Weatherboy

CO should do some focus groups and some financial modeling to see if a lifetime program would be worth it.

On the surface, I think it's a no-brainer ...especially when the other majors offer it. I think it would elevate CO in the passengers' consideration set, especially when it comes to heavy travelers who have a choice of carrier to use.

docr775

agree!!^

xFF

Financial modeling alone probably wouldn't do it. At its basic level, Infinite looks to be akin to what bankers call asset-liability mismatch: the assets: current loyalty and business; the liablilities: status for life giving rise to a stream of opportunity costs from diluting the elite pool, but some real costs, too.

I think the effect that has to be measured is less tangible. It is whether there would be incremental business, attributable to customers' flying decisions being favorably altered by striving to earn the Infinite, that exceeds the reckoned costs. That's a tough one to measure on an aggregate level.

But focus groups would help in that

bigboofer

The real test is how many elite members return after status is gone. I would think very few return but found greener pastures on another airline.

CO777DAL

Because Continental has great service. All I care about is how a company treats me. (IE: Great service, good food, new planes, IFE, priority treatment for First Class and Elite, love the blue carpet and gold poles) Everything else besides the great service is icing on a cake.

I may be in the minority here, but I like CO current system of requalifying for status. Being able to qualify for Platinum gives me something to strive for every year. I pay for 90% of my flying and do it because I like to travel and see places. I don’t have to fly if I didn’t want to. I love flying and traveling. I plan my flying to go to places so that by the end of the year of I would have reached platinum. The next year I plan it all out again.

Lately, I have begun to wonder what the point of trying to get Elite status is. It great on the short haul flight when I am flying coach, but on all my longer flights (anything over 3 hours) I buy a First Class or BF ticket. I get all the Elite benefits with a FC ticket, so it can of makes me feel like it point less to try and earn Elite Status if I’m going to fly FC and get the benefits anyways. I guess earning status gives me something to do while I travel.

Weatherboy

So if you were able to get 1 systemwide free BusinessFirst/First Class every year for life after being Platinum for 15 consecutive years and/or collected 2 million EQM's, would that make you want to fly CO more even though you're already achieving Platinum status on an annual basis and already buying premium fares?

docr775

Not all of us that are self employed and watch every cent on the bottom line can or are willing to buy a BF or F ticket on long haul. I guess I am part of the "Me too" culture, but as most people have stated in this thread, after spending an average of $10K to $15K a year with a company for 10 to 15 years, I would expect some recognition down the line. With the current system, after spending $150K ocer 10 years with CO then take a year off, I will get the same amount of recognition that a person that takes his/hers only flight in their lifetime and bought the ticket on Priceline. Ask yourself who matters to CO more next time you have to take a standby flight - you, an elite travelling on a full F or Y ticket, who happens to be #2 on standby list, or Joe Shmoe who is taking the first flight in his life, travels on an X fare, but happens to get on the standby list 60 seconds before you? Tell me what your answer is as he gets the last seat on the plane and you as an elite on a full fare ticket are left behind and have to run to the next flight and hope that your stand by odds get better?

What has made me shift my business to the other airlines has been the fact that since Chataqua has taken over the ERJ/CRJ flights, every CO flight that I take is going through B84 at IAH. Hot or cold weather, sun or rain, day or night we have to stop at a hard point, even though there are multiple gates open at the B terminal and have to take or wait for the bus. That takes out 10-15 min, sometimes longer from my conection time. So if I have a really short conection I am left scrambling across the airport to make it to the next flight.
As ContinentalFan said a while back - CO has a reward program, but not a long term loyalty program. As a result I have shifted my loyalty to airline programs that will treat me at the same level as they are treating me today. There is no guaranty that the frequent flyer program will be there in the future, but after all tomorrow in general is not guaranteed anyway. That does not keep me from striving to achieve my goal.

climmy

So true. Very well said.

I let my status lapse for one year and after having to start back at the bottom rung, there are other airlines that provide longer term benfits.

There is no doubt or objection that CO offers a fantastic product on a day-in-out basis. When traveling on a more rare basis, I'll pick the instant-grati every time. CO provides me with ZERO benefits over any other carrier...Except I know my way around the terminal and gate areas.

Not enough to keep my dollars flowing toward CO.

GET A LIFETIME PROGRAM ALREADY !!!!

TrojanHorse

I was CO plat for about four or five years, then just made the switch to AA when discount tix not purchased on CO.com received 50% EQM. Since I have to buy the bulk (80% of my miles) on AX travel due to business; the decision to switch was a no brainer

One of the best benefits (which I did not even consider at the time of the switch to AA) was the 1. soft landing and 2. lifetime status

I'm already over a million miles and have at worst Gold for life, should hit 2MM in 2009 and will be at worst plat for life (unless the program changes between now and then which rumor has it on the AA board, it will change)

One thing though, you can fly a gajillion miles and you will not get lifetime EXP. This is what I agree with, not giving lifetime to the top tier. give lifetime thru mid tier but leave top tier to the re-quals each year.

