rasheed

I saw the first use of tap to pay in media on a pilot episode of a television show called Zoey's Extraordinary Playlist. Near the end of the episode, the main character taps her phone to pay for some coffee. Maybe other shows have shown contactless, but I don't remember as such (aside from issuer or bank commercials).

If you really want to see it, the episode is free to stream on NBC website or available for Hulu subscribers.

tmiw

One of the Arby's locations here was recently torn down to the studs and rebuilt. Unfortunately, it looks like they kept the same POS and didn't install MX915s, so no EMV yet (and thus probably still can't mass add them to the map).

Also, it looks like contactless usage is going to be a generational thing:

Perhaps there was something to the people refusing to use it out of security fears a decade or so ago after all, especially if the percentage of Baby Boomers with cards was significantly higher than everyone else.

cjw2001

I just had a lot of back and forth discussion on Nextdoor last week regarding compromised cards and credit card security and contactless security - there is a lot of misinformation out there, especially on contactless. The good thing is I was able to correct some FUD.

tmiw

It looks like the reader becomes active on Clover Stations with the contactless built into the receipt printer without requiring the screen to change away from the itemized list first. I'm not sure if it became active the instant the transaction was totaled though or the system automatically assumes card after a second or two (the cashier walked away from the register just before I tried to tap).

Also, I tried using Google Pay with my Capital One debit card at the Capital One Cafe today and it kept declining. I ultimately paid with a different card. The card itself looked active in the Google Pay app but it very well could have deactivated itself somehow when I activated the contactless card. I'll need to attempt to readd the card and/or call Capital One to figure out what's going on.

RedLight2015

Is it a MasterCard? I’ve noticed that MasterCard debit cards decline on those receipt printer clovers. I had to use an Amex and it worked fine.

The same card works fine on other Clover setups too!

randian

Will they? They're a former MCX consortium member. They're as intransigent as Walmart (also former MCX member) on this subject. They basically copied Walmart's app and QR-code system. At least Walmart's app has the decency to code transactions as online, I'm told Publix's app doesn't.

If Publix were serious they would have installed NFC-capable terminals at their stores in their latest round of terminal upgrades, even if they didn't enable it. They didn't, which means they'd have spend the cash to replace their terminals again if they're serious, which I don't for a second believe.

The way Publix, Kroger, and HEB talk you'd think this was difficult, voodoo stuff. I assume that was intentional, so consumers stop asking for it.

tmiw

Chase Visa at the Clover merchant. Capital One uses FreedomPay iPP350s that definitely worked with MC before.

tmiw

I don't think being former MCX precludes Publix from enabling contactless per se. After all, other former members have enabled it.

However, the same factors that caused them to join in the first place are quite possibly also the same ones preventing contactless now (interchange fee concerns, data mining, etc.) Only they know what their true plans are.

randian

Sure, I only mention it so it's clear what Publix's historical stance is: adamantly opposed.
I assume data mining is the holdup. Apple Pay doesn't increase their fees, what's their fee concern?

tmiw

The issue is more that (a) debit routing may be problematic (at least from a UX perspective), potentially forcing all debit transactions over Visa/MC and (b) contactless could very well increase card use for smaller purchases like it has elsewhere. Building retailer specific apps has the possibility of eventually pushing a significant number of transactions off the card rails entirely, significantly lowering costs. And if it doesn't, at least the shift away from cash will have taken longer than it would have otherwise.

Also, when you're of the view that almost any amount is too much to pay for card processing, that 0.15% or so that the issuer pays Apple is effectively the same as if you had paid Apple directly. After all, if the issuers can afford to shell out the money for Apple Pay support, they can afford to reduce processing costs by at least that much.

ateng

Publix has NFC capable terminals (iSC Touch 480); they're just not activated (outside VA). It's the same ones that Office Depot/Max uses where you tap the bottom left of the terminal.

randian

Ok, cool. Nothing marks them as supporting contactless payments.

randian

How does their app save them money? It takes credit cards too, and it advertises no benefit for debit, like discounts. Why would I voluntarily lose ease of use and the benefit of fraud protection to help out Publix by using their sketchy app? At least Target gives me 5% for the privilege, and I mostly shop online with them because of the free shipping. Publix online prices are often higher than in-store, and you still have to pay a delivery fee for in-store pickup.

I assume Publix pays negotiated rates for processing, not the rack rate, like every other large retailer. I doubt Publix could have gotten an additional 0.15% off their rate but for Apple Pay, that's not how real world prices are negotiated. It's as much or more about where they think they can hold the line than it is about costs. If Apple Pay disappeared tomorrow, the likelihood that everybody is going to get a 0.15% rate reduction for free on the next contract renewal is just about zero.

RedLight2015

They can easily mark them on the screen of the terminal or place stickers on the bottom left.

tmiw

Depends on how the app's designed. There are two possibilities offhand:

1. The app supports ACH transfers and encourages them. ACH is basically free for the merchant (though of course, higher risk for the customer and somewhat higher risk for the merchant; the latter is apparently somewhat able to be mitigated) and is how the Target debit card works. Even if the app doesn't currently support them, encouraging use through other means can eventually provide enough of a customer base to make adding ACH later worthwhile. Most probably won't jump on it unless there's enough of an incentive, however, but I'm not sure what that would be exactly.

2. The app is designed in a way that the number of card transactions is greatly reduced. Starbucks' app does this, for example, by having people load their gift card balances in a minimum of $10 increments, reducing the per-transaction fees they're paying (which, given the typical purchase amounts at Starbucks, are likely far more significant than the interchange portion). Customers are also okay with doing this because of (a) the rewards program and (b) they're likely going to go to Starbucks often enough that they'll spend that money anyway.

Without contactless, though, most smaller purchases will still be done in cash and will likely convert over to card at a slower rate (if at all). In addition, people would probably continue using the card they're using now (debit cards more often than credit cards for groceries, from what I remember reading) rather than potentially use more expensive forms of payment.

Speaking of more expensive forms of payment, if merchants manage to get the "honor all cards" rule overturned, getting contactless payment to flop in the US (or failing that, not supporting it at all for as long as they can get away with it) makes it easier to enforce not accepting certain card types. After all, most people probably aren't going to hand over their phones to the cashier to verify that they're going to use something that's not a Visa Infinite or WEMC before being allowed to tap--but are mostly still okay with doing the same for physical cards.