ContinentalFan

I can't assign a probability to the items you list; there are too many unknowns.

I have noted that CAL lacks imagination. I agree that it is not certain that CAL will introduce a lie-flat product. I hope that CAL introduces a lie-flat concept. If Bethune were still in charge, I'd probably expect it. I wouldn't be surprised if there were no major changes.

CO777DAL

Food and service are the biggest deciding factors for me. I try to always book a dinner flight… for the food and the sundaes!!! I love the sundaes on CO! Keep the drinks coming too. After I eat I go to sleep. I never do work on the plane, it’s too cumbersome. I avoid breakfast flights when possible. I don’t care for the food at breakfast and if it were not for the service, I would fly coach on breakfast flights. It all about food and service, everything else is gravy for me. I really don’t care about the seats. I sleep like a baby on planes, it doesn’t matter what the seat size is. ERJs, coach, first class, turbulence, rain, etc. I’m out after I eat. My favorite pass time is sleeping on planes. I don’t know why, maybe it’s the sound of the engines, but as soon as I close my eyes, I’m out on a plane. Wish it was like that on the ground. Feed me good food and let me sleep.

ani90

One major disavantage (maybe the only one I see) with VS is the design of the UC suites. These are only suited for passengers traveling solo. If you have a companion and wish to enjoy the experience together then you need to be in BF. There is no seating arrangement that allows a couple to share a computer, reading material or a conversation whilst normally seated on the VS suites. They should have designed some 'duo' suites for pax travelling together without barriers between the seats. Also not a good arrangement if you traveling with infants or children.

senatorgirth

An other VS advantage over CO: op-ups from Premium Economy. VS's PE is quite good and op-ups are a real possibility.

ijgordon

I would actually tend to agree with you in terms of the in-air product. I did 2 r/t UC flights this year. My 2 cents:
The flat bed is real nice, but to be honest, I can sleep pretty well on CO's seats (drug-induced of course). As a seat on a day flight, no it's not that comfortable. Kind of tight. The drink tray isn't positioned particularly well (easy to bump). I prefer the CO 777 seat. Of course, I like the privacy of the VS suite -- not having a seatmate.
On-board food and service doesn't matter to me on the eastbound redeyes. That said, I do like the VS sleeper service. On the westbound flights, I've found the service spotty on VS -- a notch or two behind my experiences with CO.

Where I think VS really shines is in all the ground services. The clubhouses are great, especially in LHR. Pre-flight dining makes on-board catering nearly a moot point. And the limo service is great, particularly drive-through check-in in London.

Derrico

The service thing is what gets to me. CO is consistent in BF (at least in my experience) VS tend to serve food and then disappear. Sometimes they skip courses? On several flights they skip tea service or a snack. No explanation is given. I started just showing up in the galley and asking them to make what I wanted. Have been on westbound flights where four to five hours go by without an FA entering the cabin. Inexcusable really.. in business I shouldn't have to constantly look out for myself.

I think VS raises expectations on a lot of things they don't deliver. The inflight masseuse is one example. What a nice idea, however in all of my VS flights I have never been offered a massage. They take your request, but no one ever comes by. Perhaps you have to be VS elite to get one.

Agreed the VS clubhouses are the best ones I have ever been to. Drinks and food are great and I usually get a haircut. The VS theme is very suave. Another positive item, the VS IFE is the best I have seen. The seats are unique but overrated (IMO) and then you add in mediocre to bad service. All in all I would prefer to be in CO BizFirst, but VS has its moments.

saccoNY

I've never been enamored with CO BF food like some posters here. I find the steak to be overcooked and the other entrees ok....I personally would rather take smaller quanities (and better quality) than larger anyway...especially when flying...maybe thats the Euro way vs America??. VS food was just as good in UC...I actually preferred the desert (a rasberry mousse with a cream and sauce) to the BF sundae (which I always find quite pedistrian in terms of sundae standards...Ice cream is so so quality and too cold and the fudge is okay...but that's kind of hard to screw up) The entrees were more or less on par to the quality of BF...nothing to write home about but totally edible and fine enough. I could never say in all my experience in BF that I actually had a " really good" meal. They've always been fine enough.