I see this lifetime thing really benefitting those who 1. had a bad year whether its job change or medical etc. 2 and retirees who spent 20 years doing heavy travel and now are just doing leisure travel and really just reaping the benefits of what I call the customer pension plan.

Once I hit plat for life at 2MM, I still have the incentive to get to 3MM and more as I will get 4 more EVIP's (systemwides) at each threshold. to me, these are of great value under their present t&c's.

PhillyPhlyer40

My thoughts exactly. I have hit 130+ eqp's (came back to co in April) and have 49 segments on NW. (jan-april) I will now not only CREDIT, but FLY NW MUCH MORE! I have requal'd for Plat. So what is in it for ME?

Yes, this is not "my money", but my job requires me to sit in the metal tube 4-8 flight a WEEK! So yes, it has a "cost" to me!

So...I think CO should THINK long and hard about giving "us" who make plat in 4 months something to "fly for". I for one would take lifetime status (1MM or 1500 EQP's, or something like that) over SWU's.

I too fear losing Plat one year, and then having to "requal" from scratch the next. For me, the lifetime would be a REAL REASON to never leave CO!

CO777DAL

Yes, I think that would be a great benefit. Then again that would cost CO money. I say great service is the biggest reason I patronize a company but two other things factors also weigh heavily on my decision to patronize a company.
• How a company treats their employees and if their employees are happy
• The company is being well managed. (Shareholder value)

In reality all three of these things are closely related. Good management, leads to happy employees, which lead to better service. The same can be said for poor management. If the top is a mess, it will filter all the way down to the bottom and the customers will feel it in the end. I will have no part of that. So when I look at service it encompasses all these things and I will only support companies that support their people and customers. Oh and Continental flying out of Dallas Love Field is large factor as to why I fly them.

I live in Dallas and have access to the largest legacy airline and the largest low cost airline, but I go out of my way to fly Continental. (I have never flown Southwest, but I think they excel in all three categories and are a great airline, but not for me. I have not stepped on AA in years.)

When I look at the legacy airlines, CO is the only one that that excels in all three categories.

As long CO keeps up their service, treat their employees right and are well managed I’ll be happy.

That would make me a little upset, but that has never happen to me.

Maybe I have been extremely lucky, but I’d say Continental has a 99% satisfaction rating from me. I take a ton of flights on Continental and time and time again Continental has been outstanding. Many times I have felt the Continental employees have gone above and beyond their job duties for me. I also treat people the way I would want to be treated. In my close to 10 years of flying with Continental I have not raised my voice, gotten into a confrontation with a Continental employee, or written a compliant letter. I’m an understanding person.
• Weather happens the airline can’t control it and there is no use getting upset
• Airplanes are machines and they will break down sometimes, I don’t get upset
• People have bad days, I know I do, and I don’t get upset

But with that said, consistently being treating poorly is unacceptable. CO has consistently treated me well. Also I will not fly on an airline with a bunch of old aircraft or not enhancing their product.

I read 10-Ks, the entire thing for CO. CO has lost way less money that any of the other Legacy carriers since 9-11, only one to keep all service (feed all passengers, etc) and CO employees are happy and treated better than any of the Legacy carriers. CO pilots unions praised management recently about starting negations early, that’s a far cry from all the other Legacy carriers unions, especially my home town Legacy carrier.

I am truly impressed with Continental service, management, and employees therefore Continental is only US legacy carrier I will step foot on.

There is more to life than bottom dollar and I have to take a stand somewhere.

Lets look at it this way, say CO did give out lifetime Elite status and Continental service goes down the drain, they start treating their employees like crap and are mismanaged, I will not step foot on one of their planes. I would cut up my card and send it back to them. Lifetime elite status or not I will not support a company that has poor service, mismanaged, and do not treat their employees right.

ContinentalFan

I had the same experience as you. I've now been top tier with CO for fifteen years. I used to feel all "tingly" when I knew I'd be flying on CO. I couldn't understand why someone would willingly fly another carrier. Like suitcasejockey, I was very evangelic in my recruiting efforts. I left a company in the 90's: at the going away party, there were CO boarding passes to get it and I was showered in CO themed gifts. I didn't realize I was such a pest trying to get people to switch from US Airways or United!

My CO gene switched off last year! I kind of miss it. I like Continental a lot, but I don't feel the sense of unbridled loyalty that I did for well over a decade. It's gone. I think it's due to the eye-opening experience I've had here on FlyerTalk. I ventured out and tried AA: I really like it. I started flying Delta last month--no regrets. Both airlines give me something that CO doesn't--their loyalty. I spent the best fifteen years of my life in unrequited love with Continental Airlines! It's time for me to summon up the courage and say goodbye to CO.

