | 1:40 pm
  #1085  
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Originally Posted by Majuki
The good thing about ATMs is that the prompts are always under the user's control, and we've never heard of a report of forced DCC with an ATM. The 14% rate sounds awful though!
As mentioned above, the first time one sees the message, you might think hitting "decline" would cancel out the entire transaction. No mention of 'paying in own currency' as in the case of buying from a merchant.
Perhaps this is a thing with US-issued cards only ? Because my European bank card (Mastercard) never prompts for DCC when paying or withdrawing cash in a foreign currency- I'm sure this would run afoul of EU consumer protection rules !
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Old Oct 14, 2023 | 1:42 pm
  #1086  
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Originally Posted by abaheti
They can really make it confusing though.
Definitely true. There's an Honest Guides YouTube video about this. The guy was talking about how Euronet ATMs will have default amounts way higher and try to force DCC versus when using a local card.
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Old Oct 14, 2023 | 2:03 pm
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With ATMs it’s not just DCC. It can also be the ATM’s owner charging (apparently) whatever fees they wish.
Tips on Using ATMs in Europe Avoid "independent" ATMs, such as Travelex, Euronet, Moneybox, Your Cash, Cardpoint, and Cashzone. These have high fees. Note that these "independent" ATMs are often found next to bank ATMs in the hope that travelers will be too confused to notice the difference. Their mahcines may even have signs that scream "Free Cash Withdrawals" — don't believe it.
AVOID Euronet ATMs When Traveling While they look and act like regular bank ATMs, they are a huge ripoff and you should stay away from them. And we mean very far away. … Euronet is owned and operated by Dan Henry and Michael J. Brown in Leawood, Kansas USA. They oversee 5,600 employees with the intent of providing a deliberately confusing and financially punishing service. They are essentially financial predators and target tourists for a living. … Euronet Worldwide, Inc. was founded in 1994 in Budapest, Hungary as Bank Access 24, and our aim was to become the first independent ATM network in Central and Eastern Europe.
Euronet: The overseas ATMs offering terrible exchange rates and charging huge commissionsThen I checked the numbers: The machine charged a $4 fee, plus a 12 per cent mark-up - displayed on the screen in small print - for exchanging my dollars….. Stephanie Taylor, a spokeswoman for Euronet Worldwide, said all of its charges are "clear, transparent and prominently displayed" before every transaction. "The customer may opt out of the transaction at any time at no cost," she said in an email. She said Euronet is committed to offering convenient cash to people around the world, but that there is a cost involved with providing this service, "which we believe is fair and reasonable."
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Last edited by Dr Jabadski; Oct 14, 2023 at 2:18 pm Reason: clarification
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Old Oct 23, 2023 | 1:18 pm
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Originally Posted by jpdx
I had a particularly egregious case of the DCC scam last week in Switzerland. Used a German card (billed in EUR) and was given the option of paying in CHF (local currency) or USD.

Now, I hate DCC with a passion, but most jurisdictions seem to have nothing against it. But how does the already flimsy rationale of "convenience of paying in your own currency" work in this case? Allow us to convert the local currency (CHF) to a third currency (USD) at a markup, and then your own bank can convert it to your billing currency (EUR)? How's this not illegal?
The merchant can only use DCC if the transaction currency is your local currency. As I understand it, an authorisation to use DCC is considered to be invalid if the wrong currency was used, so it should be easy to have DCC undone by disputing the charge.
Originally Posted by mlin32
Perhaps this is a thing with US-issued cards only ? Because my European bank card (Mastercard) never prompts for DCC when paying or withdrawing cash in a foreign currency- I'm sure this would run afoul of EU consumer protection rules !
It depends on where you are. Nordea cash machines in Denmark ask me to pay in SEK instead of DKK.
Originally Posted by trmbn65
That's crazy! I was just in Athens and saw 9.5%, which is the highest I had ever seen. And despite hitting to not accept the DCC markup, I still (somehow) got hit with it. There may have been another screen I didn't fully read. Frustrating to need to hit decline twice to not get hit with this awful fee!
Once, a Danish merchant asked for 250 SEK for a purchase, but when I declined DCC, my bank converted the DKK amount to just 200 SEK, so a neat 25% markup.
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Old Nov 12, 2023 | 8:16 pm
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I was at the Dufry duty free shop at YVR today, and I noticed on the screen that there was a post-it note that said <-- Only CAD covering the lower right portion of the screen. I did a contactless payment, which resulted in a DCC prompt, and the note covered the DCC option. The cashier proactively said, "Press CAD."

I don't recall there being DCC on a contactless payment about a year ago. Mrs. Majuki didn't buy anything there during our last visit in May.

I'm not complaining, but I'm wondering what the motivation was to be corralling people toward opting out of DCC. I'm wondering if it was more than just trying to steer customers away from a bad exchange rate. There are two reasons I could think of: 1) they had chargebacks for people who unknowingly accepted DCC or 2) it is easier to remit any necessary duty to CBP since this shop was inside the preclearance area.
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Old Nov 12, 2023 | 10:16 pm
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Originally Posted by Majuki
... I'm wondering what the motivation was to be corralling people toward opting out of DCC.
It must be hard enough to get customers interested in "Duty Free" prices. Sales people don't need another disincentive like DCC.
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Old Nov 12, 2023 | 10:29 pm
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Originally Posted by MaxVO
It must be hard enough to get customers interested in "Duty Free" prices. Sales people don't need another disincentive like DCC.
Normally, I'm not big into duty free myself. I wanted to buy some maple syrup for Mrs. Majuki, and since I was carry on only today, it was easier to make the purchase airside.
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Old Nov 13, 2023 | 3:13 pm
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An ATM charging a fee only for non-DCC transactions

I saw this for the first time yesterday, in Poland: an ATM that charges a withdrawal fee only for non-DCC transactions. If I hadn't had a bank that reimburses that fee, accepting DCC would have made sense, as the total including the fee was converted to US$23.23 by my bank.
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Old Nov 13, 2023 | 3:57 pm
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Originally Posted by sethweinstein
I saw this for the first time yesterday, in Poland: an ATM that charges a withdrawal fee only for non-DCC transactions. If I hadn't had a bank that reimburses that fee, accepting DCC would have made sense, as the total including the fee was converted to US$23.23 by my bank.
That's pretty sneaky!
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Old Nov 13, 2023 | 9:17 pm
  #1094  
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Originally Posted by sethweinstein
I saw this for the first time yesterday, in Poland: an ATM that charges a withdrawal fee only for non-DCC transactions. If I hadn't had a bank that reimburses that fee, accepting DCC would have made sense, as the total including the fee was converted to US$23.23 by my bank.
Honest Guide noticed this with ATMs in Prague. Another note was that the withdrawal amounts were much more reasonable with a local card versus a non-local card. For instance, it would offer $100, $200, and $300 withdrawal amounts (you could change manually) with a non-local card but $40, $60, and $80 amounts with a local card.
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Old Nov 13, 2023 | 10:54 pm
  #1095  
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Originally Posted by Majuki
Honest Guide noticed this with ATMs in Prague. Another note was that the withdrawal amounts were much more reasonable with a local card versus a non-local card. For instance, it would offer $100, $200, and $300 withdrawal amounts (you could change manually) with a non-local card but $40, $60, and $80 amounts with a local card.
Oh, interesting. I had that experience here too but didn't think anything of it. There was a "quick 20 PLN" button (about $5), but when it got to the main choices they were in the thousands (more than $200) and I second-guessed my math before inputting my own number. It even timed out when I recalculated.
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