I took 4 flights in UC and each and every time I had really good service....not spotty at all like many posters here. In fact I felt more attended to than when I've been on CO....they called me by my name and when I left they said "Thank you Mr. B....." (I have FC Gold from my Centurion Card...so maybe that's why) I typically dont ever get that from CO...and I got my message each time I asked for it....

The couple critisims of the seat for me are valid, some are not....they do "feel" a little narrow...and you cant get a true window view without having to crane your neck. And yes the cup holder is not in a great position. all very minor points IMO...and I was travelling solo... so I can see two travelling together to be a bit more cumbersome in the suites. But the recline, or the seat part being uncomfortable are not issues to me at all. In fact I love being able to recline my seat on take off and landing. And I love having the FA "make my bed" for me. I dont get that at home!! ....I really cannot fathom how one could prefer the BF seat (unless they are a person of size).

And no one really speaks about how IFE is SO much superior on VS...IMHO even the new AVOD offering from CO. That is a big factor for me too.


Throw the LHR lounge in...and really CO can keep their sundaes and the whole deal (which really pains me to say) Now, I have flown CO very loyally and have been an Travelbank and Onepass memeber (many times elite) since 1983...but I must give credit where credit is due. And I never really heard of the "VS hype". I'm just speaking from real world experience as unbiased as I can be.

Derrico

They are narrow, you must fly diagonally which can be an odd feeling (I like to look out the window), the foldout table is cheepish, and has been warped/bent on several flights. The seat does not always catch correctly and sometimes will slowly recline no matter what you do. (happened on two flights) Bed is actually hard.. the mattress is only a couple of inches thick on the solid board that flips over when you are in sleep mode. Some of the suites have pen and ink on them that never seem to be cleaned. They are also not that durable. Often some of the suites have the corner of the video screen broken off. (or the whole side keeps coming apart when you are making changes to the suite configuration)

It is obviously subjective. My point is there are plenty of reasons not to like them that much. It does not require you to be a person of size.

VS's IFE is the best hands down..

CO 1E

I've never experienced poor service in the manner described above by VS. Spotty service from time to time, yes, but not four hours without service. I'm also always surprised at the number of people who claim never to be able to get onboard massages - I'm not VS elite, and I have gotten a massage on every flight I have taken. I think they may prioritize by VS elite status, however, as on the day flights, I often don't get one until the last quarter of the flight (more people get treatments on the day flights).

ijgordon

I've experienced exactly the kind of poor service described by Derrico.

ann patrice

RDU has a daily nonstop on American to London daily

sbm12

And I'm pretty sure it is moving to LHR from LGW just as soon as the open skies kicks in.

pbarnette

Sure is. Which definitely will cut into TATL connections for other carriers.

PUCCI GALORE

Sorry to interrupt but one of your made a very interesting observation and that was about pay and supervision at VS. You are absolutely spot on there. We at BA have people from VS applying constantly for jobs. No one goes from BA to VS. The crew that I fly with have all left because of poor pay and mean conditions. In fact, it is entirely possible that the Cabin Crew may strike in August as they have rejected a pay settlement. This has gone to a ballot so all the kissing and hugging from Mr Bransom may cut little ice there.

I have to say that I have flown CO BE and although it is not a flash product it is a solid product and a fair one at that. I was comfortable and well looked after on my trips and the crew worked hard. Whether one airlines food is better than another is a matter of taste and personal preference - what suits one may not suit another. I have to say that the meal is beuatifully presented but I found everything to be over-cooked. Even then you can take the same menu from two different points and they will be quite different. So the quality from the kitchens that serve LGW may be inferior to those serving CDG for all that I know.

I have to say that I know that LHR is the holy grail for all and sundry but I think that some carriers are going to jump from the frying pan to the fire. When the landing charges pile up, and the delays that are inherent at LHR these days bump the bill up some more I suspect that the intial buzz may not last long.

CO 1E

And this is in contrast to CO's BF seats that often do not recline properly or have non-functioning IFE. . . .

By the way, the VS seats are wider than CO's 767/757 BF seats (22" vs. 21") and just as wide as CO 777 BF seats (22"). So, while the VS seats may seem more narrow (which they don't, unless one is fat, IMO), they are on as wide or wider than CO BF seats.