ContinentalFan

Then Continental is a good choice. I think it does all of those things very well.

bigboy

I'm another ex-CO FF. Being a Native Houstonian, I stuck with them -- I even remember flying the day they exited their second bankrupcy. Even when I moved to the Bay Area in the mid 90s, I stuck with them for quite some time, hitting gold (when it was the highest) and then platinum. Good old days of being upgraded on a regular basis.

Then a few years ago, there was a mixup where I didn't get credit for EQM in time at the end of the year I wasn't flying as much, which dropped me to no status (yes, I did fly, but because of the mixup the EQMs were delivered -- just a few weeks late). I was mad enough to jump to -- gasp -- UA.

Now I'm flying more again -- but there's no incentive for me to fly CO from SFO. The 50% EQM thing was a surprise for me when I flew them recently. UA service sucks, but they do have a lifetime program (and E+) -- and after I was able to blow my UA FF miles on SQ for my honeymoon last year, I realized that SkyTeam just doesn't cut it for me.

I'm just rambling -- I do miss flying CO, but after joining FT recently and reading a lot here that frequent flyers aren't getting same love as before, I think I'll just have to live on my happy memories of CO. While flying UA.

Given CO's profitability, though, they surely aren't missing me that much!

MIA-SAT

I left AA back in 94 when horrible service out of DFW (as well as catching an agent fibbing a bit) left us with scrambling for a room with a 8 month old baby in tow and NO LUGGAGE. From then until three years ago, it was CO all the way. I was Gold when it was the highest Elite level and have remained Plat since Plat was established as an elite level.

I believe Co has shifted its frequent flyer strategy a bit. Upgrades are driven first by fare, at least as to Y fares. A 25,001 mile qualifying silver will trump a Plat or Gold on an H or K fare for an upgrade, regardless of how much revenue the Plat or Gold has provided to CO over the years. All Y's are upgradable, so as departure time nears, the Plat or Gold who booked in advance, but even at a refundable fare will lose out on the upgradeto the 25,001 mile silver. During irregular ops, CO loyalty is time at the gate driven, period. During AA irregular ops, AA accomodates in part based on Elite level.

I am self employed, the vast majority of my tickets are not chargeable to my clients. There is no uncle sugar company to which I can shift my travel expenses. So economics forces me to do what it forces some companies to do, I do seek less expensive fares. So for me, as well as for those whose companies have stricter travel policies, AA is more attractive than Co on many routes. AA makes it much harder for me to get EXP, I have 83 flight segments in my account (and they do not double count on higher fares as does CO). I will get to EXP for next year later this month. I get first crack at a seat during irregular ops, AA remembers that I will be on the plane again next Tuesday morning, but Mr. Silver Y fare for this segment will be at home or the office. There is some point at which an airline should consider rewarding sustained revenue and loyalty. AA sets the bar at 100 segments, 100K points or 100K miles a year for EXP. For lifetime gold the bar is at 1MM and lifetime Plat it goes to 2MM and no one gets lifetime EXP. I disagree with AA rewarding credit card points toward lifetime elite, but I am not AA management.

I will grant that Co's overall cabins are newer, in some cases much newer than AA's. AA's crews and agents have become much more customer friendly than they were back in 1994. A number of times I have seen AA pilots thank passengers as they deplane. More and more I do not see much difference between the two carriers with gate and on board service. I can affirm that as an EXP it is far easier to snag upgrades on most routes with AA than as a Plat on CO.

I do retain Plat on Co, I will requalify again next month. There are certain routes on which CO has better, more direct service than AA. No doubt for reasons of geographic location, service levels or other factors, CO is a better option for some.

Lifetime status is a bit of icing, sweet icing, on the cake for me. I will not be traveling 200K miles per year as I get older. AA has me for 1.3MM right now, and I am pretty confident that I am over 3MM with CO. When the travel demands drop, I know who will get my business and it will not be CO.

I hear the Co advocates state that lifetime status means that the traveler stops flying Co. I am not sure I completely understand why that is a problem. Someone who has flown millions of lifetime miles for CO but does not travel any given day costs the airline nothing by retaining lifetime status. That flyer is not taking a seat from someone like I am today who is in the plane every week. Indeed, someone who has retired with lifetime status may well fly Co less, because she is flying less on all carriers, period. When the 2 MM flyer does appear and get a shot at an upgrade, AA is recognizing years of boarded flights on AA. What lifetime status does accomplish is to reward a flyer for years of loyalty and millions of BIS miles. I guess it gets back to what I stated in one of the earlier paragraphs. CO has much more of a "what have you done for me lately" mentality, and lately means today for upgrades and during times of irregular ops and this last year in the case of elite status. AA's definition of lately is longer term